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Thread: Aerotropolis @ YEG

  1. #1
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    Default Aerotropolis @ YEG

    Plans take off for Edmonton-area aerotropolis


    BY MARTY KLINKENBERG, EDMONTON JOURNAL JULY 3, 2014 7:43 AM

    It sounds like a dance step or something straight from the pages of science fiction, but Leduc planners are hopeful an aerotropolis will help the regional economy reach new heights.

    Aviation officials and representatives from the City of Leduc and Leduc County are collaborating on the project, which would see a 214-hectare parcel of land just south of Edmonton International Airport turned into a major development that would include hotels and restaurants, exhibition and conference centres, and manufacturing and distribution firms.

    “The idea is to use the airport as an economic lever,” said Myron Keehn, the vice-president of commercial development at Edmonton International Airport. “It is a collaborative approach to drive the economy.”

    One of only two airports in Canada identified as an emerging aerotropolis, Edmonton joins Vancouver in trying to duplicate the success of Amsterdam and Frankfurt, which have created successful economic corridors using a similar strategy. A portion of the parcel designated for the project, which has been under review for five years, overlaps with land proposed for annexation by the City of Edmonton.

    http://www.edmontonjournal.com/busin..._lsa=0ba1-2fb5
    www.decl.org

    Ottawa-Edmonton-Vancouver-Edmonton

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    Asides than the name how is this "straight from the pages of science fiction"? If they had PRT (God forbid that I raise that up) from the development to the parking lots maybe. But this is just fairly normal airport commercial/retail zone.

    In truth we do need more restaurants, fast food chains, hotels near the airport so I do think its desirable for the area. I hope they also reserve a corridor for future LRT and perhaps HST or commuter rail and some sort of rail shuttle from the area to the various parking lots to the terminal.

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    Strangely enough. between the airport and the various developments popping ip around it, I could almost see LRT getting to Leduc before St. Albert or Sherwood Park.

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    ^ i wouldn't bet a dollar on that statement.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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    Sounds like a recipe for more urban sprawl

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    Just do the math The daily commuting population of St albert compared to what...

    10 mill passengers- 10% catchment 2 trips per person over a full year. its like 5500 passengers a day.

    There are way more cost effective ways to do this.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

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    Plus the roughly 90,000 cars a day that travel down QE2.
    http://www.transportation.alberta.ca...13.pdf#page=10

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    Considering south Edmonton has just moved further south (the Allards etc) the city is very quickly moving airport bound. Note that the city has also grown just as fast northwards.

    Cities do this and with our economic outlook it will continue.

    I feel like I'm talking to a vegetarian about meat when I have these conversations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sundance View Post
    Plus the roughly 90,000 cars a day that travel down QE2.
    http://www.transportation.alberta.ca...13.pdf#page=10
    is the LRT going to go to Calgary?

    Anyways its redundant because the West LRT is the next priority.
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    Huh? Who is talking about LRT, I just mentioned allocating a corridor for the future. This thread is about Aerotropolis.

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    Once NW LRT gets to the Henday, if there are not concrete plans to extend into St. Albert, I predict that it will basically stay there. That location, with a large Park & Ride. would service St. Albert with no costs and large savings to that city.

    I'm just saying that having the airport and large numbers of businesses, hotels, shops, etc in the vicinity of the airport could see the LRT heading south before it gets to any of the more established suburbs. Stranger things have happened.

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    I have always believed that a transit corridor to the airport should be reserved so that development could take place around the concept. In time it would allow an LRT route to be developed . In the medium term , I could foresee a paved BRT route . Asphalt is relatively cheap . I think in this application it would work .

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    ^ a corridor has been reserved already. You can see it in the Airport master plan, and any NSP/ASP plans the city has for neighbourhoods it will pass through... I dont think there is any need to build the route until you are ready to go to full LRT. QEII works well enough already.

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    Someone wake me up when the LRT topic diversion has stopped and it goes back to the actual development.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Staples: Do we need a massive shopping complex way outside the city?
    ‘Aerotropolis’ plan highlights need for city to control development at EIA

    EDMONTON - What the heck is going on at the Edmonton International Airport?

