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Thread: 102 Ave Bridge over Groat Road - Bridge Replacement | complete

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    Default 102 Ave Bridge over Groat Road - Bridge Replacement | complete

    Thought I would start a new thread for this project.

    CoE just released this document detailing construction schedule and public art work:
    http://www.edmonton.ca/transportatio...ds_Mar2014.pdf



    http://www.edmonton.ca/transportatio...placement.aspx

    Here's the related thread:
    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=32819
    Last edited by The13thFloor; 14-03-2014 at 01:09 AM.

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    Did anyone go to the meeting last night?
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    tress are gone. Looks very raw and barren.
    Make the RIGHT choice before you take your last breath......

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    I use it a lot and it will be a pain in the arse for a while but looks like a nice bridge going in. 100 yrs old. Wow

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    I worked for Alberco many years ago in 2006 They did a rehabilitation job on that bridge that year . The company is made up of civil engineers, while doing the rehab work they were concerned about the under built structure of the entire bridge! The company actually went out of their way bought a software program which cost $15,000 at the time to show what would happen to the bridge over time, basically self-destructing. 8 years later and they're finally replacing the bridge.

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    I also got the pleasure to work on the low-level bridge on the north bound span interestingly the city of Edmonton chose to use a paint that took two years to dry now you look at the bridge and it's all rusted because salt and water has penetrated the WetPaint of two years

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    I also got the pleasure to work on the low-level bridge on the north bound span interestingly the city of Edmonton chose to use a paint that took two years to dry now you look at the bridge and it's all rusted because salt and water has penetrated the WetPaint of two years
    So what happens now in this case?

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    Lol city is going to let the bridge deteriate and than it "will be at the end of it's intended lifespan!"

    Oh btw. It turned into a lead job/ and since the paint would not dry it got covered in the spent sand from sandblasting which contains lead which is now on the paint ahahaha!

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    Hmmmm... Who's the project manager on these things? Corporate? City?

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    Typical: is I worked for Alberco they were the general contractor the client was the city of Edmonton. the firm that represented the city to oversee the project was cohos evamy.

    It was a bit of a **** off I must admit. 2 months we were working in a lead environment and everybody was oblivious to it BECAUSE THE COE dID THEIR OWN TESTING AND Said out it was a non lead job. When asked exactly where these random tests were taken there was no answer given. Approx 60 workers were exposed and at the end of the day we were told to suck it up!

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    They have a webcam up for this project too, similar to the Walterdale Bridge cam.

    http://www.earthcam.net/projects/edm...oatroadbridge/

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    I think it would look cool to put "Groat" in say red neon letters on the bridge girder facing south.
    mandel is a cry baby

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    I wanna know how someone got that make love and ride a bike tag on. With that said im going to be sad that will be gone in a few short days/ weeks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dupa View Post
    I think it would look cool to put "Groat" in say red neon letters on the bridge girder facing south.

    Send your suggestion in to Transportation Dept.
    I'm having people over later to stare at their phones,if you want to drop by

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    Something has gone wrong/caused a delay with the bridge demo. Journal article said it was coming down around midnight last night, so we went down to film it. Talked to the site foreman, and he said more like 4-5am. As of right now (12:30 Saturday) it is still up.
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    I saw a crap load of people on the web cam last night, then the storm came. I dont understand why they have left the middle section intact yet they took out both sides.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    I saw a crap load of people on the web cam last night, then the storm came. I dont understand why they have left the middle section intact yet they took out both sides.
    They had to cancel demo due to severe lightning in the area

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    Metal bride, lightning, what could go wrong?

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    Cool photo.
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    does it say "make love ride a bike" on the bridge? wtf
    be offended! figure out why later...

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    Quote Originally Posted by richardW View Post
    does it say "make love ride a bike" on the bridge? wtf
    Yes, it did.

    On the other side, it said something like "eat more vegetables"!

    Interesting graffiti artists in Glenora.....

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by richardW View Post
    does it say "make love ride a bike" on the bridge? wtf
    no one ever noticed this before?

    IMAG0414 by inthreedimensions, on Flickr

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by richardW View Post
    does it say "make love ride a bike" on the bridge? wtf
    no one ever noticed this before?

