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Thread: Enough of these 'I'm Offended, It's not Politically Correct' people already

  1. #701
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    Top_Dawg absolutely loves these little ironies.

    http://www.metronews.ca/news/edmonto...=1515635622376

  2. #702
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    He has since incorporated Make it Awkward, and he said he hopes to one day make a comfortable living off the campaign.
    Very altruistic of him. It's not even a non-profit.

  3. #703
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    Perhaps what he really needs is corporate sponsorship
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Looks like the city has already kicked in 30k. Their claim that because they're just buying tickets for youths to attend the conference and therefore they're not funding a for-profit corporation is totally bunk. And for what it's worth, I take his word that the event will be lucky to break even. My concern isn't the conference. My concern is that social advocacy isn't supposed to be for profit. The fact he and his wife incorporated Make it Awkward as a for-profit business makes me very suspicious of what their true motivations are here. And private corporations will wonder the exact same thing and will be virtually guaranteed to not be interested in providing sponsorship.

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    I think we can all agree that Lipscombe needs to improve his event organizational management skills. $445 a head to listen to mostly-local activists is ridiculous, given that it costs less than 1/4 of that to attend panels by Hollywood celebrities at the Edmonton Expo.

    For-Profit Activism? Now that’s Awkward
    http://www.metronews.ca/views/opinio...s-awkward.html
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  6. #706

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    Like pulling the Hitler card, this writer pulled the Stalin card:



    Don Martin: Political correctness behind Sir John A. pub name change

    By Don Martin, Power Play Host, January 11, 2018 5:52PM EST


    “Surely this is a sign of hyper-reactive cleansing for the sake of political correctness, a small step toward the sort of Stalinist purging of people from Soviet history.

    True, Macdonald's record has a big black mark for being the presiding prime minister when Indigenous residential schools began their aggressive and abusive assimilation of children into the white man’s culture.

    But these schools flourished in the 1930s and persisted right up until 20 years ago without any subsequent prime ministerial intervention to stop them. ...”

    https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/don-...ange-1.3755807

  7. #707
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    I think we can all agree that Lipscombe needs to improve his event organizational management skills. $445 a head to listen to mostly-local activists is ridiculous, given that it costs less than 1/4 of that to attend panels by Hollywood celebrities at the Edmonton Expo.

    For-Profit Activism? Now that’s Awkward
    http://www.metronews.ca/views/opinio...s-awkward.html
    I was out of town and didn't follow what happened on social media the last few days, but did happen to come across an apology from Lipscombe. Sounds like he got extremely defensive about the criticism and made things worse for himself. Apparently he called Danielle Paradis a "**** journalist" because of her Metro article. Here's the apology, copied from his Facebook page (which appears to be mostly public, I don't know him myself):

    An apology from #Makeitawkward, but specifically from me.Please share so those that need to hear can.
    #MakeItAwkward would like to apologize unequivocally for a very insensitive comment. Saying that “poor is a state of mind” was wrong. Although we didn’t mean it as it’s been interpreted, the intention is irrelevant. It was unacceptable and not representative of how we feel. Poverty is truly vicious reality for too many people.

    We would like to apologize for not taking criticism as well as we should have. Our movement is all about Making It Awkward, and when some of our critics made it awkward for us, we responded by being defensive instead of introspective. We are learning and committed to listening better.

    We are sorry for any confusion surrounding what our event is about. Our event was always intended to be professional and personal development for folks in leadership and management positions – people who could learn about Inclusivity and bring it back to their respective environments. Though that was our target audience, we also wanted to open it up to as many people as possible – hence the tiered pricing and free live-streaming. Perhaps we cast our net too broadly and in so doing wound up excluding where we wanted to be inclusive. We have learned so much already from the feedback, and we will do better next time.
    We are sorry for our mistakes. We will probably make more. But we believe in our event. We believe in the value of the presentations of our three-day summit. The content, our speakers and our shared goals are to make better Edmontonians and the space they occupy more inclusive.

    Bolding mine. That line, is in my opinion, quite important on what his thinking and strategy is for his private, for-profit venture. He's decided to become a diversity consultant to get some of those sweet, sweet corporate dollars. At least he clarified his true motivations, whether he meant to or not.

  8. #708
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    I was unaware of his snit with Metro.
    Last I heard, just before the weekend an issue was raised re: city funding

    https://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/criticis...vent-1.3757902
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  9. #709
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    He's making money!

