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Thread: Yellowhead Trail | Discussion

  1. #101

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cured
    Speak for yourselves. I believe i am still entitled to an opinion, right? The forum is for sharing ideas, not forcing your will on people.
    Nobody is preventing you from expressing your opinion. Some people are of different opinions, and my opinion has been known to sway, given new sets of information.

    Please, carry on, this is a healthy debate.

  2. #102
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    Just a random thought: Could the Yellowhead be turned into a toll road to help pay for upgrades?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbon-14
    Just a random thought: Could the Yellowhead be turned into a toll road to help pay for upgrades?
    Of course it could, but it would be political suicide.

    It would also impose unacceptable traffic loads on neighboring communities unless alternate roads are built first. Then it becomes a question of which solution would be simpler and less costly.

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    Probably right but I can't help but think it would be possible if they sold it right. If people really want these upgrades they're going to have to pay one way or another. The way the yellowhead is now I try to avoid it altogether.

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    An even better solution than tolls (and this bears repeating):
    If the provincial government is now responsible for upgrading and maintaining Deerfoot Trail instead of the City of Calgary, then they should do the same for Yellowhead Trail.
    Or even better, the federal government should take responsibility for the upgrading and maintenance of the entire Trans-Canada Highway system, including the Yellowhead.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards
    Nobody is preventing you from expressing your opinion. Some people are of different opinions, and my opinion has been known to sway, given new sets of information.

    Please, carry on, this is a healthy debate.
    No problem, but i just reacted a bit when i read this remark from you...

    just trying to play out the options for everyone else to slowly realize this isn't an option at all

    Sorry if i over reacted.



    Some further points to consider to support my case for a 113/107 street connector accross the Yellowhead are...

    -The ongoing development of the Greisbach neighbourhood over the next ten years which is projected to add over 10,000 new residents (2500-3500 new families) putting more vehicle pressure on 97th and 127th streets.

    -The opportunity to revitalize/invigorate the Calder/kensington/Lauderdale neighbourhoods. Not to say that these neighbourhoods are run-down or impoverished, but just looking a little tired. A new connector road to the NAIT/Kingsway/Royal Alex nodes could help raise the profile of these neghbourhoods.

    -Neighbourhoods south of the Whitemud have considerably more access points into the inner city than those North of the Yellowhead. Yes I have southsider envy sometimes.

    -The Yellowhead is a barrier similar to that of the North Saskatchewan River - Not all of us want to get on it, we just want to get accross it.



    Those were some pretty good fireworks! Happy New Year!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwells
    In the meantime, I think that YH would be better served with the median at 107 Street fully closed and the lights removed.
    I would agree, except that there is inadequate space to build a merge lane for east bound cars coming off 107th street. So the lights have to be there for safety purposes - atleast for eastbound YH traffic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cured
    I would agree, except that there is inadequate space to build a merge lane for east bound cars coming off 107th street. So the lights have to be there for safety purposes - atleast for eastbound YH traffic.
    Good point. What if we don't try to do too many things at once.

    If the traffic from 107 were not allowed to access YH until after the lights on 97 Street much of the hazard would be removed.

  9. #109

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cured
    -Neighbourhoods south of the Whitemud have considerably more access points into the inner city than those North of the Yellowhead. Yes I have southsider envy sometimes.
    I know your feeling. It seems to be the emphasis at the moment to promote and develop the Southside even more, pushing LRT out further for even more new South neighborhoods, etc. Wealth, new facilities, and infrastructure are definitley continuing to move south, the state of the Yellowhead relative to Whitemud illustrates this is not a new thing. If the push continues I may have to end up biting the commuter bullet from the South too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwells
    If the traffic from 107 were not allowed to access YH until after the lights on 97 Street much of the hazard would be removed.
    I think there is probably enough room between 107th and 97th street for merging, but what i meant was that there doesn't look to be enough room to build a merge lane because of the proximity of the graveyard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey
    An even better solution than tolls (and this bears repeating):
    If the provincial government is now responsible for upgrading and maintaining Deerfoot Trail instead of the City of Calgary, then they should do the same for Yellowhead Trail.
    Or even better, the federal government should take responsibility for the upgrading and maintenance of the entire Trans-Canada Highway system, including the Yellowhead.
    The provincial government is responsible for the sherwood park freeway though. The reason the yellowhead is the city's, from what I understand, is that they didn't want to give the Province 100% control of it, which is what the Province wanted (ie. so that they could build it how they wanted & not to accomodate businesses like it does now).

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    The city has posted some information on their site, they plan to add a lane here and there create a jug handle at 127th Street, like that will solve any problems.

