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Thread: 102st/City Centre Mall West - An Idea

  1. #1

    Default 102st/City Centre Mall West - An Idea

    The Idea
    With all the talk about the City Centre Mall redevelopment, it got me thinking about how the mall currently integrates with its surroundings, which is hardly any at all. Particularly bad is CCW's north side towards Bell and what will be the new arena district. So much is counting on the arena district being able to integrate with the rest of downtown, but one of its largest connections, being the mall to the south, is not even integrated in the least. The only street that goes direct to the area is 103 as CCW creates a complete wall on 102 street between the arena district and downtown. A connection currently exists but involves going through the mall, into the Delta hotel's lobby then between two grungy parkades. I feel 102 street can be a great connector between the arena and downtown and holds much capacity and potential that is currently walled off - so here is my imaginative idea to what could be done.

    Current


    Idea


    CCW would be somewhat... demolished. The Bay would be rebuilt as the city's new fancy flagship store. Facing the arcade would be one of the entrances to the bay as well as possibly other stores along its perimeter. What's left of CCW's interior imagine would be built somewhat similar to how it is but with a more outward focus. I believe the mall is more or less currently split where the Delta is between the Bay and the rest of the stores.

    The Arcade
    The arcade would most likely be covered and create a strong pedestrian thoroughfare between downtown, the arena, and the mall without any obstruction. I decided to prohibit automobile access along this stretch to not further the division created between the Bay and the mall. I still want them to be considered one entity.

    Though i do not show it covered in the following pictures, the arcade would be covered similar to this

    image from here

    Mock-ups
    I threw together a quick mockup of how it could be redone. It is very rough, shows little detail of how it would be experienced, but rather emphasizes on the new path created. (All the 'buildings' are simply place holders and are not meant to indicate any form of how it would be redone). I placed Calgary's Centennial Place as place holders where the 2 parkades currently sit.

    Looking North on 102 Street
    Now


    After


    Looking South on 102 Street
    Now


    After


    Now


    After


    I am going to reiterate the fact that the buildings are simply placeholders and that the 'towers lack setbacks from the curb' etc.. is not what I wish to discuss, but rather the idea of extending 102street through.

    Please let me know what you think and your ideas on how to accomplish further integration between the 2 areas. Look forward to the responses! Be imaginative

    all the models were downloaded from Google 3D Warehouse and the Edmonton buildings were all done by Newfangled

  2. #2

    Default

    Great effort there perspective. I was thinking on the same line... The only difference was north/south (102st.) would all be glassed ( similiar to board walk), bit would have a street ambience feel to it. My gut feeling tells me, once the arena is a go, the exterior of that mall will transform.

  3. #3

    Default

    Great job as well newfangled!

  4. #4
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Perspective View Post
    The Idea
    With all the talk about the City Centre Mall redevelopment, it got me thinking about how the mall currently integrates with its surroundings, which is hardly any at all. Particularly bad is CCW's north side towards Bell and what will be the new arena district. So much is counting on the arena district being able to integrate with the rest of downtown, but one of its largest connections, being the mall to the south, is not even integrated in the least. The only street that goes direct to the area is 103 as CCW creates a complete wall on 102 street between the arena district and downtown. A connection currently exists but involves going through the mall, into the Delta hotel's lobby then between two grungy parkades. I feel 102 street can be a great connector between the arena and downtown and holds much capacity and potential that is currently walled off - so here is my imaginative idea to what could be done.

    Current


    Idea


    CCW would be somewhat... demolished. The Bay would be rebuilt as the city's new fancy flagship store. Facing the arcade would be one of the entrances to the bay as well as possibly other stores along its perimeter. What's left of CCW's interior imagine would be built somewhat similar to how it is but with a more outward focus. I believe the mall is more or less currently split where the Delta is between the Bay and the rest of the stores.

    The Arcade
    The arcade would most likely be covered and create a strong pedestrian thoroughfare between downtown, the arena, and the mall without any obstruction. I decided to prohibit automobile access along this stretch to not further the division created between the Bay and the mall. I still want them to be considered one entity.

    Though i do not show it covered in the following pictures, the arcade would be covered similar to this

    image from here

    Mock-ups
    I threw together a quick mockup of how it could be redone. It is very rough, shows little detail of how it would be experienced, but rather emphasizes on the new path created. (All the 'buildings' are simply place holders and are not meant to indicate any form of how it would be redone). I placed Calgary's Centennial Place as place holders where the 2 parkades currently sit.

    Looking North on 102 Street
    Now


    After


    Looking South on 102 Street
    Now


    After


    Now


    After


    I am going to reiterate the fact that the buildings are simply placeholders and that the 'towers lack setbacks from the curb' etc.. is not what I wish to discuss, but rather the idea of extending 102street through.

    Please let me know what you think and your ideas on how to accomplish further integration between the 2 areas. Look forward to the responses! Be imaginative

    all the models were downloaded from Google 3D Warehouse and the Edmonton buildings were all done by Newfangled

    sell your idea to the city hall.
    Edmonton Rocks Rocks Rocks

  5. #5

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    Looks like you put in a recreated Tegler Building in the first "after" pic ?