  10. #710
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    Quote Originally Posted by CTV Article above
    Lipscombe is promising financial transparency when he tallies up the cost of the summit, currently estimated - he tells CTV NEWS - at $140,000.
    Well, if MIA was a non-profit, we'd all be able to review audited financial statements of the organization, instead of hoping he comes good on his promises of transparency that actually have no legal or fiduciary basis with which to be enforced. If he wants to be a diversity consultant as opposed to a true advocate, then just say so. He should stop trying to have it both ways.
    Last edited by Marcel Petrin; 15-01-2018 at 02:16 PM.

  11. #711

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    Lipscombe seems to know a lot about making it awkward..
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  12. #712
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Lipscombe seems to know a lot about making it awkward..
    Yes, he sure does!

  13. #713

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Like pulling the Hitler card, this writer pulled the Stalin card:



    Don Martin: Political correctness behind Sir John A. pub name change

    By Don Martin, Power Play Host, January 11, 2018 5:52PM EST


    “Surely this is a sign of hyper-reactive cleansing for the sake of political correctness, a small step toward the sort of Stalinist purging of people from Soviet history.

    True, Macdonald's record has a big black mark for being the presiding prime minister when Indigenous residential schools began their aggressive and abusive assimilation of children into the white man’s culture.

    But these schools flourished in the 1930s and persisted right up until 20 years ago without any subsequent prime ministerial intervention to stop them. ...”

    https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/don-...ange-1.3755807
    I am not a fan of Martin. Yes, I agree it would be helpful if he left the hyperbole about Stalinism out of it. Of course, Stalin did a lot of bad things, but he has nothing to do with this, this is a 100% Canadian issue and bringing up Stalin mostly only muddies the issues.

    However, I do understand the point I think Martin was trying to make that MacDonald was not the only one responsible for this and should not be solely blamed. Yes, he was the first Prime Minister, but he was only carrying on the type of treatment and attitudes that existed before him and this continued on way after him, just as George Washington was not the first or last slave owner in the US. I do think the targeting of here MacDonald reflects a misunderstanding of history or is based on some sort of revisionism by people who do not really understand Canadian history.

  14. #714

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    Could this 'Make it Awkward' event not have been held at a less expensive place. Rent out a hall or a community space and hire/invite 2-3 food trucks to be outside. Now I'm sure in between speakers and talkers and squawkers there would be time to go out and have a bite. I get the impression this event is more for the movers and shakers in this town and not the actual downtrodden regular abused Joe Public (of any race or creed). A chance for those with the cash to be seen and also to be seen as worldly and all encompassing and the rest of the crap these SJW want you to swallow. Meanwhile the people who have actually been in the mist of bigotry/exclusion/hate crime/ etc are left outside with their noses pressed up against the window.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  15. #715

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    Ottawa "human rights advocate" is sad to hear that a hate crime was a hoax and that an 11-year old girl in Ontario wasn't really assaulted:


    "Amira Elghawaby, a human rights advocate based in Ottawa, said she was saddened to learn that the girl's story was not true, adding it will likely only serve to embolden "those who do hold discriminatory views of Muslims."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...tack-1.4487716

  16. #716

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Ottawa "human rights advocate" is sad to hear that a hate crime was a hoax and that an 11-year old girl in Ontario wasn't really assaulted:


    "Amira Elghawaby, a human rights advocate based in Ottawa, said she was saddened to learn that the girl's story was not true, adding it will likely only serve to embolden "those who do hold discriminatory views of Muslims."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...tack-1.4487716
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.

  17. #717

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    Little children cry wolf sometimes. It has happened for centuries. I remember such stories decades ago where children claimed they were taken but later revealed they ran away from home and the like...


    We have a child who crys wolf often and lies all the time in 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.
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  18. #718

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.

    This is becoming a huge problem with news nowadays. Stories make headlines everywhere, but the retractions/corrections/follow-ups do not.

    You see this all the time on Twitter and Facebook pages for news outlets - original stories get shared or re-posted thousands of times, and the later "correction" maybe gets only gets passed on couple of hundred times.

  19. #719

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Ottawa "human rights advocate" is sad to hear that a hate crime was a hoax and that an 11-year old girl in Ontario wasn't really assaulted:


    "Amira Elghawaby, a human rights advocate based in Ottawa, said she was saddened to learn that the girl's story was not true, adding it will likely only serve to embolden "those who do hold discriminatory views of Muslims."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...tack-1.4487716
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.
    Activists said that we shouldn't let it distract us from the real epidemic of islamophobia.

