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Thread: Stanley Milner Library Exterior Redesign

  1. #1

    Default Stanley Milner Library Exterior Redesign

    Drawings envision $56-million proposed makeover for Stanley A. Milner Library

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    Artists’ rendering of the Stanley A. Milner Library revitalization project.

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    Artists’ rendering of the Stanley A. Milner Library revitalization project.
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    BY ELIZABETH WITHEY, EDMONTON JOURNAL MAY 8, 2014
    EDMONTON - The Stanley A. Milner Library is one step closer to getting a much-needed facelift that will bring its drab exterior in line with more modern-looking buildings along Churchill Square.

    The outdated-looking central library with concrete facade was constructed for Canada’s centennial in 1967, and while the building has a “solid” structure, it needs a makeover, according to Edmonton Public Library CEO Linda Cook.

    “We’re looking like the poor cousin on the square,” Cook said Wednesday. “We want to take our rightful place in the square. The library really does need renewal.”

    Toronto’s Teeple Architects and Edmonton-based Architecture ATB (Arndt Tkalcic Bengert) have been awarded a joint contract, pending approval and funding from city council this fall. They are the same team redesigning the Clareview Recreation Centre and Library............click link for full story

    Link to Edmonton Journal.

    http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/...631/story.html
    Last edited by Flynn; 08-05-2014 at 05:27 PM.

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    I'm using iPhone. Please post pics from EJ, somebody. Thanks!

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    Last edited by ScottieA; 08-05-2014 at 08:19 AM.
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    What another waste of money. $1.2MM just to come up with the design. Lets spend this money on the content of the library instead. Or how about doing something with the beggars outside??

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    It needs to be redone. Can't say I'm super excited about this particular design. It's those odd angles.
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    building upgrades, energy savings, modern design. excellent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JJMorrocco View Post
    What another waste of money. $1.2MM just to come up with the design. Lets spend this money on the content of the library instead. Or how about doing something with the beggars outside??
    Hhahaha, wow, you a pretty detached from reality there.

    I value you your right to say it, but geesh, don't gawk until you research a) how much engineering actually costs a and b)some sort of knowledge about social programs already going on down town.

    This is also not an either or expenditure.

    I personally use that library 100's of times and never been asked for money. It is being more used as a community centre, yes, by some whom happen to be marginalized citizens. It is a safe place where individuals won't be kicked out. A new improved public space for those clients is a totally different issues than your rhetoric though....

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    Quote Originally Posted by DTrobotnik View Post
    building upgrades, energy savings, modern design. excellent.
    I hope they open up the north end of the library more. It's pretty dead and that square is underutilized 90% of the year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nick5150 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DTrobotnik View Post
    building upgrades, energy savings, modern design. excellent.
    I hope they open up the north end of the library more. It's pretty dead and that square is underutilized 90% of the year.
    I think you're thinking of the South side of the building
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    There is nothing at all wrong with the original modernist design.

    I would just be happy with the stripping away of the salmon stucco landslide crap put in around fifteen years ago.

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    A whiff of Seattle to be sure, but I don't dislike it. I would like to see more angles.
    I think of art, at its most significant, as a Distant Early Warning system that can always be relied on to tell the old culture what is beginning to happen to it. —Marshall McLuhan

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    I think it looks amazing. As long as the metal siding isn't too overbearing on the square with the AGA also having somethign similar.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JJMorrocco View Post
    What another waste of money. $1.2MM just to come up with the design. Lets spend this money on the content of the library instead. Or how about doing something with the beggars outside??
    Would you rather us be Calgary spending 245 million?
    Last edited by Magnoblade; 08-05-2014 at 09:01 AM.