  6. #6
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    I like the idea of an arcade along 102 Street at City Centre West, as 102 Street was originally supposed to be built as an arcade back in the 1980s. Perhaps remodeling the City Centre mall's entrance as an arcade arch, and finding a way to build a skylight would make a real difference, something like the south entrance in HUB Mall. Perhaps there could be a similar entrance at 100 A Street.
    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

  7. #7

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    There is a skylight there already; simple modification. If this idea is a sell and they were smart, keep the street glassed in with each end having a retractable glass door-garage. Voila, farmer's market permanent home is solved- winter and summer.

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rseven View Post
    Looks like you put in a recreated Tegler Building in the first "after" pic ?
    Yes! thought it'd look good

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I like the idea of an arcade along 102 Street at City Centre West, as 102 Street was originally supposed to be built as an arcade back in the 1980s. Perhaps remodeling the City Centre mall's entrance as an arcade arch, and finding a way to build a skylight would make a real difference, something like the south entrance in HUB Mall. Perhaps there could be a similar entrance at 100 A Street.
    Ah yes! thanks for reminding me, I remember seeing a plan for that a while ago, would have been neat had it been built

    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    The only difference was north/south (102st.) would all be glassed ( similiar to board walk), bit would have a street ambience feel to it.
    I considered that, but i thought even the slightest barrier (even if just a set of doors) would still keep that disconnect intact. I guess it would definitely depend on how well it was used as a thoroughfare. I went with keeping both ends open to perhaps help ease into the idea of street shopping even in the winter time (sheltered from snow/salt/etc but still cold)

    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    There is a skylight there already; simple modification. If this idea is a sell and they were smart, keep the street glassed in with each end having a retractable glass door-garage. Voila, farmer's market permanent home is solved- winter and summer.
    great idea, I like the retractable door thought!

  9. #9
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    I like this so much that this thread should belong in the Great Ideas for a Greater Edmonton section!
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    I like this so much that this thread should belong in the Great Ideas for a Greater Edmonton section!
    Thank you!

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    My gut feeling tells me, once the arena is a go, the exterior of that mall will transform.
    I truly hope so, regardless of how well the arena's developments play out, the north side of CCW seems like a major hindrance that needs to be dealt with

  12. #12
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    Excellent work here

  13. #13
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    Pass it along to Oxford... Something tells me this is about as likely as me personally flapping my arms and flying to the moon. But definitely worth passing your idea along to those who manage the property.

  14. #14

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    The worst is a polite,'no thank you.' Revise it with additional ideas that fellow forumers contributed and hand it in.

  15. #15

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    oh yes cuz delta is really going to want there hotel destroyed and parking is limited enough and you want to destroy 2 parkades are you insane?

  16. #16

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    Have you taken time and observed that mall from the 102st entrance? If so, throw in your imagination. The floor directly above is the bay and not the hotel; remove that and add support to the hotel floor:

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by darkmagnoblade View Post
    parking is limited enough and you want to destroy 2 parkades
    Well seeing as parking can be done underground, just imagine that there is underground parking under all that.. even more than exists now. in fact imagine its the largest underground parkade in the world.
    Quote Originally Posted by darkmagnoblade View Post
    are you insane?
    nope, not insane, just think there can be better fronting to the arena district than this.


  18. #18

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    Bump.

    Just saw this now, after thread searching for the current CCM discussion.

    Must say I love this vision, hope we get some steps closer to it in the next few years.

    Not sure about the 102 Street re-opening being financially interesting to the developer, but I could see the other aspects of this plan happening eventually.

    Well done!
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  19. #19

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    Whats pictured above is a money-printer...there needs to be massive incentive to redevelop these things to C2E standards. If anything, I wouldn't be surprised if redevelopment just meant adding more floors to it

  20. #20

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    ^ oh for sure, especially for the two years Rogers Place is open but ICE District parking is not. After ICE Parking opens in 2018, CCM's parking will become less profitable. Then two years after that the Millwoods Valley Line leg should open and parking will take another step down.

    And all along the way, however much money it makes now would be exactly the same if it were underground.

    If it were me, start demolishing either the West Parkade (which I think makes the better connection with ICE District) or the 102 Street parkade no earlier than 2018, but no later than 2021 and have the mall join ICE District with a tower above and the same size of parkade below.

    The remaining parkade should be moved underground as well at some future date when it's justified, but is much less strategic than the first one.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  21. #21
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    There are so many possibilities they could do for this area, but I would love to see the street opened up again. Of course I would just be happen to see the west parkade changed to interact better with the street as it is no longer tucked away behind the mall, it is now front and center to the Ice District.
    LRT is our future, time to push forward.

  22. #22
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    Just throwing it out there - the parkade space could be a prime contender for an innovative new parkade design. Say a 6-7 story parkade with a facade that looks like a building, with 2-3 story of street fronting retail on the bottom.

    Activate the street with the retail, and make a killing from parking during hockey games.

  23. #23

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    ^ I think the parking is only going to be in the windfall range until 2018 when ICE District parking opens up, and certainly not past 2020 when the Valley Line Phase One opens.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

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