    I think it should. It's the very focus on "islamophobia" that probably influenced the child to make up the story, thinking it credible, and led to the media circus orchestrated by the Toronto school board & police service, and all the widespread attention, and in the end the massive embarrassment to all involved.


    Not saying that actual incidents should be ignored. They should be investigated and if possible prosecuted. Some might be local news. But it's the focus spawns resentment on both sides, inspires copycats or revenge.

    Treat it like suicide, really.
    There can only be one.

  20. #720
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Ottawa "human rights advocate" is sad to hear that a hate crime was a hoax and that an 11-year old girl in Ontario wasn't really assaulted:


    "Amira Elghawaby, a human rights advocate based in Ottawa, said she was saddened to learn that the girl's story was not true, adding it will likely only serve to embolden "those who do hold discriminatory views of Muslims."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...tack-1.4487716

    The girl should apologise.

  21. #721

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.

    This is becoming a huge problem with news nowadays. Stories make headlines everywhere, but the retractions/corrections/follow-ups do not.

    You see this all the time on Twitter and Facebook pages for news outlets - original stories get shared or re-posted thousands of times, and the later "correction" maybe gets only gets passed on couple of hundred times.
    People will weaponize this story to paint the media as fake and use this singular example as proof.

    It was true that she said she was attacked and the police did investigate the alleged incident and the media reported the same. The police got to the truth and the media reported the same. No retractions are necessary.

    We cannot use this example to say all other allegations are false and should not be reported or investigated. Otherwise we might as well get rid of our Amber Alert system because one child who goes missing, just slept over at a friend's house.
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  22. #722

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Ottawa "human rights advocate" is sad to hear that a hate crime was a hoax and that an 11-year old girl in Ontario wasn't really assaulted:


    "Amira Elghawaby, a human rights advocate based in Ottawa, said she was saddened to learn that the girl's story was not true, adding it will likely only serve to embolden "those who do hold discriminatory views of Muslims."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...tack-1.4487716
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.
    Activists said that we shouldn't let it distract us from the real epidemic of islamophobia.

    I think it should. It's the very focus on "islamophobia" that probably influenced the child to make up the story, thinking it credible, and led to the media circus orchestrated by the Toronto school board & police service, and all the widespread attention, and in the end the massive embarrassment to all involved.


    Not saying that actual incidents should be ignored. They should be investigated and if possible prosecuted. Some might be local news. But it's the focus spawns resentment on both sides, inspires copycats or revenge.

    Treat it like suicide, really.
    “Epidemic”. Sad characterization.

    Also, the human rights person I saw speak in TV only spoke about the Islamic issue ;like the comment above about (Islamaphobia) and in the clip I saw didn’t mention others such as anti-semitism. Not expected but I’m wary of people only “talking their book” and not giving a damn about others rights.

  23. #723

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    Here's a good article on the school board/ family / police / media /politician response:

    http://edmontonjournal.com/news/toro...6-2de8c21d6323
    There can only be one.

  24. #724

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.

    This is becoming a huge problem with news nowadays. Stories make headlines everywhere, but the retractions/corrections/follow-ups do not.

    You see this all the time on Twitter and Facebook pages for news outlets - original stories get shared or re-posted thousands of times, and the later "correction" maybe gets only gets passed on couple of hundred times.
    People will weaponize this story to paint the media as fake and use this singular example as proof.

    It was true that she said she was attacked and the police did investigate the alleged incident and the media reported the same. The police got to the truth and the media reported the same. No retractions are necessary.

    We cannot use this example to say all other allegations are false and should not be reported or investigated. Otherwise we might as well get rid of our Amber Alert system because one child who goes missing, just slept over at a friend's house.
    That’s how it works. Execute one innocent person and that gets used against the practice of capital punishment. Does professional media want to be “perceived” as credible or largely credible or somewhat credible or just entertaining.

    When errors and misstatements are made and others disseminate those errors far and wide, what is the responsibility of the original propagators in order to correct the record?
    Last edited by KC; 16-01-2018 at 09:05 AM.

  25. #725

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    People will weaponize this story to paint the media as fake and use this singular example as proof.

    I am merely using this singular example (there are others) to paint the media as irresponsible. Should we not allowed to do that?