    A number of Edmonton city councillors are starting to wonder about and question the so-called “aerotropolis” plan for commercial and industrial expansion in and around the airport.

    The City of Leduc, population 26,000, and the County of Leduc, population 12,000, are in on the Edmonton Regional Airports Authority’s aerotropolis plan. The three are hoping to build a massive commercial development south of the airport and its runways, both on county and airport lands. The aerotropolis is to include outlet stores, hotels, restaurants, exhibition and conference centres, and manufacturing and distribution firms.

    As for Edmonton, we have little control over what happens out there. It’s not our land; at least not yet, anyway.

    It has always been a sore point in Edmonton that our international airport is located so far outside the city, and the biggest question about the aerotropolis plan is on a related point — the notion of building a new outlet mall called The Landmark, with 85 stores, next to the airport.

    Some councillors wonder if The Landmark will be like the sprawling CrossIron Mills mall development on the highway north of Calgary.

    Is that kind of development green and smart city building? Shouldn’t a major shopping area be built nearer to its mass of clients?

    More:
    http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/...664/story.html
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    When is the annexation decision to take place?

    Why is the city and county of Leduc running the show over there?

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    The city is involved because they want to annex everything and are not content to live within their borders. Leduc County is involved because the airport is in Leduc County
    http://www.leduc-county.com/i-want-to/view/maps

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    Nothing but sprawl.
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    ^Agreed however let's not forget that it is not only Edmonton contributing to this. Let's thank the City of Leduc, the "hamlet?" of Sherwood Park, the City of Fort Saskatchewan, the City of St. Albert, Spruce Grove and Stony Plain for this as well.

    I have no problem with the City's annexation. The communities i mention have grown because of Edmonton and not the other way around. Last time i checked no one (relatively) from Edmonton is heading out to Sherwood Park Mall to buy anything.

    Let YEG create more revenue for themselves any way they see fit otherwise the City and County of Leduc will do it on the backs of YEG's coat tails.

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    You've never seen the Sherwood Park Costco liquor store, have ya?

    People will come from far & wide to get their drink on for cheap.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

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    I never thought anything was cheap in Sherwood Park except the..... ahh never mind.

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    Anyhoos, I think this whole bruhaha is, to quote my favourite playrite, much ado about nothing.

    Urban sprawl? Yeah - we have it - from Morinville to south Leduc, we have urban sprawl.

    This development isn't extending the sprawl, it's occuring within it. It's not land that's being farmed. It's surplus airport land.

    I think some councillors are having a hissy fit over potential lost tax revenues (assuming this thing would be otherwise developed within city boundaries).

    Bring it on - anything to subsidize EIA operations that isn't my (already high) airport improvement fee has my support.
    ... gobsmacked

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    I think it might be better for this complex to focus on entertainment.
    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

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    What would be the chances of having the LRT extended to the airport with the Aerotropolis?
    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

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    ^ Not...

    we would wind up with better bus service to the airport however.
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    Attention shoppers: Buses to CrossIron Mills are ready to roll
    http://www.calgaryherald.com/travel/...723/story.html

    $12 dollars round trip.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I think it might be better for this complex to focus on entertainment.
    No way. Only way to get there is to drive. Entertainment = drinking, most of the time.
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    cant wait to shop at "South South Edmonton Common"
    be offended! figure out why later...

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    "Leduc County Common"
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Leduc already has a "Leduc common" area.

    The anchors for the new "outlet mall" have already started to leak in.

    Bed Bath and Beyond will be one of the tenants for the project.

    But mixing industrial in so close to the proposed mall sounds kinda shady. If that's the case why don't the put the thing in the middle of Nisku??? Grrr.

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    Garbage and wont exist in 50-60 years. Or will be a shell of its former self.

    I wont use / support it, but I still see it being it a hit in YEG.

    Most YEGers love sprawl. They love the McMansions. They love the Henday. They love the SUV drive from the attached garage to the front door of Moxies.