    IMAG0414 by inthreedimensions, on Flickr


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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    no one ever noticed this before?
    I for one am usually too focused on the road whilst ripping through those hairpins to be looking at the bridges over Groat.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    I thought avid male bike riders were supposedly deficient in the mechanics/hydraulics involved in successful lovemaking - all that saddle time being a mite destructive.
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    That graffiti has been there for more than a year, maybe two.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    no one ever noticed this before?
    I for one am usually too focused on the road whilst ripping through those hairpins to be looking at the bridges over Groat.
    Those are far from hairpin turns on groat SDM. There more like chicanes

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    One of Edmonton's ugliest bridges bites the dust!
    Edmonton first, everything else second.

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    ^How exactly was it ugly?

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    It is the opposite of picturesque.
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    I'll be glad to see the new bridge as it brightens up the view. The old bridge did the trick but was hardly aesthetically pleasing. From the picture in the first post, the new crossing just decluttered everything and opened up the space.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    I wanna know how someone got that make love and ride a bike tag on. With that said im going to be sad that will be gone in a few short days/ weeks.
    How I'd do it would be use harness and carbiner something above you the to top and then shuffle feet on the bottom lip of the I beam. Safe but not for the faint of heart.

    PS: Way easier than free climbing most vertical faces in the Rockies.
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    the new bridge going in is nothing to scream at...

    I feel it was a lost moment where they could have done just a touch more... something more keeping with the area.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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    ^Do you normally scream at inanimate objects?

    What "signature" bridge did you have in mind?
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    Rebar for some pilings going into the ground this morning at 9:30.

    http://www.earthcam.net/projects/edm...idge/?cam=cam2


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    According to timeline on CoE website, installation of girders was to take place between November and January. Since no such work has commenced, is the completion of this bridge in 2015 in jeopardy as well? What's the holdup? Are these girders coming from South Korea as well?
    Knife

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knife View Post
    According to timeline on CoE website, installation of girders was to take place between November and January. Since no such work has commenced, is the completion of this bridge in 2015 in jeopardy as well? What's the holdup? Are these girders coming from South Korea as well?
    North Korea

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    Adding gravel fill today.




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    Quote Originally Posted by Knife View Post
    According to timeline on CoE website, installation of girders was to take place between November and January. Since no such work has commenced, is the completion of this bridge in 2015 in jeopardy as well? What's the holdup? Are these girders coming from South Korea as well?
    You can always bank on Transportation being completely inept. I don't understand how that dept. hasn't had a thorough cleaning of intransigent old guard and been forced to adhere to new operational standards.
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    Had a look at the 102 ave cam today. They are assembling a large crane on the west side so likely we will see the beams being placed later this month.

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    There are now signs up on Groat Road letting us know that it will be totally closed at nights starting on March 13. I expect that is when they will be lifting the beams into place.

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    Looks like cranes are set up/being set up as we speak:


    http://www.earthcam.net/projects/edm...idge/?cam=cam2

  47. #47

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    102ave and the closing on Groat Rd.

    This is quite impressive when you come around the corner on Groat and look up.
    [IMG][/IMG]
    [IMG][/IMG]
    [IMG][/IMG]

    [IMG][/IMG]

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    Driving north and holy cow, they already have those giants in place on both sides held by the cranes. They are huge!
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    Very cool!

    The March construction update is up now:
    http://www.edmonton.ca/transportatio...te_Mar2015.pdf

    Girder instillation is anticipated to be completed over the weekend.

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    http://www.edmonton.ca/transportatio...s-detours.aspx

    Groat Road Closure – March 13-16, 2015
    Starting at 7:30pm on Friday, March 13, Groat Road will be closed from 107 Avenue to River Valley Road for bridge girder erection. The work is expected to be completed over the weekend; however traffic impacts may carry over into Monday, March 16. Check back for traffic updates.

    Motorists are advised to detour using Victoria Park Road, 149 Street to Whitemud Drive, or 109 Street to the High Level Bridge.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    So this weekend, between Crashed Ice and this, if you need to cross the river, you can just f--k right off.
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    ^poor planning, that's for sure. This weekend couldn't be worse.

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    ^^#firstworldprbs

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    Okay so Groat Road and Grierson Road are closed... you still have many ways to get across the river

    Clover Bar / Beverly Bridges
    Capilano
    Dawson
    Low Level
    James MacDonald
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    Groat (the bridge is still open)
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    Anthony Henday

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    Not like the bridges are closed...

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    So anyone make it out so far for the installation of the main beams today?
    LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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    You mean the whole 2 beams that took 24 hours to install there's no way this is going to be done by monday morning.

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    Groat road will remain closed on Monday March 16. Will reopen Tues. At 6 am
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Brutal for tomorrow morning.