    Between 156th and St Albert they need to do some serious rethinking

    149th Street partial diamond ramps from west
    connecting to
    142nd Street partial diamond ramps from east
    127th diamond or SPUI
    124th 2 lane connetor to 127th street run it under the existing railway bridges
    Bush Pilot road/CN yard access, right on/right off only
    107th Street right on/right off ramps only

  13. #113
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    The city has posted some information on their site, they plan to add a lane here and there create a jug handle at 127th Street, like that will solve any problems.

    No kidding. What crackerjack box do Edmonton's traffic engineers get other degree from?

    How about this for a mandate - "other than maintenence and surface repairs, not one penny will be spent on Yellowhead Trail for anything, ANYTHING other than grade seperation."

    Do you think they might get that?

  14. #114

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    I would think this is only a temporary 'solution'

    What would you rather have? A Jug handle can work while in the mean time until real funding for an interchange is available.

    Jug handle cost? Maybe a million. New diamond interchange? 100 M +

    It's easy being a armchair traffic engineer, but when it comes to the real deal, I doubt any of you would be saying the things you say.

    Certainly, we can't build every friggen interchange in this city that is needed overnight, but some of you would expect this, and expect it done with no increases to taxes.

    Good grief, McBoo, are you a certified engineer yourself?

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    what i know is that the city plans on having a 3 lane left turning lane from YH trail going northbound on 127 street. planning is already in the works. not sure what else is planned though.

    This intersection has desperatly needed an overpass for the past 15 years, so IMO anything less is a waste of time and money.

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    Good grief, McBoo, are you a certified engineer yourself?

    To be honest - no. But I know enough to rate finishing Yellowhead ahead of widening the Quesnell Bridge. But we're going to get the latter first, at your $100 million plus.

    btw, before you comment on an Oilers game, I assume you're a certified coach.....

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    Illustrating my complete ignorance of descriptions of this nature, can someone tell me what a 'jug handle' is? I'm trying to visualize one for 127th.
    Almost always open to debate...

  18. #118
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    A jug handle is like the W-Sturn at yellowhead &142, or N-W @ YH and 97. Essentially like a single lobe of a cloverleaf, but without grade separation. Three rights make a left, and all that.

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    Got it. Thanks!
    Almost always open to debate...

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    I called City Transportation a couple of weeks ago about a number of intersections along the Yellowhead Trail and also the 17 street and the Whitemud Drive interchange to see if anything new was in the works. The fellow I spoke to (and I didn't get his name) said there are no interchanges planned for the Yellowhead anytime soon, in fact, he said that there is no chance the Yellowhead will be a free flowing freeway in his lifetime. 17 street and Whitemud Drive is not in the plans either for about the next 4-5 years. I don't get it......

  21. #121

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug
    The fellow I spoke to (and I didn't get his name) said there are no interchanges planned for the Yellowhead anytime soon, in fact, he said that there is no chance the Yellowhead will be a free flowing freeway in his lifetime.
    This isn't really that surprising or new Doug, it is patently obvious that the Yellowhead has not been as high a priority as other parts of town, a quick comparison between the Yellowhead and Whitemud shows this (my guess is that the commercial / industrial businesses on the Yellowhead played a role in this, with their need to preserve access). The great "hope" now seems to be that the AH will "fix" many of the problems. Until the North half of the AH is built, and the effects of it studied, I doubt there will be much action on the Yellowhead.

    I suspect that there will be a lot more influence to make new North neighborhoods (around Leons, closer to AH, past Clareview, etc.) desirable (given all the development / money being invested), than there will be to improve the Yellowhead. Neighborhoods close to Yellowhead may just get bypassed (much like I suspect 118 avenue was long ago). In saying that, I hope this is not the case, possible projects near the Muni, Belvedere, etc. could help things. But at the end of the day, location drives development, and development drives infrastructure.

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    I think if the city could develop around 66 Street or 149 Street, then interchanges would be worth the investment. The Yellowhead should be non-stop from the east city limit to 97 Street, and again from St. Albert Trail to the west city limit. The area around 127 Street will be a mess.

    However, it may be better to wait to see what the truck traffic will be like when Anthony Henday Drive is extended to Manning Freeway.

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    I would like to see the Yellowhead Trail, Whitemud Drive and Anthony Henday all freeflow in the next 5 years (I know it will not happen). Could someone explain the logic to me in finishing the Whitemud except for the 17 street interchange, and then putting in a new neighbourhood, complete with numerous big box stores right next to that intersection? Or how about putting in interchanges at 82 street and 97 street and then putting up a set of lights at 89 street? It makes absolutely no sense. The Yellowhead could be fixed by closing down an intersection (89 street) and re-designing the access on a number of others (124 st, 142 st and 107 st). You would only need overpasses at 127 st and 149 st. I'm not sure what they should do with Bush pilot Road.