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    I like it! It certainly looks like it would cost more than $50M though
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    56 million total it said in the story. But if it makes it look not like a box i don't care how much they spend. Im sick and tired of box designs bring on the sexy curve and angle builds!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by JJMorrocco View Post
    What another waste of money. $1.2MM just to come up with the design. Lets spend this money on the content of the library instead. Or how about doing something with the beggars outside??
    Would you rather us be Calgary spending 245 million?
    Yeah but Snøhetta's gonna drop some next-level architecture on 7th ave for that price. I can't wait to see those renderings!
    I think of art, at its most significant, as a Distant Early Warning system that can always be relied on to tell the old culture what is beginning to happen to it. —Marshall McLuhan

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    You know, in this matter of architecture I'm resolutely localist.

    All public projects must be given to the locals. All of them, every last one. Indeed to achieve that end I'm quite willing to put up with what too many of you will call "crap" .

    If Snoehetta or any hotshot bunch want to open up a permanent office here and commit to keeping it open for 15 years, and will assign any entire project to be executed here to someone who will commit to staying here the entire 15 years, then said hotshots can come in and build with public money. And if not, not.

    Some of you complain sometimes about how we have no "school of architecture" of our own. Inappropriate veneration of prodigies from afar is a big part of that problem, to the extent the problem exists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AShetsen View Post
    You know, in this matter of architecture I'm resolutely localist.

    All public projects must be given to the locals. All of them, every last one. Indeed to achieve that end I'm quite willing to put up with what too many of you will call "crap" .

    If Snoehetta or any hotshot bunch want to open up a permanent office here and commit to keeping it open for 15 years, and will assign any entire project to be executed here to someone who will commit to staying here the entire 15 years, then said hotshots can come in and build with public money. And if not, not.

    Some of you complain sometimes about how we have no "school of architecture" of our own. Inappropriate veneration of prodigies from afar is a big part of that problem, to the extent the problem exists.
    For some reason your characterization of Snoehetta reminds me of Sven from HIMYM:


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    Quote Originally Posted by AShetsen View Post
    You know, in this matter of architecture I'm resolutely localist.

    All public projects must be given to the locals. All of them, every last one. Indeed to achieve that end I'm quite willing to put up with what too many of you will call "crap" .
    I'm not.
    I think of art, at its most significant, as a Distant Early Warning system that can always be relied on to tell the old culture what is beginning to happen to it. —Marshall McLuhan

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dialog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by AShetsen View Post
    You know, in this matter of architecture I'm resolutely localist.

    All public projects must be given to the locals. All of them, every last one. Indeed to achieve that end I'm quite willing to put up with what too many of you will call "crap" .
    I'm not.
    Me either. And I think partnering local firms with international ones is a far better approach to build 'our' school of architecture.

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    ^Agreed, almost seems like a mild xenophobia. There must be a better way to attract businesses than to trap them like that. Our city ( and others) have grown more because of utilizing skills we don't always have. To force any business to invest here would throw their Net Present Value and IRR on projects in our city out the window and experts ( I don't just mean subjective worth business such as architects) would just decline. That could mean more local business... again... xenophobic for no justified reason fostering protectionist business practises stunting growth and innovation in my opinion.
    Last edited by nick5150; 08-05-2014 at 09:49 AM.

  23. #23

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    Here is a story meant to get Edmonton thingkng with an AMAZING conceprt for main branch of our library system.... and no one has said next to anything.

    What an amazing concept!

    LOVE IT!!

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    I'd need to see more renders to get behind this: interaction with plaza to the south, interaction to east and west, and a sign that there is a noticeable 'front entrance' I would like to see... modernity is good, only to the point of not achieving a total abstract design. The more abstract, the more confused the public will become in years after its completion. Useful architecture doesn't have to be utilitarian, but abstract and modern designs like this shouldn't forget the people who walk around it and look at it day to day, as well as those who wish to use it, accessing it from all locations and modes of transport.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AShetsen View Post
    There is nothing at all wrong with the original modernist design.
    I concur. The revamp seems like an attempt to make the Milner "groove" with the art gallery and maybe some of the other structures surrounding Churchill. But I don't really see the point of that. The library is what it is, reflective of the era in which it was built. If anything, it's the later buildings that should bow to the older ones(which is not to say they have to copy the styles directly).