    I think it is insulting to all of Canada the way the media and professional commentators weaponized this child's claim as if it was a factual event. Because of the media's rush to "pump up" this fake victim story before they had all the facts, the hoax made international news and made our entire country look terrible. Meanwhile, the fact that it DID make national news just underlines how rare attacks like this actually are in our tolerant country.

  26. #726

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    Here’s a good example of authoritarian societies (dictatorships) control over what can be said. Literal political correctness:

    Saudi prince 'fired after audio tape contradicts state' | Saudi Arabia News | Al Jazeera

    “Bin Saud reportedly stands accused of contradicting the official state version, “

    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/0...075659964.html

  27. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.

    This is becoming a huge problem with news nowadays. Stories make headlines everywhere, but the retractions/corrections/follow-ups do not.

    You see this all the time on Twitter and Facebook pages for news outlets - original stories get shared or re-posted thousands of times, and the later "correction" maybe gets only gets passed on couple of hundred times.
    Muslim, hijab..click bait...!

  28. #728

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The original story spread world wide debasing Canada in the eyes of most people. I don’t know if the non-fake news went very far. Good old media’s rush to publish.

    This is becoming a huge problem with news nowadays. Stories make headlines everywhere, but the retractions/corrections/follow-ups do not.

    You see this all the time on Twitter and Facebook pages for news outlets - original stories get shared or re-posted thousands of times, and the later "correction" maybe gets only gets passed on couple of hundred times.
    People will weaponize this story to paint the media as fake and use this singular example as proof.

    It was true that she said she was attacked and the police did investigate the alleged incident and the media reported the same. The police got to the truth and the media reported the same. No retractions are necessary.

    We cannot use this example to say all other allegations are false and should not be reported or investigated. Otherwise we might as well get rid of our Amber Alert system because one child who goes missing, just slept over at a friend's house.
    This is not the point. All the activists and Trudeau milked this incident as further proof and reasons to bang the islamophobia drum one more time. To illustrate and amplify how heinous this was that it occurred and we'd been hearing it nonstop ever since. So that in its wake we were reminded how islamophobic the nation was and what a scourge it is, then, (and I can only view this with humor) the activists I saw on TV expressed even more concern now that filthy backlash would occur and that now this girl was in more danger blah blah blah.

    Its the clearest case of devil in the details. Islamophobia rhetoric being furthered whether the incident did or didn't occur and the vitriolic reaction being the same. That's a disturbing aspect of it that people can question. That a non instance occurred here and yet Islamophobia condemnation is furthered on a non event that never happened. The latter of which never really makes the news as much as the original grandstanding. Which Trudeau is resolutely happy to do so within a minutes notice.

    I don't single handedly blame this solely on the media though I am more concerned with a new found level of activism that behaves as it if wants there to be problems to further their own endeavors as paid activists professionally speaking out about the problems. We have one of those here as well in Jesse Lipscombe who wants to be earning his income on the basis of recounting prejudice here. He wants this to be his job. To call out racism here. This is the new for profit activism. But I wonder if the world gets better through such favor.
    Last edited by Replacement; 16-01-2018 at 11:33 AM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  29. #729

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    ^Have to feel sorry for this young girl. I suppose we will never know the reason she did this. I'm wondering if she did not want to wear her scarf for school but was told to by her parents. She is at an age where a little bit of rebellion happens. Anyway, in a time honored fashion of kids all the world over I wonder if she threw her brother under the bus.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  30. #730

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^Have to feel sorry for this young girl. I suppose we will never know the reason she did this. I'm wondering if she did not want to wear her scarf for school but was told to by her parents. She is at an age where a little bit of rebellion happens. Anyway, in a time honored fashion of kids all the world over I wonder if she threw her brother under the bus.
    For sure I would feel sorry for the girl. But we live in such a currently reactionary crazed nation looking for news, and with a PM only so glad to make this todays news that one little thing like this gets amplified from a school yard setting to international news. That's the level of crazy entered into, that everybody should be taking a concerned look at.

    A similar level of crazy that has occurred around the nation and that causes for instance a University to clam that a TA showed "Something like showing a speech by Hitler" by showing a debate about the use of pronouns.