  24. #124
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    I'm suprised to read that people are expecting a change with Henday north. The distance is more than 40 blocks, and all the industry near the yellowhead will have no use for Henday. I suggested a wait&see what henday does for 23 & gateway, I was shouted down and eventually proved wrong, but that henday is only 10 blocks away. If SE henday had no effect on that intersection I sincerely doubt that N henhay will have any significant effect on yellowhead. Whatever effect it does have, the growth over the time that it will take to complete the Henday from YH to YH will replace any traffic diverted north, so with henday completed in 6-7 years at best we will have traffic equal to today on YH trail.

  25. #125

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    henday north will be key for Trucks and other traffic going in and out of fort sask, Alberta industrial heartland and other such areas

    17 st/ whitemud I hear will be getting done in the next few years. As to why it wasn't done already? Mainly cause the city and province do not have endless amounts of money. It was roughed in, and now that the demand is there, they will build the interchange.

    People seem to forget that this city has/had a tremendous infrastructure deficit caused by spending cut backs, and project cancellations. We are now playing catch up and at huge costs. We simply can't build everything all at once, although it would really be nice to do so.

    I agree, 89 st and yellowhead should be closed long time ago.

  26. #126
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    I think there are some easy fixes on the Yellowhead Trail. If I were god for a day these are the changes I would make:
    - 89 street should be closed. Enter the business district from 82 st or 97 st.
    - 66 st should be closed for north and south thru traffic. Enter the business district to the north from the Fort Road interchange.
    - 107 Street should not have access to Yellowhead Trail. Allow traffic to exit southbound on 107 street for E.B. traffic on Yellowhead Trail. Traffic entering the Yellowhead must go to 97 St or Bush Pilot Rd.
    - Access to 124 street south of the Yellowhead should be stopped. Enter the area via Bush Pilot Road or 127 Street.
    - Overpasses at 149 street and another interchange at 127Street.

    I think a number of these cahnges could be done without having to spend millions of dollars and it would speed up the Yellowhead and allow it to become an effective thoroughfare.

  27. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug
    I think a number of these cahnges could be done without having to spend millions of dollars and it would speed up the Yellowhead and allow it to become an effective thoroughfare.
    I agree - this is one route that could be improved dramatically IMO by making some simple (maybe at times unpopular) decisions, like you have suggested. In saying that, it seems there is not the political will to do so at the moment.

  28. #128
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    Instead of doing something about the Yellowhead Trail the counsellors in my ward are trying to get the Muni reopened to large planes and have been very quick to say that the new arena downtown is a terrible idea. I think there are simple solutions to a lot of the congestion on the Yellowhead Trail but for some reason there is no political will to get it done.

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    It's interesting to note that for 107 Street near the Yellowhead the most recent traffic flow numbers I found are for 2004 and those are for south of 122 Avenue. These numbers indicate an average of only 831 southbound in the morning and 275 northbound. The afternoon rush shows 1,291 northbound and only 155 southbound.

    There is no breakdown showing how many of these northbound vehicles turn west on Yellowhead. Even if all the southbound vehicles were to use Kingsway to head home, it would only add 831 vehicles to the load on Kingsway. Undoubtedly some would find alternate routes as well, distributing the load on other roads.

    Based on the numbers available, I can see no justification for delay in closing the Yellowhead median completely at 107 Street.

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    Those are interesting stats. I should get some more and present them to my aldermen and try to get something done about these intersections.

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    That would be great. Maybe suggest, while you're at it, that 124th street onto Yellowhead be closed and diverted to 127 Street?

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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo
    That would be great. Maybe suggest, while you're at it, that 124th street onto Yellowhead be closed and diverted to 127 Street?
    It's a good suggestion but I think that one might be more difficult because of the Greyhound bus barns to the north and the impound yard to the south of Yellowhead.

  33. #133
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    I suspect that 124 will be used a a detour while building a 127 interchange, dou I doubt full closure could happen. It shouldn't be to hard to close the median, though.

  34. #134
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    That second part (close the median) works okay. The first part (127 street interchange) works even better! Too bad I don't see it in the cards any year soon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwells
    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo
    That would be great. Maybe suggest, while you're at it, that 124th street onto Yellowhead be closed and diverted to 127 Street?
    It's a good suggestion but I think that one might be more difficult because of the Greyhound bus barns to the north and the impound yard to the south of Yellowhead.
    But do either of them really need direct access to Yellowhead Trail?
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    I could certainly see closing off access for traffic on 124 street south of the Yellowhead. N.B. traffic on 124 Street wishing to enter the Yellowhead should go to Bush Pilot Road and if you need to get to the tow lot you would have to use Bush Pilot Road again and come into it from 118 Avenue. It would certainly cut a great deal of traffic from travelling thru that community and put it where it belongs (in the industrial area on Bush Pilot Road). I would funnel all traffic north of the Yellowhead Trail to 127 Street and make that the only route in. It would take a lot of money but those two intersections need to be redone.

  37. #137

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey
    But do either of them really need direct access to Yellowhead Trail?
    I think 127 street does, there are a ton of neighborhoods North of here, and a bit of a gap to the next access North (going east), being 97 street, which is already strained IMO.