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    According to the news they were delayed due to windy weather
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    I went to the museum yesterday and there were a number of cars parked with the people watching the work being done. My son was amazed by the cranes.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

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    Is it just me or is there a problem brewing this morning? From the 102 ave camera shot it appears as though girders 4, 5 & 6 are buckled.
    Last edited by Knife; 16-03-2015 at 09:36 AM.
    Knife

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knife View Post
    Is it just me or is there a problem brewing this morning? From the 102 ave camera shot it appears as though girders 4, 5 & 6 are buckled.
    I had heard that one of the other delays is because once they put the first couple beams in, they weren't sitting properly, and they needed another crane to put the cross beams in for support, and they didn't anticipate needing to put the cross braces in as soon as they needed to. Probably hoping they could put the cross braces in after some beams were already in place, but they needed the original crane to hold the larger beam in place while the cross beam was installed, and lifted by another crane.

    So maybe these beams you're talking about, is because they aren't tied in fully yet.

  64. #64

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    Yeah, this looks very weird...

    EDIT: Ah, *****. Looking through the time lapse, there was definitely a problem. This is NOT good.


    Last edited by lat; 16-03-2015 at 09:55 AM.

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    Go back to 2 a.m. They were straight.
    Knife

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    I think we'll hear another word from the city informing us the completion date will be pushed back a few more months so they can fab 3 new beams. I'm guessing that the 3 warped beams will not be used, but perhaps it isn't as bad as it looks.

    Looking at the image you can see where the bracing has bent and failed allowing the beams to warp. Perhaps a result not enough bracing to resist the effects of wind.

    Groat could be open once then remove the 3.

    When they originally were building the Anthony Henday Bridge (not sure if it was westbound/northbound or eastbound/southbound) one of the main beams fell during lifting and they did have to replace it.
    Last edited by sundance; 16-03-2015 at 09:55 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sundance View Post
    I think we'll hear another word from the city informing us the completion date will be pushed back a few more months so they can fab 3 new beams. I'm guessing that the 3 warped beams will not be used, but perhaps it isn't as bad as it looks.

    Looking at the image you can see where the bracing has bent and failed allowing the beams to warp. Perhaps a result of the wind.

    Groat could be open once then remove the 3.
    I don't think you can fab replacements fast enough to hit the construction window. If this is the case I predict an August 2016 opening.
    Knife

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    Are the beams something we could fabricate locally? We might as well keep the work local if we can.

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    I doubt they can even think about kicking off someone to refab these until there is a thorough investigation and engineering review to understand the cause of the failure.
    Knife

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    Yeah, something happened between 2 and 2:15. It threw the alignment of ends of the bridge out as well, so this is not just a matter of replacing 3 girders.

    EDIT: Actually, at 2:00 the problem was starting. The load had dropped since 1:45 and was already starting to deform the supporting structures on either end. Argh.
    Last edited by lat; 16-03-2015 at 10:46 AM.

  71. #71

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    Well there's your problem....

    EDIT: hmmm... actually the crane support looks about the same as yesterday, so maybe not!

    Last edited by lat; 16-03-2015 at 10:54 AM.

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    Deformation... ouch
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    City presser at 11 AM re: bridge
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    102 Ave update
    http://www.mailoutinteractive.com/In...aspx?id=668500

    Groat Road remains closed

    Public safety top priority as City assesses 102 Ave Bridge girders
    Groat Road will remained closed to traffic on Tuesday March 17 as the City and its contract partners work to repair or remove several steel girders that buckled during installation for the 102 Ave Bridge Replacement Project.

    At approximately 2:15 a.m. on Monday, March 16 four of the girders buckled as one of the girders was being installed. Construction teams immediately secured the construction site for worker and public safety and initiated an investigation.

    “Under the City’s oversight, several engineering teams are investigating the situation to determine exactly what went wrong here,” said Barry Belcourt, Branch Manager of the Roads Design & Construction Branch with the City of Edmonton. “At this point in time we are not able to identify a single factor that caused the girders to fail.

    “Regardless of the cause, public safety is paramount and we can’t have anyone traveling underneath the bridge until it’s safe to do so. Therefore Groat Road must unfortunately remain closed until further notice.”
    The City will continue to provide public updates as the investigation proceeds, and will notify Edmonton residents as soon as Groat Road can be safely opened. Suggested detour routes during the closure include Victoria Park Road, 149 Street to Whitemud Drive, and 109 Street to the High Level Bridge. ETS Route 128 will detour to Victoria Park Road/116 Street/107 Avenue, with extra buses on Saturday, March 14 to make up for the delay. More information is available at www.takeets.com.