    And then there is this quote...

    "There are so many public libraries in the world that are stunning, that make a statement, and ours looks like we don’t really think highly of it.”

    So what exactly are we saying, in effect, to the people who designed and built the Milner back in '67, not to mention the officials who approved the design? "Wow, you guys sure didn't care about that library, did you?" I suspect they would disagree with that insinuation.

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    I say close down 99st and 100st between 102 and 102A l Churchill sq and make the whole thing a giant plaza. Mind you i would shut down from 101a to 103 st to make the whole area into become the arts district plaza.

  27. #27

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    ^^ agreed.

    Having everything look the same 'modern' is boring, the varying styles tell a story of our past.

    Sure everyone want to save the old brick buildings, but these building in time too will become old historic buildings we cherish. Built in a simpler time, where it wasn't aobut what is on the outside but rahter the inside that counts.

    And as for the energy efficiency we all know how long itwill take to make the 50 million back.

    Now the asking price to operate the Aviation musuem doesn't sound so bad.

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    Very good points overoceans. Some money needs to be spent on the entrance and the southside, sure, but the rest... I'd have to be convinced.

  29. #29

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    I am very excited for this. Its going to be a beautiful building to work in. OUr biggest issue is a lack of natural light. I am so excited to get sunshine again

    We do amazing work inside of our building. Now its time for an amazing building.
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    I actually find myself agreeing with Ashetsen.
    I think we need to promote and support local talent wherever possible.
    I don't agree with formal residency or local office requirements but when it comes to design and art we should encourage local talent wherever possible.
    For example, the Talus dome. I have no problem with the design or concept, but I have a huge problem with it being done by an out of country artist.
    It is the same with the AGA, we got a bad Gehry knock off by an American architect. There is no local connection at all.
    As far as the library concept goes, I totally am against it. The library as it stands now may appear dated but so did the Teglar building when it was demolished. Everyone talks about preserving our heritage but that falls by the wayside everytime somebody dangles a bright and shiny new concept.

  31. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by ashetsen View Post
    there is nothing at all wrong with the original modernist design.

    I would just be happy with the stripping away of the salmon stucco landslide crap put in around fifteen years ago.

    qft

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    Quote Originally Posted by nick5150 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DTrobotnik View Post
    building upgrades, energy savings, modern design. excellent.
    I hope they open up the north end of the library more. It's pretty dead and that square is underutilized 90% of the year.
    I think you mean south? They are planning a kids park for Centennial Plaza. If they do it like Winnipeg, it will be quite nice.
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    If they add a kids park I would love for a day care space to be made in this re purposed building.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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    Flynn,

    Please reduce your post to the first 150 words of the article, and a link back to the source. This ensures the Edmonton Journal gets both proper credit and traffic back to their site as a courtesy for them allowing us to post their work.

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  35. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by overoceans View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by AShetsen View Post
    There is nothing at all wrong with the original modernist design.
    I concur. The revamp seems like an attempt to make the Milner "groove" with the art gallery and maybe some of the other structures surrounding Churchill. But I don't really see the point of that. The library is what it is, reflective of the era in which it was built. If anything, it's the later buildings that should bow to the older ones(which is not to say they have to copy the styles directly).

    And then there is this quote...

    "There are so many public libraries in the world that are stunning, that make a statement, and ours looks like we don’t really think highly of it.”

    So what exactly are we saying, in effect, to the people who designed and built the Milner back in '67, not to mention the officials who approved the design? "Wow, you guys sure didn't care about that library, did you?" I suspect they would disagree with that insinuation.
    Furthermore lets build a City Hall, Churchill Square, new Art Gallery, all with no connection with each other or their surrounding and which are all strange designs and then have the Library complain that they now don't mesh with the surroundings. Oh Edmonton.

    Heres a thought. A statement, on what a Public Library properly brings, and ought to bring, is contained more inside the facilities and in the offerings which it provides to end users. As any kid, I went to the library to take out books, music, whatever of interest I could find. I don't recall once thinking or feeling disappointed that I wasn't walking into the British Museum while doing so.