  38. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey
    But do either of them really need direct access to Yellowhead Trail?
    I think 127 street does, there are a ton of neighborhoods North of here, and a bit of a gap to the next access North (going east), being 97 street, which is already strained IMO.
    I think He was asking about the light industrial type businesses on 124St. I don't think that anyone would seriously consider closing 127St. It's a very busy road and already has a nice wide underpass under the tracks, so half the work is already done.

  39. #139
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    Exactly. There's really no practical reason to keep the 124 St intersection. It's just a residential road at that point because most traffic is rerouted along 118 Ave.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  40. #140

    Default Yellowhead Trail - The full story. What is it...

    Upon discussions I've had with friends about the yellowhead, and why it's not provincial funding, they have told me it's not because the city didn't want to do the freeway where the province was. The province refused to help the city with there plan because the location they wanted it required buying a lot of land, there was too many interchanges...etc etc..

    I'm wondering - does anyone know what the province had wanted to do back then?
    Does anyone think that the province should now funded the rest of corridor to make it traffic light free, similar to what they started on the deerfoot back in 97 or 99 I think it was?

    <<I also think Mandel is about to start really beating this Yellowhead vs Deerfoot drum soon around the provincial offices>>

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    province should pony up for either AHD or gateway from the city limits to downtown...
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    From what I understand the Yellowhead should be provincially funded if Deerfoot is. Funding one and not the other screams favouritism.

    As for AHD my thoughts on that are cut and dry. If it's considered a provincial highway they should pay for it. The fact that the province owns most/all of the land it's built on and conducts all of the studies is just icing on the cake.

  43. #143

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    The province has funded most* of the AHD, and should fund the rest of it.

    *COE paid for, in part, the stretch between 69? ave and yellowhead?

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    actually...the feds should be ponying up for the YH for it is more of a transcanada issue.
    www.decl.org

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    Finally, lower bids for roadwork

    City seeing competition and lower quotes for summer work as the housing construction boom takes a short break

    Susan Ruttan, The Edmonton Journal
    Published: 1:30 am

    The current slump in new house construction may produce a bonanza of Edmonton road repairs this year.

    In the past couple of years, the city has faced huge cost overruns on construction projects and received no bids on some projects.

    Now the housing slowdown is producing lots of bids and lower prices, transportation manager Bob Boutilier said Wednesday.

    http://www.canada.com/edmontonjourna...54cd93&k=93489

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    I think, if there is any surplus cash available for transportation as a result of lower contract bids, the city should look at improvements on the Yellowhead Trail. Perhaps the federal government could match the cost, should the city go ahead with an interchange at one of the busy Yellowhead intersections.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    Exactly. There's really no practical reason to keep the 124 St intersection. It's just a residential road at that point because most traffic is rerouted along 118 Ave.
    I almost agree with you. But I have a problem with the impound yard on the south and I'm trying to visualize access to the north. It would have to be from 127 Street and there isn't enough room there between the tracks and the YH interchange.

  48. #148

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    image
    I don't understand what you're trying to show here.

  50. #150

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    just how we should already be able to remove 124st intersection, but we haven't.

    Even just removing the left, and only allowing right in/outs on both sides would be remarkably better.

    89st should have been removed in the 90s.

    /rant
    Why these simple improvements never gets done I don't understand. There's always some party that fights change of any sort here, and they always succeed in holding this city back.
    /end rant

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    just how we should already be able to remove 124st intersection, but we haven't.

    Even just removing the left, and only allowing right in/outs on both sides would be remarkably better.

    89st should have been removed in the 90s.

    /rant
    Why these simple improvements never gets done I don't understand. There's always some party that fights change of any sort here, and they always succeed in holding this city back.
    /end rant
    Closing 124 Street access to the business district to the north would leave the only access at 127 Street and 126 Ave. The problem is integrating that intersection with a YH interchange that is already going to be a half block north of the present intersection.

  52. #152

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwells View Post
    Closing 124 Street access to the business district to the north would leave the only access at 127 Street and 126 Ave. The problem is integrating that intersection with a YH interchange that is already going to be a half block north of the present intersection.
    a right in/out wouldn't close access. It would eliminate a set of lights though...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    a right in/out wouldn't close access. It would eliminate a set of lights though...
    But to do it right, the intersection should be removed completely. I wonder if CN would agree to a road across the VIA tracks to join with the Bush Pilot Rd intersection.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwells View Post
    I don't understand what you're trying to show here.
    It's the little red x that has you confused. No problemo......


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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    actually...the feds should be ponying up for the YH for it is more of a transcanada issue.
    ....but Deerfoot was CANAMEX...should we go to the US and Mexico for that funding?