    The City appreciates everyone’s patience as we work to open Groat Road as quickly as possible, and to complete the 102 Ave Bridge Replacment Project.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Well I really would like to know what happened.
    LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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    COE projects are cursed.

    This is going to cost the contractor or the engineer lots of $.

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    Oh I thought it was wind, but looks like it was a bad lift, still ugh, and you hope the warping hasn't affected the strength, inspections and engineers will tell.

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    ^they will be put into the recycling bin... much if not all of it.
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    Those girders are toast.

    Just bad.

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    If high winds were a factor wouldn't it be the City since it wouldn't be an engineering or contractor mistake?

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    If high winds were a factor wouldn't it be the City since it wouldn't be an engineering or contractor mistake?
    That would likely be insurance through force majeur, but the winds were Saturday not last night when this happened.

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    The release says 3 buckled, the view looks like 3 actually buckled. The 4th probably has lesser damage to the cross-brace connection and could be repairable, but those 3 look pretty badly damaged.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    If high winds were a factor wouldn't it be the City since it wouldn't be an engineering or contractor mistake?
    Girders for bridges like this are generally supply and install. I don't think the city should be on hook for anything...

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    Those long beams have an incredibly strong section modulus in the X axis but are downright flimsy is the Y axis. If they dropped something on the beams in place or the wind swung a lifted load into the other beams, it would not take much to crumple them with any side load. It looks like they did not put enough cross brace stiffeners as they were placing down the beams. The little ones bent like straws.

    It is a very difficult lift with lots of coordination between cranes and men. Hope no one was hurt. This will take a long time to investigate and fix. Glad we have pictures of the events and hopefully a full video.

    On a related safety matter:
    I looked at this photo and wondered what happens if a crane bumps these beams waiting to be placed? There appears to be no bracing to prevent them from falling over.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  86. #86

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    According to the environment Canada website, the wind at 2 this morning was 7 kph.... hmm...

  87. #87
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    If it was wind related it would likely be because the earlier high wind shifted something out of place that wasn't noticed. In that case, though, it would be a contractor mistake for not taking the time to check everything after the high winds.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

  88. #88
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    Wind had nothing to do with this guys, nothing.

    Catrostrophic failure like that is far more likely to do with design or erection.
    www.decl.org

    Ottawa-Edmonton-Vancouver-Edmonton

  89. #89

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    It is either wind or gravity, the beams themselves would sag if they went sideways.
    Edmonton first, everything else second.

  90. #90

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    Sideways force greater than any recent wind would've generated, even on Saturday.

  91. #91
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    Almost looks like thermal expansion

    i know it's not, but the pattern is reminiscent

    Anyways, yeah the wind did not do that. There's something much more serious going on here
    Parkdale

  92. #92

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    Something got bumped. It was not the wind IMHO.


    When we were building a Church, the engineer screwed up on the 65 foot long wooden scissor trusses by giving the truss builder the calculations without snowload as he assumed wrongly that the truss builder would factor them in. They did not and built them until someone realized that they were way too flimsy. They had to build a complete set of trusses again.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  93. #93
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    Holy smokes:

    Groat Road will be closed indefinitely and the 102 Avenue Bridge over top of it could be delayed a year, after a major structural failure during construction Monday morning.
    http://metronews.ca/news/edmonton/13...tion-problems/

  94. #94
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    Wishing we had our 100 yr old bridge back. They knew how to build bridges back then.

  95. #95

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    Bridges collapsed 100 years ago to during construction

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_Bridge

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_bridge_failures

    Pity to those who commute in the whole area
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  96. #96
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    I hope there is not a list of arenas collapsing during construction on wiki....lol

  97. #97

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    http://www.edmontonjournal.com/index.html

    How do heavy steel girders bend like pipe cleaners. Could this be something in the manufacturing of them. I can see steel a lot thinner than that buckling from extreme heat, but those thick girders are a mystery.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  98. #98

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    From Metro Sunday evening:
    General Supervisor Matt Boiko said when the first girder went up there was a slight lean to it, which required a second crane to correct.

    “It started to lean a bit and they should be perfectly straight,” he said.

  99. #99
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    Back to the drawing board on those beams I think.

  100. #100
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    I think Edmonton PRT might have a point. 'Is it possible that the girders sheared? There is no reinforcement down the middle, like the ones used for the Winter Garden pedway.
    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

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