    What is with this collective "make a statement on a grand level" common plaintiff cry?

    Its as if decades of nonplus architecture has resulted in the opposite pendulum swing to nothing is ever good enough.

    Trouble is somebody is paying for all this largesse and I suspect the spending isn't stopping or even slowing down as present city council has suggested.

    Whats next? Rebuilding ECC.
    Last edited by Replacement; 08-05-2014 at 11:33 AM.
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  36. #36

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    I really like the concept! Especially that interior space overlooking Churchill Square from, what, the 3rd floor? (I see a glass corner.)


    One thing I was hoping to see was opening up the main floor to the world. It's a high ceiling and either removing the existing glass walls altogether or replacing them with large sliding glass curtain walls or retractable glass doors all around would make this space full accessible to Churchill while opening up a visual ground level perspective towards Jasper Avenue and be able to make use or integrate the very large dead space on the Library's south side.

    It would also better "connect" Rice Howard Way to Churchill Square making the whole area more "seamless" and integrated.

    This open but covered space could then be used for exhibits, plays, market gardens, etc. and would help extend the core's utility and seasonability without the need to forever bring in tents etc. for Churchill Square itself. (Forever reducing some of the grant and direct costs to the city and organizations that host events in the square.) It would also enable the space to host larger populations as the city grows.


    Here's my earlier thoughts on this in response to some earlier redesign proposals... (not this one)

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    ^ At least it's a bit creative. Cold, hard, unfriendly looking, but creative.

    ...

    There's got to be a few people out there that can still 'dream in colour'. i.e. Someone should be able to dream up something nice for Edmonton.

    Maybe move the library up, then remove most of the main floor's walls - its exterior walls - and open it up to the air and pedestrian traffic!

    Leave a couple portions of walls on the east and west sides for projection screens, make sure the view from Churchill towards the hotel and Jasper Ave is unrestricted...
    (This would by extension give Churchill Sq. a covered but open-air gallery/space.) Punch a glass covered atrium right down the centre of the building to really brighten and enliven the space.


    Milner Library - Ideas for New Look for the Downtown Library
    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=15877



    .
    Last edited by KC; 08-05-2014 at 12:11 PM. Reason: correct link to the thread on refacing the Library

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    The looks of the original design are fine (albeit a bit brutal), but the skin of the building has serious problems, lack of insulation and leaks being the major ones. While you could reskin the building using materials that address the problem but keep the look you have the opportunity to change the look, so why not.

    The proposed design looks great and allows a lot of light into the structure above the 1st floor than the current design does.

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    I'm pretty conflicted on this one.

    The Stanley (IMHO) is a great building. I like it especially at night with the nifty lighting treatment the library gives it. It and silly hall really anchor Churchill Square.

    OTOH, the rendering is of a building that would be far better for patrons and rather than anchoring the square, would bring patrons (and staff) into the square.

    So - argue on pro and o - pponents ... I am officially undecided ... Go ahead and persuade me.
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    $56M revamp proposed for Stanley Milner Library

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmont...636251?cmp=rss
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    Aesthetically this concept wins me over, FWTW.

    Strong agree with McKeen's and Cook's takes on it. It's a great library in a great location with a great basic structure, which looks awful, is awful at building-human interaction, and performs awfully against the climate.

    In the "car hood" front entrance, I'll be very glad to sweep away this example of Klein-era architecture. (Next up: Commonwealth Stadium? Hall D? TWOS expansion?)

    Also strong agree with GenWhy? that we need to see the main floor placement of doors and uses of space. The LRT connection for starters needs rethinking from scratch; then presently there is zero interaction with Centenial Plaza; and 3 out of 4 corners are just dead as doornails.