    This is a reflection of what people want. And until the shift of YEGers is more anti-sprawl / infill / condensed living this is the sort of developments we will continue to see.
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    ^ You do realize in its day, Beverly was its own jurisdiction that represented urban sprawl?
    ... gobsmacked

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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    ^ You do realize in its day, Beverly was its own jurisdiction that represented urban sprawl?
    So was Old Strathcona. Oliver used to be the west end of town. What's your point? Are only people who live in the core allowed to comment on sprawl?
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    Well that's interesting. I wasn't suggesting any opinion on sprawl other than to suggest that whatever else anyone may think of this development, it's well within what we've alrerady spawled out to be.

    To your point though - Strathcona was end of the CPR line. Except for Canada choosing to put the seat of government in "Edmonton," you could argue that Edmonton was the sprawl in its day.
    ... gobsmacked

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    Well, they chose to give Strathcona the University, while Edmonton got the Legislature.
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    Thereby creating approx 100 years of Calgary-Edmonton emnity, which shows meagre but promising progress towards ending sometime in the next 100 years.
    ... gobsmacked

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    Quote Originally Posted by Komrade View Post
    Garbage and wont exist in 50-60 years. Or will be a shell of its former self.

    I wont use / support it, but I still see it being it a hit in YEG.

    Most YEGers love sprawl. They love the McMansions. They love the Henday. They love the SUV drive from the attached garage to the front door of Moxies.

    This is a reflection of what people want. And until the shift of YEGers is more anti-sprawl / infill / condensed living this is the sort of developments we will continue to see.
    Judging people for driving SUV's is passe Komrade. In our climate, I will only drive an SUV now for the ground clearance and AWD. Back when a Suburban got 8 miles to the gallon it was fun to mock, but now small SUV's are fuel efficient and even come in hybrids.

    I'd replace SUV with BMW or jacked up truck.

    The rest of your post is accurate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chmilz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Komrade View Post
    Garbage and wont exist in 50-60 years. Or will be a shell of its former self.

    I wont use / support it, but I still see it being it a hit in YEG.

    Most YEGers love sprawl. They love the McMansions. They love the Henday. They love the SUV drive from the attached garage to the front door of Moxies.

    This is a reflection of what people want. And until the shift of YEGers is more anti-sprawl / infill / condensed living this is the sort of developments we will continue to see.
    Judging people for driving SUV's is passe Komrade. In our climate, I will only drive an SUV now for the ground clearance and AWD. Back when a Suburban got 8 miles to the gallon it was fun to mock, but now small SUV's are fuel efficient and even come in hybrids.

    I'd replace SUV with BMW or jacked up truck.

    The rest of your post is accurate.
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    Shouldn't we all be sensitive; when we are, we're more thoughtful all around.

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    My lady drives an SUV. Great vehicles

    I dont know if Beverly represents sprawl even back then. Beverly was developed around an industry (coal)

    I suppose we could argue that the suburbs of today are developed to service the needs of the refinery workers, but i think thats a stretch.
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    Okay - how about Jasper Place then? JP represented an old suburban model where living further away from the core allowed folks to buy houses at a lower price.

    Now, with some of the very upscale subdivisions in St. Albert and Sherwood Park, the model is totally different.

    And, as I've often said, Edmonton's many different employment centres makes the definition of sprawl a moving target at best.

    Someone living in Terwilliger (or McGrath let's say) is arguably promoting sprawl if they work DT.

    But if they work in Nisku, or YEG, are they promoting sprawl?
    ... gobsmacked

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    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/c...w/46559639.cms

    AP plans aerotropolis at Bhogapuram

    TNN | Mar 14, 2015, 01.15 AM IST



    VISAKHAPATNAM: Andhra Pradesh is likely to get a world-class international airport soon with the Chandrababu Naidu government mooting an aerotropolis (airport city) at Bhogapuram in the neighbouring district of Vizianagaram.

