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Thread: Sydney lrt vision for George street

  1. #1

    Default Sydney lrt vision for George street

    This fully at grade system will be put on one of Sydney's busiest corridors

    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  2. #2
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    Not sure who did the video but the simulation seems very poor, but then the LRT cars aren't moving very quickly. But it could just be a demo of the what proposed system would look like versus how it would operated (and affect traffic).

  3. #3

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    Imagine what DT would be like if some day we made 102 ave west of 104ST Ped, bike and LRT only... Maybe someday we will get there.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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    Once again, selective cherry-picking from other cities with little or no applicability to Edmonton.

    The Sydney cherry-pick is of a city centre tram not unlike the Portland Street Car. Toward the end of the video the tram even runs in a shared right of way with other vehicles.

    Compared to Edmonton, Sydney is a much larger city, has a much warmer climate, and attracts many more tourists (who are always attracted to street cars and trams). For the locals, Sydney has an extensive underground metro/commuter rail network. Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railways_in_Sydney

    Just because a city centre tram may be a good option for Sydney does not make it a good option for Edmonton.

  5. #5

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    ^ I have to agree, sydney has a MASSIVE commuter rail network with mammoth size 2 level trains that is used by everyday commuters. This - as the narrator in the video herself calls it - is a tram line.
    The difference is in Australia they recognize the difference between urban and suburban and have separate systems to serve both.

  6. #6

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    They also have a very different population.. DO we need commuter rail here?... No, I am sure it would be well used by the 20,000 people in fort sask, and the billions of dollars it would cost would be a GREAT investment.. sarcasim aside. We need systems appropriate to our situation,

    What I just posted is a really nice urban rail network and pointed out that Sydney with it's congestion is dieting roads, making ped only plazas and running LRT at grade. The system, be it street car, dedicated ROW, rapid or slow,high capacity or low capacity etc etc is irrelevant to us what is relevant is, like Paris, they are doing it, expanding it, people love it and its changing their city. I don't understand how or why people think we can keep doing the same thing we have done and magically get different results.

    Again i point out that the "it gets cold here" agrgument was made by east Macauley... and this is the type of provincial thinking that got us the Edmonton we have. It will not move us forward and a city designed SOLELY around the car gets us phoenix. Now they have great weather so now why are they worse off than Edmonton?... This has nothing to do with weather and everything to do with giving people different transportation options and reshaping the city.
    Last edited by edmonton daily photo; 20-12-2012 at 11:48 AM.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  7. #7

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    Oh look, another thread created by the infamous "I will use this city as example until the example no longer works in my favour, then I will cite difference in populations, climate, etc. Your ideas only suite the car driving public, and the only way is my way, cause you're all sprawl loving car driving hippies"

    Next, this post will be quoted, then the infamous " " will call me out for a personal attack, while personally attacking me.

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    It is posted in off-topic/general discussion. Blame the other posters for not taking note of the thread and where it was posted before mentioning how they wish we had that in Edmonton.

    Me too... Looks great. But it doesn't apply here. Perhaps we can take a few general ideas from the clip but we certainly can't replicate it.

  9. #9
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    Ah yes, the good old tram. Yes, let's have a tram for Edmonton:

    A tram (also known as a tramcar; a streetcar or street car; and a trolley, trolleycar, or trolley car) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tram

    On the other hand, if we had a dedicated ROW and, oh two or three grade separations where abundently appropriate - may be it wouldn't be so, you know, tramish.
    ... gobsmacked

  10. #10

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    ^ Again.. not my point...here is my point.

    What I just posted is a really nice urban rail network and pointed out that Sydney with it's congestion is dieting roads, making ped only plazas and running LRT at grade.

    They detailed workings of the system are of no concern to me as they are specific to the area.

    moving away from Terms, because tram in Europe means something very different than the usa.... what is important is the Edmonton system has it's own right of way and signal priority... you can call it a Zizzer Zazzer Zug it doesn't change what it does or how its designed.
    Last edited by edmonton daily photo; 20-12-2012 at 12:40 PM.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  11. #11

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    Great. Let me know when Edmonton starts building a tram.

    The thread title is incorrect. This isn't LRT. This is a tram.

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    A really really slow tram judging by the video. I see cars zipping all over the place and the tram is mostly sitting still.

    Eve

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    ^ Again.. not my point...here is my point.

    What I just posted is a really nice urban rail network and pointed out that Sydney with it's congestion is dieting roads, making ped only plazas and running LRT at grade.
    But all you posted was a clip. No images of the urban rail network, and no mention of Sydney's current congestion. How can I make a fair judgement that they are in fact dieting congested roads, if there is no reference to their current congestion.
    I do not mean to be rude or difficult, but I would go as far as saying this thread essentially has no point at all.

  14. #14

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    I can't feed you everything. One would expect that people do some of thier own research before forming an opinion...I did mean to include the link to the project which appears i did not do. As for the thread having no point, well that is your perspective. (that was punny ;-P )

    http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/trams-to-r...207-1ojah.html

    http://lightrailextension.metrotrans.../myth-busting/

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/new...-1226362883984

    http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showth...101560&page=25

    and here is the cities page...
    http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/d...sformation.asp
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  15. #15

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    here is another video that has more info than just the fly over....



    to put 83,000 pvt cars a day in perspective.. the Gardiner in Toronto handels 6000 cars a hour in rush hour... so 83,000 is equal to nearly 14 hours of rushour traffic on that freeway.

    Trams run every 2 min.

    Sorry those facts aren't right i believe it's 6000 one way, my bad. The freeway west of DT Toronto handles apx 200,000 cars a day. that number is well published.
    Last edited by edmonton daily photo; 20-12-2012 at 01:25 PM.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    I can't feed you everything. One would expect that people do some of thier own research before forming an opinion...I did mean to include the link to the project which appears i did not do. As for the thread having no point, well that is your perspective.
    No I do not expect for you to "feed" me anything but when you yourself state that the point of this thread was to show that "Sydney with it's congestion is dieting roads" yet show no evidence of this in the initial post, then I feel it is more than ok for me or anybody to question the thread's intent.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post

    to put 83,000 pvt cars a day in perspective.. the Gardiner in Toronto handels 6000 cars a hour in rush hour... so 83,000 is equal to nearly 14 hours of rushour traffic on that freeway.

    Trams run every 2 min.
    your 'logic' seems to bounce all over the place. 83000 pvt cars a day come into downtown Sydney (you get this number from video) from all points, multiple accesses. Then you mention something about a single freeway in Toronto? Not sure what you are grasping at, besides strawman logic.

    Trams run every 2 mins... ok, and?

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Perspective View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    I can't feed you everything. One would expect that people do some of thier own research before forming an opinion...I did mean to include the link to the project which appears i did not do. As for the thread having no point, well that is your perspective.
    No I do not expect for you to "feed" me anything but when you yourself state that the point of this thread was to show that "Sydney with it's congestion is dieting roads" yet show no evidence of this in the initial post, then I feel it is more than ok for me or anybody to question the thread's intent.
    like i said it was my intent to include the link with more info.. I am sorry.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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    Edmonton - the Sydney of the north!
    "The only really positive thing one could say about Vancouver is, itís not the rest of Canada." Oink (britishexpats.com)

  20. #20

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    ^ I would rather be strasbourg ;0)

    http://www.railway-technology.com/projects/strasbourg/
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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