    It's so easy to see ways to improve this building, I hope we don't go all gung-ho and somehow skip over the sort-of ergonomic basics. Not saying for a second that Teeple and ATB aren't up to it, just that those details aren't apparent in the renderings provided.
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    I would like to see the building deconstructed a bit and put under glass
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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    I would like to see the building deconstructed a bit and put under glass
    Technaly it is being deconstructed because how else are they going to get floor to ceiling glass?

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    Those of you moaning about losing the current library because of the architecture, heritage or whatever: Keep in mind that this replaced a much nicer Carnegie library where the Telus tower sits today.

    While they are revamping the Milner, I really hope they do something about those massive parkade entrances. They need to be downsized for better visibility of the library and the plaza south of it.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    I would like to see the building deconstructed a bit and put under glass
    Technaly it is being deconstructed because how else are they going to get floor to ceiling glass?
    deconstruction in the design sense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Admin View Post
    Flynn,

    Please reduce your post to the first 150 words of the article, and a link back to the source. This ensures the Edmonton Journal gets both proper credit and traffic back to their site as a courtesy for them allowing us to post their work.

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    I'm pretty sure we're all interested. Let's see more renders and drawings on what they have envisioned. I think the key here is the centennial plaza to the south. Perhaps they should design it so a north and south entrance be accommodated so the entire middle strip of the ground floor would be common area for desk staff and checkouts. This along with an all-glass wall main floor would help create a connecting link between churchill and centennial squares.

    They should also consider the basement in the design. It is under utilized and "sketchy" to most.

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    Wow, when I read the thread title I thought, "Oh no! I love that building the way it is!". Then I see the proposal. That looks great!
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  49. #49

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    I saw 2 more renderings of the project on ctv on twitter. Sorry don't know how to post using iPhone.

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    It seems the library is getting a glass covering. It looks like it will be a very attractive building when it's done.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

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    Just noticed that they left out the horrid mechanical addition to the Telus Toll building in the library renders. Sly insult? Or dated render....? I choose the former.

  55. #55

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    I like the slant on the 2nd floor...it's like the artist just took a section and rotated it slightly

  56. #56

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    It looks like an edgier (literally) Apple store. I like it.

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    Looks sort of like a semi-pyramid. I like it. I think that design compliments the City Hall nicely. Hope it gets the go-ahead.
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  58. #58

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    The building looks cold, I'm worried that people will start hating it within 10 years. They need to do more with the colourful EPL sign on the roof to warm it up. We need to see what they are going to do with the square at the back of the library as well.
    Edmonton first, everything else second.

  59. #59

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    Here's what I'm mainly hoping they do - take that creepy old basement area between the library, the library theatre, and the parking levels, and make it look at least marginally inviting.

  60. #60

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    To me, it is not inviting...The library is an extension of learning, so it needs to be calm and colorful to stimulate the mind. This rendering illustrate cold aggression. When I look at the rendering, it reminds me of the American stealth armor, and it states, stay away from us.

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    It is sterile. I would love to see a living wall somewhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasH View Post
    The building looks cold, I'm worried that people will start hating it within 10 years.
    {…}.
    I agree…I fear this building will look dated in just a few years.

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    I would have serious, serious doubts about the claimed budget for this. I think it looks great, but I think they're being extremely optimistic on the budgeting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasH View Post
    The building looks cold, I'm worried that people will start hating it within 10 years.
    {…}.
    I agree…I fear this building will look dated in just a few years.
    I also agree.

    Upon first seeing these renders I INSTANTLY thought of the Seattle Central Library. During my first visit to Seattle in 2006, I thought the thing was built in the 80s, but was surprised to find it opened in 2004!

    I'm more a fan of the style used at the Denver Library, but I also realize that in the case of the Milner, a lot of this work is a new skinning.

    That said, I think that EPL needs to do a lot in terms of making the library feel like an accessible space for everyone. There have been more than a few times I felt somewhat uncomfortable due to the clientele that was in the library....a huge problem is that the 'security' guards rarely do anything about serious matters (or at least this used to be the case).

    On the flip side, a public library must be accessible to the public, regardless of socio-economic status. Nevertheless, all clients need to stick to the rules.