    If the province did the Deathfoot, then Gateway or Yellowhead is only fair.
    Onward and upward

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    Finally, lower bids for roadwork

    City seeing competition and lower quotes for summer work as the housing construction boom takes a short break

    Susan Ruttan, The Edmonton Journal
    Published: 1:30 am

    The current slump in new house construction may produce a bonanza of Edmonton road repairs this year.

    In the past couple of years, the city has faced huge cost overruns on construction projects and received no bids on some projects.

    Now the housing slowdown is producing lots of bids and lower prices, transportation manager Bob Boutilier said Wednesday.

    http://www.canada.com/edmontonjourna...54cd93&k=93489
    Does this really make sense? I suppose you cpould have the human capital redployed from one form of construction to the other but the equipment, other thana few pieces, is significantly different. Even the materials are dfferent for the most part excpet for concrete.

  57. #157

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    Quote Originally Posted by kona View Post
    Does this really make sense? I suppose you cpould have the human capital redployed from one form of construction to the other but the equipment, other thana few pieces, is significantly different. Even the materials are dfferent for the most part excpet for concrete.
    It makes sense to me. Isn't labor what has been holding projects back? Businesses have been flat tick just keeping up - growth causes a lot of stress on organizations. It's not easy to get good people, if you can't find them, you don't bid on jobs, which is what has happened of late. But, all that growth has created a lot of extra overhead. Once things start slowing down, this overhead still needs to be covered. Rather than have staff siting on bums, better to earn some variable margin towards that overhead, at least in the short term - which causes competition, driving down prices in the marketplace (i.e. good for purchasers like the city). Longer term, if the growth does not resume, then downsizing becomes necessary. Businesses that don't make the tough decisions fail, business that grow to fast initially, are often the ones to fail first.
    Last edited by moahunter; 24-02-2008 at 11:43 PM.

  58. #158

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    There are roads in most new subdivisions....

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    Quote Originally Posted by m0nkyman View Post
    There are roads in most new subdivisions....
    Brilliant! Although would prefer just bike paths.

    I still do not see that great of an advantage, especially retrsining the frsamers and drywallers to drive the paving equipment.

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    ....but Deerfoot was CANAMEX

    So why is the province also building a ring road in Calgary? I mean, isn't AHD CANAMEX too?

  61. #161

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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    ....but Deerfoot was CANAMEX

    So why is the province also building a ring road in Calgary? I mean, isn't AHD CANAMEX too?
    Only the SW and W portions up to St Albert and the eventual St Albert Bypass (Ray gibson Drive) will be part of CANAMEX

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    The CANAMEX through Alberta is as follows:
    1. Hwy 4 from the US border (via Interstate 5 from California) to Lethbridge
    2. Hwy 3 to Fort MacLeod
    3. Hwy 2 to Edmonton
    4. AHD from Gateway Blvd to Yellowhead Trail
    5. Highway 16 west to beyond Stony Plain
    6. Hwy 43 to BC border and then Dawson Creek and Alaska Highway
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  63. #163

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    The CANAMEX through Alberta is as follows:
    1. Hwy 4 from the US border (via Interstate 5 from California) to Lethbridge
    2. Hwy 3 to Fort MacLeod
    3. Hwy 2 to Edmonton
    4. AHD from Gateway Blvd to Yellowhead Trail
    5. Highway 16 west to beyond Stony Plain
    6. Hwy 43 to BC border and then Dawson Creek and Alaska Highway
    Not entirely accurate. See http://www.canamex.org/Maps.asp

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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    ....but Deerfoot was CANAMEX

    So why is the province also building a ring road in Calgary? I mean, isn't AHD CANAMEX too?

    You'd think.

    That would also mean that QEII to our Downtown would be too. This would put the Leg as well as CP's 2 yards (that I keep getting told are not going away, yet there is a large one being built out near 41st Ave SW) onto the CANAMEX highway in Alberta.

    That logic also suggests that any manufacturing and refining that could utiltize CANAMEX connections (and the intermodals proposed for the NE) should ALSO be on this highway.

    No, no Calgary favoritism here, just sound logic.
    Last edited by RichardS; 27-02-2008 at 09:45 AM.
    Onward and upward

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    Where was Edmonton when Calgary received so much funding?
    Why didn't Edmonton City Council beat the drum at that time for equality?

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    ...because the takeover of the Deathfoot was rather, how shall we say, quiet. Edmonton has constantly "beat the drum" but you must be careful when in that arena not to bite the hand that feeds you.