    The aerotropolis, which will comprise an airport, maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) facility along with an aviation academy to provide the requisite training facilities for the aviation sector, has already been put on the fast track by the government, which is gunning for all the necessary clearances within the next one year.

    "We have already submitted a report seeking site clearance from the Union ministry of civil aviation and will soon take it up with the environment ministry also," said energy, investment and infrastructure secretary Ajay Jain on the sidelines of the launch of the infrastructure mission here on Friday. He said the project will be taken up in the PPP mode with the state holding stake in the form of land holdings.

    According to Jain, the government has already appointed engineering consultancy firm RITES to prepare a detailed techno-economic feasibility report (TEFR). RITES is expected to take around eight to nine months to submit the final TEFR to the government, which plans to set up a special purpose vehicle (SPV) for the project. Incidentally, finance minister Yanamala Ramakrishnudu had announced the government's intent to set up the greenfield airport in the budget on Thursday.

    Sources said the project will require around 18 different clearances from the Union government, apart from more than 10 clearances from the state government. "We are planning to undertake land pooling of around 15,000 acres for the project. Around 5,000 acres will be set aside for the airport and another 5,000 acres for the MRO and aviation academy facilities. The remaining 5,000 acres will be given back to the farmers as developed plots," Jain said.

    "We saw in Hyderabad that after the airport was developed, the land prices skyrocketed. So we want to give the benefit back to the farmers, who will otherwise feel that they lost out on land at a very low price," he added.

    With the project expected to take around 4-5 years for completion, Jain said the state, with the assistance of the civil aviation ministry, will attract more airlines to the existing Vizag Airport in the meantime.

    On the fast track

    * Aerotropolis to comprise an airport, maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) facility, an aviation academy

    * Project to taken up in the PPP mode

    * Project will require 18 clearances from the Centre and over 10 from the state governmentLatest Comment

    goodchandu







    * Govt to pool 15,000 acres, of which 5,000 acres will be returned to farmers as developed plots

    * Government has already appointed engineering consultancy firm RITES to prepare a detailed techno-economic feasibility report

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    This thread still makes me chuckle.

    Instead of discussion around Aerotropolis and any requisite business benefits... we get downtown focused, anti sprawl car haters.

    What's next? Demanding YEG pack up its bags and move downtown? Wait....oops.....did I just say that????

    C'mon C2E hivers...the world is so much more than your glass encrusted phallic symbols (architecture by Lego) ...surrounded by your man bun loving resto-bar...requiring a whole new dictionary of hipster verbal diarrhoea...

    Aerotropolis is a business model that diversifies the income of the airport with items not solely reliant on passenger volumes. While I chuckle at some of the new tenants...I applaud the overall design. While the hipster downtown only crowd is too busy debating shutting down streets for patios, the airport needs revenue...and the hipsters lamenting no new businesses to fill seats are only doing that....lamenting while sipping on another cup of their organic Mocha-Chokha bull**** and posting yet another use less Twitter pic of their meal.

    ...give YEG credit. They're diversifying..
    Onward and upward

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    If there's a nuclear war the downtowns will get hit directly first thing. lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardS View Post
    C'mon C2E hivers...the world is so much more than your glass encrusted phallic symbols (architecture by Lego) ...surrounded by your man bun loving resto-bar...requiring a whole new dictionary of hipster verbal diarrhoea...
    After being in LA 6 years, some comments on C2E make the San Vicente / Brentwood area look positively down to earth in comparison!

    At least the man buns have mostly moved over to Echo Park.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones
    If there's a nuclear war the downtowns will get hit directly first thing. lol


    Airports, whether civilian or military, would be right at the top of the list as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones
    If there's a nuclear war the downtowns will get hit directly first thing. lol


    Airports, whether civilian or military, would be right at the top of the list as well.
    ...

    ...and a small 1 MT bomb placed anywhere within 20 miles would take them all out...doesn't matter...