    I think part of this may involve changing the services offered, like the addition of the new 'build/experience/try it yourself' room. This is much more useful than simply slapping down a bunch of computer terminals, half of which are just used for FB games and porn most of the time.
    LA today, Athens tomorrow. I miss E-town.

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    Glad to see the desire to revamp the Milner. I wish the project well.
    President and CEO - Airshow.

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    Would love to see this project move ahead, will improve sight lines from Churchill Square and the library needs more space. Fingers crossed for this one.
    Edmonton, Capital of Alberta

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    Looks good thus far, a bit Seattley, but huge improvement. I would have preferred glulam and glass to warm up the exterior given that this will look and feel very cold in winter.
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  68. #68

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    I use this library a lot and some sort of "refresh" would be nice. However, the cost is a bit concerning. The budget for libraries seems to be quite high given that another library I used to use (Jasper Place) was rebuilt and I now go to the new Lois Hole library quite a bit. That is a lot on investment.

    I don't want to seem harsh, but if significant money is spent on the Stanley Milner library they need to find a way to manage the "clientele". Far too often when I go there are many people sleeping in the chairs or just hanging out to eat their lunch or other food. It also seems to be a popular hangout for younger people at times. I recognize that there are challenges with having public facilities in the downtown core, but surely some efforts can be made to make this a more inviting environment for families and other users. The entrance area can be really gross with the number of smokers hanging out there.

    We have bought an annual pass to the AGA and do go to the Milner library on occasion as part of our trips downtown (along with going to the market). However, the library often just doesn't seem to be a safe, healthy or pleasant place to spend much time. That's a shame.

  69. #69
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    I always get the impression that Milner operates as a daytime homeless shelter.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  70. #70

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    Wondering? Can we ever have a thread that doesn't degrade into a pool of negativity?

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnoblade View Post
    Wondering? Can we ever have a thread that doesn't degrade into a pool of negativity?
    I was about to post something similar, maybe the mods can create a thread for people to go and whine/***** at each other so that threads can stay on the topic they were created for.
    Edmonton, Capital of Alberta

  72. #72

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    ^^The social issues occurring inside or nearby the library are merely the social issues within a 7 or 10 block radius. The action has to be bigger than the library to get the reaction everyone involved I suspect wants to see.

    The issues with the building itself however are in three completely different dimensions, each of which justify this project in my mind:

    • asbestos
    • walls rated around R1
    • main and basement floorplans which do almost nothing positive with their street and LRT interactions.


    We don't even need to care about the aesthetic improvements, but while fixing the above, it won't cost significantly more to get those as well.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  73. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    Looks good thus far, a bit Seattley, but huge improvement. I would have preferred glulam and glass to warm up the exterior given that this will look and feel very cold in winter.
    Ha ha, Seattle. Actually the first thing I thought when I saw these renders was the Omotesando (Tokyo) Prada Boutique:



    Source

    But strong agree about the glulam actually. It really does wonders for the Lois Hole Library, as an example.


    Source



    Source
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  74. #74

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    I was super wound up in the excitement of the IDEA of a new library that i jumped on the "It's AMAZING" bandwagon right away....

    In reality I don't want this design what so ever.

    I feel like this process should be way more public and way more open..... and the design... well... better.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  75. #75

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    I think i would like to be see the Original library recreated in some form... with the modern addition attached.

    Why can't we go back to the future a bit?

    should we recreate lost treasures?

    We are returning to urban form practices that existed prior to auto centric design.. what about writing some of our demolition wrongs?
    Last edited by edmonton daily photo; 09-05-2014 at 01:29 PM.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  76. #76

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    Some photos please.

    People come to the library from the south, east and west and not just the north. So for some added discussion, it would be great if someone could post a series of photos of the current library from the various street level angles and perspectives.

    We all know what happened with Hall "D"

    Maybe there's a place for a south facing rooftop balcony connecting to the ground level Centennial Plaza a couple floors down. Maybe room somewhere on that side for a coffee shop or something.