    As always, it makes me laugh when I hear Jack, Rod, Jim, and company whine about Clagary funding and the "government up in Edmonton". Hey kids, they are YOU'RE MLA's TOO. You elected them as Edmonton seems to elect the opposition. So, whine at yourselves!
    Onward and upward

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    Quote Originally Posted by deedub35 View Post
    Not entirely accurate. See http://www.canamex.org/Maps.asp
    Yeah? Check this out.
    http://www.infratrans.gov.ab.ca/710.htm

    the CANAMEX Trade Corridor links Canada, the United States and Mexico and stretches 6,000 km from Alaska to Mexico, truly a pan-American corridor.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  68. #168

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    The CANAMEX through Alberta is as follows:
    1. Hwy 4 from the US border (via Interstate 5 from California) to Lethbridge
    2. Hwy 3 to Fort MacLeod
    3. Hwy 2 to Edmonton
    4. AHD from Gateway Blvd to Yellowhead Trail
    5. Highway 16 west to beyond Stony Plain
    6. Hwy 43 to BC border and then Dawson Creek and Alaska Highway
    Yeah? Main CANAMEX route through the US is primarily Interstate 15 not Interstate 5 and doesn't go through California. Check the maps on your link as well.
    Last edited by deedub35; 27-02-2008 at 08:30 PM.

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    So it was a typo, give me a ******* break.

    But I-15 does start in San Diego even if it's not the CANAMEX route at that point.

    But the point is, one of the purposes of CANAMEX is to provide a land link Alaska to the rest of the US. Hence the section of Hwy 43 from Edmonton towards Dawson Creek.

    You know, there should be official CANAMEX highway signs along the route.
    Last edited by Sonic Death Monkey; 28-02-2008 at 09:18 PM.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    http://blog.canoe.ca/hicksonsix/2008..._be_stoplight_

    WILL YELLOWHEAD TRAIL EVER BE STOPLIGHT FREE?


    Hey city road construction boss Joe Kabarchuk, will the Yellowhead Trail, with stoplights still at 66 Street, 89 Street, 121 Street, 124 Street, 127 Street, 142 Street and 149 Street, EVER be stoplight-free?

    Don't hold your breath.

    "The next interchange is planned for 66 Street, but not for another five years or so.

    "The rest ... well, they're still in the master transport plan."
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  71. #171

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    I think the problem here now is that THE PROVINCE should be doing most of the work. Its a provincial highway, and part of a major east-west cooridor across Canada and the USA connecting with Prince Rupert.

    It should get the same treatment that the Deerfoot in Calgary is treated...

  72. #172

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    I think the problem here now is that THE PROVINCE should be doing most of the work.
    You are right - our Province is vastly more capable at expressways - the AH shows us that. If the Yellowhead had been P3ed 10 years ago, there would already be no stop lights.

  73. #173

    Default Yellowhead Overpasses

    I don't know if there is a thread for this already but I drive the Yellowhead out of the city every morning, and I enter onto the yellowhead from 82 Street. So from 82 Street to 149 Street going West. you literally are crawling along with the density of cars and semis and most of all the traffic lights! I swear this is becoming a major inconvenience to be held up in traffic every morning and im hoping the city will fast track development of over passes starting on 149 street and ending on 82 Street. I know its big money to construct an overpass but a freeway should be exactly that a FREEWAY, with no lights. The Deerfoot for example is smooth sailing and its great. I dont understand what city planners were thinking when they decided to put lights on a major highway ridiculous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bray88 View Post
    I don't know if there is a thread for this already but I drive the Yellowhead out of the city every morning, and I enter onto the yellowhead from 82 Street. So from 82 Street to 149 Street going West. you literally are crawling along with the density of cars and semis and most of all the traffic lights! I swear this is becoming a major inconvenience to be held up in traffic every morning and im hoping the city will fast track development of over passes starting on 149 street and ending on 82 Street. I know its big money to construct an overpass but a freeway should be exactly that a FREEWAY, with no lights. The Deerfoot for example is smooth sailing and its great. I dont understand what city planners were thinking when they decided to put lights on a major highway ridiculous.
    Your preaching to the converted.

    Do you have an extra billion in your pocket to give to the city for THAT Project?

  75. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bray88 View Post
    I don't know if there is a thread for this already
    Quite a few threads actually. Try using the Search functionality on this board.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  76. #176

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocket252 View Post

    Your preaching to the converted.

    Do you have an extra billion in your pocket to give to the city for THAT Project?
    Yellowhead is to deerfoot as Anthony Henday is to Stoney Trail.

    Lets get some provincial funding for the yellowhead already!!!

    Stelmach, Mandel... you know what to do

  77. #177

    Default Yellowhead 142st to 156st Grinding/Paving started?

    I was driving thru this area late Thursday night and noticed the inside lanes were blocked off both directions and grinding and paving equipment were in operation.

    Is it possible the 'special asphault' required to pave this stretch has finally become available???

  78. #178

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    Let's hope so. I hate it when projects drag on and on and on.

  79. #179

  80. #180

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    WTF???

    I drove in on this stretch last night about midnight. They have ground up everything WEST of the 156 st ramps on both sides of yellowhead.

    You know, the NEW PAVEMENT THEY JUST LAID DOWN 18 MONTHS AGO!!!