    Quote Originally Posted by MylesC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RichardS View Post
    C'mon C2E hivers...the world is so much more than your glass encrusted phallic symbols (architecture by Lego) ...surrounded by your man bun loving resto-bar...requiring a whole new dictionary of hipster verbal diarrhoea...
    After being in LA 6 years, some comments on C2E make the San Vicente / Brentwood area look positively down to earth in comparison!

    At least the man buns have mostly moved over to Echo Park.
    LOL

    But seriously...no one is building Aerotropolis to somehow incent urban dwellers to purchase an SUV and drive out to YEG. What's out there is either logistics oriented, out there for space+access to ulilities, or attracting the market that is already driving. The outlet mall will attract people in the surrounding towns and south Edmonton...already built up areas. The movement of development can be inward towards Edmonton. Why does sprawl need to come up on every conversation around here?

    "we're gonna build an outlet mall and watch downtown become a ghost town!!!"....said no EIA employee ever...
    Onward and upward

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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardS View Post
    This thread still makes me chuckle.

    Instead of discussion around Aerotropolis and any requisite business benefits... we get downtown focused, anti sprawl car haters.

    What's next? Demanding YEG pack up its bags and move downtown? Wait....oops.....did I just say that????

    C'mon C2E hivers...the world is so much more than your glass encrusted phallic symbols (architecture by Lego) ...surrounded by your man bun loving resto-bar...requiring a whole new dictionary of hipster verbal diarrhoea...

    Aerotropolis is a business model that diversifies the income of the airport with items not solely reliant on passenger volumes. While I chuckle at some of the new tenants...I applaud the overall design. While the hipster downtown only crowd is too busy debating shutting down streets for patios, the airport needs revenue...and the hipsters lamenting no new businesses to fill seats are only doing that....lamenting while sipping on another cup of their organic Mocha-Chokha bull**** and posting yet another use less Twitter pic of their meal.

    ...give YEG credit. They're diversifying..


    Not denying your chance to vent, but are you replying to three-year-old posts?
    Let's make Edmonton better.

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    Thanks for not denying...like you could deny me???

    note I said this thread STILL makes me chuckle?

    ...now...run back and continue blaming long dead premiers for 100% of Edmonton's woes...
    Onward and upward

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    So that's a "yes."

    Good to know former C2E regulars are equally important to premiers, BTW.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

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    Ahhhhh...I love the scent of sanctimonious hypocrisy...you sure make me smile...

    No wonder I keep reading. I need my chuckles...
    Onward and upward

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    ^ I'm with you on the chuckles, rich.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

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    Default More development being proposed around the Edmonton International Airport

    Progress is being made with a Chinese company to be a major developer in an industrial expansion around the Edmonton International Airport, according to the mayor of the City of Leduc.
    http://www.cjob.com/syn/110/167196/167196
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    Like. Super duper. The article mentions 65 ave S.W. As if it's an Edmonton address. It's actually 65 ave in Leduc. Proposed interchange at 65 ave (McDs) over the QE2 to Twp. Rd. 500 which borders the airport land on the south.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 09-04-2017 at 01:22 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Like. Super duper. The article mentions 65 ave S.W. As if it's an Edmonton address. It's actually 65 ave in Leduc. Proposed interchange at 65 ave (McDs) over the QE2 to Twp. Rd. 500 which borders the airport land on the south.
    ZERO reason why taxpayers in Edmonton would give a penny to that .... the beating the Mayor or Council would take will be fatal.

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    ^Could be part of the annexation negotiations.
    “Canada is the only country in the world that knows how to live without an identity,”-Marshall McLuhan

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    Quote Originally Posted by Glenco View Post
    ^Could be part of the annexation negotiations.
    Not going to fly with Edmonton voters - if Edmonton pays for roadwork in another municipality. I think it will be found to be illegal - and there will be **** all over Iveson and it will stick to him forever for trying to do it. I am happy to contribute a couple if grand to a taxpayer funded court challenge and provide a whipping to the Mayor and any Councillor that supports Edmonton Property Taxes to be used in another municipality. I can hear the screams now. No back room deals and no fooking around with Taypayer money.