    Or maybe glass right over the little used street between the Citadel and the Library connecting the two.

    .
    Last edited by KC; 09-05-2014 at 04:28 PM.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    Looks good thus far, a bit Seattley, but huge improvement. I would have preferred glulam and glass to warm up the exterior given that this will look and feel very cold in winter.
    This, and as to other concerns about seeming cold. Perhaps flood lighting could be used, specified to each angle / plane of the 3d form. If done right, and the colours cycle as they do on the current building, that could be neat.

  78. #78
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    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...172#post597172

    The link to the arguments about the Milner's safety. Discuss that issue there. Please, for the love of my sanity, keep this thread to the architecture/design of the proposed remodel!
    Ow

  79. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keats82 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    Looks good thus far, a bit Seattley, but huge improvement. I would have preferred glulam and glass to warm up the exterior given that this will look and feel very cold in winter.
    This, and as to other concerns about seeming cold. Perhaps flood lighting could be used, specified to each angle / plane of the 3d form. If done right, and the colours cycle as they do on the current building, that could be neat.
    As I said I like the design, but then, had I been a car buyer in the 60s I probably wood have fallen for fins and fake wood grain.

    That said, everyone needs to consider how building materials age. We have too many buildings that look great and then 20 years later are despised because they haven't aged well, and when maintained at minimal cost end up looking worse for wear. Any exposed wood will eventually be painted a standard brown or clad in some tacky off the shelf tin.

    We also need to rethink our own trendy attitudes. Architects are no different that interior designers, suckers for just "reimagining" the latest cliche. Same issues. When built they are admired and then the fad wanes, and then there are calls for demolition. So, is this design just representative of today's popularity of metal cladding. Are we at risk of building a bunch of Tin Palaces in the core that will dominate the core and have no lasting public appreciation?

    Also, what wood a severe hailstorm do to this cladding? Would it allow much light into the building?...
    Last edited by KC; 10-05-2014 at 12:16 AM.

  80. #80
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    I think it would be great to build a glass casing around the building, with a glass hall in the back (across the Westin), something that could be used for various events. We could also improve the connection with the LRT and Citadel, and give patrons a chance to use the ground level as a pedway.
    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

  81. #81

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    I concur with you on this. Just like an egg where the current structure remains- perhaps expand windows to allow for more natural light- with a glass shell around. Perhaps colorful paint could be applied to the original structure. The paint must be applied more intense than CC mall for it to be affective.

  82. #82

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    I have nothing regarding aesthetics to offer this discussion.

    But the new building envelope, the asbestos removal, and thourough main floorplan makeover simply must happen.

    And Admin: thanks for the thread fork. Those issues are simply not building issues and don't belong in the building conversation.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  83. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    I concur with you on this. Just like an egg where the current structure remains- perhaps expand windows to allow for more natural light- with a glass shell around. Perhaps colorful paint could be applied to the original structure. The paint must be applied more intense than CC mall for it to be affective.
    Yeah I think we're deviating from the merits of this specific proposal.

    More on the free spirit design ideas here...
    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=15877
    .
    Last edited by KC; 10-05-2014 at 07:44 AM.

  84. #84
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    When I was dependent on public libraries, I was never all that interested in flashy exteriors to libraries. Truth to tell I prefer the old stone / brick buildings.

    However, I think the Stanley Milner would benefit tremendously by having an exterior sound insulating system for when loud events happen in Churchill Square.

    Also, it really needs a truly accessible front door. Right now, the best way to enter the place is via the Second Cup and I saw a lot of baby carriages tootling through that way when I went last week. So I know I'm not the only one who thinks this. I'm sure wheelchair patrons would prefer just to wheel in rather than navigate the lift.

    I was always just a little bit shocked that one of the buildings that should be most accessible simply isn't.

    Eve

  85. #85
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    ^ This is very true. I would love to see the new design demolish the stupid late 90s edition that really ruined the whole look of the library and introduced problems such as the main door accessibility matters.
    LA today, Athens tomorrow. I miss E-town.