    142st to 156st is still the war zone it has always been...

    Lets hope they are doing the whole smash at once. Common sense would have dictated, 'Let's pave the WORST part first'...


  81. #181

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    Yes, hopefully this is finally going to be completed. Im getting tired of doing moguls on the way home from work everyday. I can not think of a major roadway that has been in such brutal condition for such a length of time.

  82. #182
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    In any case, it will be nice to have to have this section paved. One thing though. When is the city going to have 142 Street to 149 Street non-stop? I think, at the very least, that the city should have a concept plan for building a non-stop route between St. Albert Trail and 156 Street.

  83. #183

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    ^ who's to say they don't? - I think the major hold up on this is trying to get commitment from the province to fund this road. It is a Provincial and National Highway, after all. It's no different then say - Deerfoot in Calgary...

  84. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by blainehamilton View Post
    Common sense would have dictated, 'Let's pave the WORST part first'...

    Why would you assume the worst part should be tended to first? Are you aware of the different stages of construction on that particular project? Could you fill us in as to the scope of work required to complete this project? I'd love to hear from the armchair paving superintendent as to how this job should be completed.

    The problem with common sense is that it isn't so common. Especially for those that don't have all the facts before them.

  85. #185

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    Whats the point in repaving this 142-149st section if they are just going to be putting in new interchanges and flyovers soon? After thats put in, then it will need to be repaved again... could be a waste of money! Lets think long term here.

  86. #186

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    Whats the point in repaving this 142-149st section if they are just going to be putting in new interchanges and flyovers soon? After thats put in, then it will need to be repaved again... could be a waste of money! Lets think long term here.
    I agree, but even if they started tomorrow flyovers would take years to complete. Its not like its some back alley that 10 people drive down everyday. Most gravel range roads are in better condition than that stretch of road.

  87. #187

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    ^ who's to say they don't? - I think the major hold up on this is trying to get commitment from the province to fund this road. It is a Provincial and National Highway, after all. It's no different then say - Deerfoot in Calgary...
    If I recall correctly, it was actually this very C2E forum that raised the Yellowhead provincial funding discrepancy with Mayor Mandel when he was posting here during the municipal election, and he didn't seem aware that the Deerfoot is funded as a provincial highway. I hope he's able to bend some MLA ears to this.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Default Traffic disruptions on Yellowhead, Gateway

    Traffic disruptions on Yellowhead, Gateway
    edmontonjournal.com
    Published: 4:29 pm

    EDMONTON - The city is advising motorists that starting tonight at 9 p.m., paving crews will be out on Yellowhead Trail at 149th Street, resulting in temporary traffic disruptions.

    Both eastbound and westbound traffic on Yellowhead Trail at 149th Street will be reduced to one lane each way, while northbound and southbound through traffic on 149th Street across Yellowhead Trail will be cut off entirely.

    All roads affected are expected to fully reopen by Thursday at 5:30 a.m.

    More disruptions are expected on Gateway Boulevard north of 23rd Avenue on Thursday from 7 a.m. to 3 p.m. The curb lane will be closed to allow for a lane shift to accommodate the new 23rd Avenue interchange.

    Various lane closures will continue of Friday along Gateway Boulevard north of 23rd Avenue to 31st Avenue. The speed limit will be reduced to 50 km/h.

    Story found at: http://www.canada.com/edmontonjourna...3-2b3834c602cd

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    Quote Originally Posted by soycd View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by blainehamilton View Post
    Common sense would have dictated, 'Let's pave the WORST part first'...

    Why would you assume the worst part should be tended to first? Are you aware of the different stages of construction on that particular project? Could you fill us in as to the scope of work required to complete this project? I'd love to hear from the armchair paving superintendent as to how this job should be completed.

    The problem with common sense is that it isn't so common. Especially for those that don't have all the facts before them.
    I believe your in the industry so perhaps you could answer a somewhat related question...

    I'm familiar with the CCC/FAC process for new construction to reach and service new development, but does something similar exist for rehabilitation, or city/province initiated construction?

  91. #191

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    Drove the stretch again last night at about 11pm heading westbound. 149 was closed off completely to N/S traffic.

    Regardless if the new paving was started in the new section, the progress is quickly fixing the poor sections now at 149st, and will probably reach 142 st by next week. Whoever the contractor is, they get bonus points for working FAST!

    There was talk the paving was delayed due to inadaquate supply of the proper material for the job, but I recall seeing running water from a spot in the westbound lanes a few weeks back. It's possible a water line break pushed the project back a short while. Can anyone else comment on this?

    I'm not in the industry myself, I just hold a minor intrest in the progress and upkeep of the roads around the city. I am mobile for my full time employer all day, so good transportation routes are key.

    As for familiarity with the CCC/FAC process, I don't know if such a system does exist for rehab as opposed to new developments. One would think there is some type of guarantee in place to ensure workmanship on major projects like this.