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    I think you are getting your knickers in a twist for no reason.

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    ^ I honestly have no idea what the hell he's babbling about, which is about par with him.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Alberta poised to be a world leader in cannabis production with Aurora Sky facility

    http://www.vueweekly.com/alberta-poi...-sky-facility/

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    Airport Support
    When asked about Aurora’s partnership with Edmonton International Airport, Battley said that the airport has been very supportive, and that they understand Aurora’s business strategy.


    “Aurora currently has the most well-developed e-commerce strategy in the commerce sector,” Battley said. “We’re the only company with a mobile app for Android and Apple for the purchase of legal cannabis, and in addition to that, we have same-day delivery in two large metropolitan centers and Edmonton.”


    Battley said the mobile app and delivery service have been extremely popular, and having Aurora Sky positioned at Edmonton International Airport will give the company the opportunity to expand both same- and next-day delivery strategies across the country and internationally. Battley said being located at the airport also gives Aurora access to outstanding utilities and security.


    Aurora Sky’s official groundbreaking ceremony last month drew between 100-150 attendees, including the mayor of Leduc County, the mayor of the city of Leduc and the Alberta Minister of Municipal affairs.


    “There’s just a tremendous amount of excitement and support at every level in Alberta,” Battley said. “Everybody sees the economic development potential here.”
    http://www.cannabisbusinesstimes.com...onton-airport/

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    ACI joins Alberta Aerospace and Technology Centre at EIA
    Posted on August 1, 2017


    Absolute Combustion International (ACI) has become a full member of Alberta Aerospace and Technology Center (AATC) located at Edmonton International Airport (EIA). ACI will be continuing the research and development of its combustion technology, to identify and create new and innovative solutions for the aerospace industry.

    Its goal is to create devices that will allow airports to cut emissions, decrease maintenance and increase the safety of its heating equipment. AATC offers ACI an incredible opportunity to gain industry partnerships and market its aerospace innovations both locally and internationally.

    “ACI decided to move our operations over to EIA and join AATC after we had the opportunity to meet and travel to Asia with AATC members. This all came about due to the efforts of the Alberta Economic Development and Trade office,” said Koleya Karringten, president of ACI. “Once EIA and Canadian North Airlines saw our technology, they thought it would be a perfect fit in the aerospace industry, specifically as an aircraft boarding gate heater. The opportunity to collaborate on our latest product design with EIA and Canadian North Airlines was a once in a lifetime opportunity for our small startup company.

    “Canadian North Airlines even agreed to allow us to test our proof of concept design on their Boeing 737 aircraft. The test went better than anyone could have anticipated and now it has led to a new opportunity to develop a new Jet way heater for EIA.”
    https://www.skiesmag.com/press-relea....MGQ5UKyI.uxfs

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    Just wondering if the old terminal building can be repurposed into a small business center with rental offices and boardrooms?

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    Anyone know more about this tweet from EIA on their web page:
    "RT @thebinster: Unnoticed yesterday: new regional econ dev agency Edmonton Global with chair @gkrischke starts board and CEO search #yeg #y…"

    Also who is this group called Alberta International Region
    http://www.internationalregion.com/A...ontact-Us.aspx

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    ^ It appears one of many groups that represent the business interests of the YEG metro area and EIA specifically.

    Until we are able to speak with one voice it will not be helpful in growing business at EIA.

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    Seems the Mayor of Leduc is front and centre of both of these groups ... wonder about the branding of "Edmonton" Global being ran out of Leduc. Maybe Edmonton City Council are asleep or Iveson is playing silly games again pretending to be the regional conciliator.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocket252 View Post
    Just wondering if the old terminal building can be repurposed into a small business center with rental offices and boardrooms?
    Not a lot, but north terminal gates still get used. Now, old tower - that's a great idea.
    ... gobsmacked

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    What's in the old tower now?
    Nisi Dominus Frustra

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    As far as I can tell ... nadda. Seems, for the moment, to be a giant Lexus billboard.
    ... gobsmacked

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