  86. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    I concur with you on this. Just like an egg where the current structure remains- perhaps expand windows to allow for more natural light- with a glass shell around. Perhaps colorful paint could be applied to the original structure. The paint must be applied more intense than CC mall for it to be affective.
    Yeah I think we're deviating from the merits of this specific proposal.

    More on the free spirit design ideas here...
    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=15877
    .
    Huh?

  87. #87

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    "Huh?" Maybe I should have used little carets.

    Quote Originally Posted by Admin View Post
    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...172#post597172

    The link to the arguments about the Milner's safety. Discuss that issue there. Please, for the love of my sanity, keep this thread to the architecture/design of the proposed remodel!
    Anyway, this is a neat idea:

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I think it would be great to build a glass casing around the building, with a glass hall in the back (across the Westin), something that could be used for various events. *We could also improve the connection with the LRT and Citadel, and give patrons a chance to use the ground level as a pedway.




    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    I concur with you on this. Just like an egg where the current structure remains- perhaps expand windows to allow for more natural light- with a glass shell around. Perhaps colorful paint could be applied to the original structure. The paint must be applied more intense than CC mall for it to be affective.
    Yeah I think we're deviating from the merits of this specific proposal.

    More on the free spirit design ideas here...
    http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=15877
    .
    Huh?
    Last edited by KC; 12-05-2014 at 06:46 PM.

  88. #88
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    Any updates on this proposal?

  89. #89
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    Yes - this great project is advancing with LRT underneath.





    http://www.canadianarchitect.com/new...ed/1003269303/
    Last edited by EdmTrekker; 25-09-2014 at 12:59 PM.

  90. #90

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    what?

  91. #91
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    ^ That's Calgary.

    Eve

  92. #92

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    It's nice.

  93. #93

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    EDMTrekker... Uhh thats Calgarys new main branch
    youtube.com/BrothersGrim
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  94. #94
    youtube.com/BrothersGrim
    facebook.com/BrothersGrimMusic

  95. #95

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    I like the Calgary one better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EdmTrekker View Post
    Yes - this great project is advancing with LRT underneath.





    http://www.canadianarchitect.com/new...ed/1003269303/
    I can't unsee it.

  97. #97

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    The city is growing and events will soon outgrow the space in Churchill Square so a way to essentially extend Churchill Square a full block to the south and better utilize the open air space on the south side of the library would be to completely clear the Library from its main floor, remove the walls and repurpose the whole floor space for festivals, events and activities.

    During events the roads space between the library and the Citadel Theatre and the Library and the hotel could then also be incorporated into the event space.

  98. #98
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    Here's the Milner design, from earlier in the thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hilman View Post
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  99. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by EscoffierLivesOn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by EdmTrekker View Post
    Yes - this great project is advancing with LRT underneath.





    http://www.canadianarchitect.com/new...ed/1003269303/
    I can't unsee it.

    Source

    A pale imitation and what is that exterior motif? Holstein? Perfect for them.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The city is growing and events will soon outgrow the space in Churchill Square so a way to essentially extend Churchill Square a full block to the south and better utilize the open air space on the south side of the library would be to completely clear the Library from its main floor, remove the walls and repurpose the whole floor space for festivals, events and activities.

    During events the roads space between the library and the Citadel Theatre and the Library and the hotel could then also be incorporated into the event space.
    "completely clear the Library from its main floor, remove the walls and repurpose the whole floor space for festivals, events and activities"

    Interesting idea...the library would "float" on the piles that hold the second floor up. That would open the area under it to allow connectivity from City Hall right through to the Westin...also cover for crowds when it rains etc. I wonder of it is possible to do...as it would visually open up and expand the festival area of the Square which is a good thing!!!

    It would lift the library up in a similar way as the Art Gallery of Toronto below:
    Last edited by EdmTrekker; 25-09-2014 at 06:16 PM.

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