    As for armchair paving superintendant, I hardly meet the qualifications, but think I can voice my opinion when something seems screwy at first. I jumped the gun, but no harm was done...

    I'll be thankful once the work is finished and the nice smooth pavement is ready for driving on.

  92. #192

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    ^ who's to say they don't? - I think the major hold up on this is trying to get commitment from the province to fund this road. It is a Provincial and National Highway, after all. It's no different then say - Deerfoot in Calgary...
    The difference is Deerfoot is an actual freeway with no lights. Thats what the Yellowhead needs hence the urgency to get flyovers at 149 st, 142 st, etc.... The day that councial wakes up and makes the yellowhead lights free will be the day we will recieve provincial funding.

  93. #193

    Default

    I see the new asphalt plant is starting up the last couple of days on 17st north of P can. This plant seems to be like everything else being built in the this province --- behind schedule. I wonder if this is where the supply of "high-tech" asphalt is coming from for this stretch of yellowhead...

  94. #194

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    Hmmm. Well, the cracking unit being down at the Petro Can refinery could have been a source for petrochemical components used in the asphault mixes.

    That could explain part of the delay.

    Cool insight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blainehamilton View Post
    Hmmm. Well, the cracking unit being down at the Petro Can refinery could have been a source for petrochemical components used in the asphault mixes.
    Petro-Can does not produce asphalt oil. In Edmonton, only Imperial Oil has the capabilities to produce it.

    Western Canada Asphalt Oil Producers:

    Shell - Peace River
    Husky - Lloydminster
    Imperial Oil - Edmonton
    Moose Jaw Asphalt - Moose Jaw, SK
    ...and some small facility in Vancouver that is barely worth mentioning (due to their small volume)

  96. #196

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bray88 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    ^ who's to say they don't? - I think the major hold up on this is trying to get commitment from the province to fund this road. It is a Provincial and National Highway, after all. It's no different then say - Deerfoot in Calgary...
    The difference is Deerfoot is an actual freeway with no lights. Thats what the Yellowhead needs hence the urgency to get flyovers at 149 st, 142 st, etc.... The day that councial wakes up and makes the yellowhead lights free will be the day we will recieve provincial funding.
    Right. It's all council's fault that they haven't funded the Yellowhead. It doesn't have anything to do with the fact that money doesn't grow on trees.

    Besides lights have nothing to do with it.

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    Is there a way to plan the Yellowhead in stages? For example:

    (1) Stage 1 - 2009-11 - Overpass at 66 Street, eliminating the intersection around 68 Street. Also, replace the turn at 89 Street with a truck access at 82 Street. This would make the Yellowhead non-stop to 97 Street.

    (2) Stage 2 - 2012-15 - Overpass at 149 Street, along with a flyover at 142 Street. An access road could connect with the north side of 142 Street, and a railroad bridge at the railroad crossing (or the crossing could be eliminated). Yellowhead would be non-stop from St. Albert Trail to the city limit.

    (3) Stage 3 - 2015-18 - Overpass at 121 Street/Bushpilot Road, connecting with the new road if the City Centre Airport lands are developed. 107 Street could be turned into an access for eastbound traffic.

    (4) Stage 4 - 2018-21 - Overpass at 127 Street, with a flyover at 124 Street.

    In the meantime, the city could work on acquiring the land between St. Albert Trail and 149 Street, and around 66 Street, if it hasn't done so already.

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    Sure, anything is possible, if someone is willing to pay for it.

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    ^ And I'm pretty sure the city is waiting for either the province to pony up (unlikely since their priority is Henday), or the Feds to announce a national highway program (likelihood indeterminate!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    Is there a way to plan the Yellowhead in stages? For example:

    (1) Stage 1 - 2009-11 - Overpass at 66 Street, eliminating the intersection around 68 Street. Also, replace the turn at 89 Street with a truck access at 82 Street. This would make the Yellowhead non-stop to 97 Street.

    (2) Stage 2 - 2012-15 - Overpass at 149 Street, along with a flyover at 142 Street. An access road could connect with the north side of 142 Street, and a railroad bridge at the railroad crossing (or the crossing could be eliminated). Yellowhead would be non-stop from St. Albert Trail to the city limit.

    (3) Stage 3 - 2015-18 - Overpass at 121 Street/Bushpilot Road, connecting with the new road if the City Centre Airport lands are developed. 107 Street could be turned into an access for eastbound traffic.

    (4) Stage 4 - 2018-21 - Overpass at 127 Street, with a flyover at 124 Street.

    In the meantime, the city could work on acquiring the land between St. Albert Trail and 149 Street, and around 66 Street, if it hasn't done so already.
    Word on the street is that the City of Edmonton is in the process of creating a comprehensive plan for the Yellowhead corridor. 'Bout time considering there is NO plan for this corridor.

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