    Its the reactionary zeal that is crazy. Or again the paid activism that allows this to occur at Wilfred Laurier and for the manager of Gendered Violence Prevention and Support, Adria Joel, and the professor to attack Lindsay Shepard as if she were a stomping Nazi brownshirt. Boiled down though I worry about having paid activists in position on site who see it as there job to create and stir controversy even where none exists and apparently as furthering the need for their own paid mission. To what end effect? Certainly not legitimacy.
    Last edited by Replacement; 16-01-2018 at 12:05 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  31. #731

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^Have to feel sorry for this young girl. I suppose we will never know the reason she did this.
    The first thought in my mind is she tore it accidentally (playing or whatever), and was afraid of getting punished by her parents. So she made up a story about somebody else doing it to her and running away, and the story escalated from there. But we will never know.

    I, for one, am glad that it turned out to be a hoax instead of some creep assaulting 11-year-olds.

  32. #732

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^Have to feel sorry for this young girl. I suppose we will never know the reason she did this. I'm wondering if she did not want to wear her scarf for school but was told to by her parents. She is at an age where a little bit of rebellion happens. Anyway, in a time honored fashion of kids all the world over I wonder if she threw her brother under the bus.
    For sure I would feel sorry for the girl. But we live in such a currently reactionary crazed nation looking for news, and with a PM only so glad to make this todays news that one little thing like this gets amplified from a school yard setting to international news. That's the level of crazy entered into, that everybody should be taking a concerned look at.

    A similar level of crazy that has occurred around the nation and that causes for instance a University to clam that a TA showed "Something like showing a speech by Hitler" by showing a debate about the use of pronouns.

    Its the reactionary zeal that is crazy. Or again the paid activism that allows this to occur at Wilfred Laurier and for the manager of Gendered Violence Prevention and Support, Adria Joel, and the professor to attack Lindsay Shepard as if she were a stomping Nazi brownshirt. Boiled down though I worry about having paid activists in position on site who see it as there job to create and stir controversy even where none exists and apparently as furthering the need for their own paid mission. To what end effect? Certainly not legitimacy.
    I'm betting this young kid is just wishing the whole thing would just go away. Yes, there are way to many SJW ready to pick up a cause and be offended for themselves and other people too. To much over the top knee jerk reaction to everything. Nobody knew at the time this girl was making this story up and it got out of hand. The sad thing is that if this happened again and was actually true how many people are going to take notice.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  33. #733

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    As a society we are of course reinforcing a paradigm. Kind of a bizarre one. Any child could now know that if I make up something I could be talked about by my prime minister and world media within the hour and well before there is any confirmation whatsoever of what is alleged to have occurred. I can't fathom what a distortion of power that is that comes from this nature of reactionary zeal. I can't imagine what a child would think today about her world being so whacked that all this out of control reaction occurred. It would be scary in itself. If I made something up as a child and it made world news the same day as a reasonably sentient child I would just assume the world is insane.

    I wonder about a kid being sent to his/her room for a timeout just speed dialing the Prime Minister to claim injustice or refugee status..

    OK I'm jk with the latter but these are some crazy times.
    Last edited by Replacement; 16-01-2018 at 12:39 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  34. #734

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    ^I don't think that the girl who had the hijab incident woke up that morning thinking this is what I am going to do today. Whatever circumstances happened I think they just got out of hand and then she had no control over it. She probably told one person then that one person tweeted another then before you know it it's half way around the world in 10 minutes. Then you get Tater Tot in on it. I'm sure this girl is worried sick about all this and just wants it over with.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  35. #735

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^I don't think that the girl who had the hijab incident woke up that morning thinking this is what I am going to do today. Whatever circumstances happened I think they just got out of hand and then she had no control over it. She probably told one person then that one person tweeted another then before you know it it's half way around the world in 10 minutes. Then you get Tater Tot in on it. I'm sure this girl is worried sick about all this and just wants it over with.
    Agreed, I was being flippant with the above post. I don't think intent is involved, just trying to hilite how crazy the unfolding of all this is. I mean how predictable was it that Tater tot was going to address the nation on it. I mean you just know that was happening the moment the *news* broke. I wonder how much its realized how much harm this would create for the girl, her family, and how scary it would be having swarms of media circling like locusts looking for any story.

    I agree that's how it probably got out. Schoolyard gossip. I'm glad that no person was directly implicated as the "attacker".

    If theres any positive in this at all its that it may cause some rethinking on how spring loaded the country, or western world is to be immediately acting on such perception.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  36. #736

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    ^She described her attacker as an Asian male around the age of 20-30. Spring loaded, well that's a good description. Hair trigger is another. Social media and regular media filling in the blanks with their own version of what happened, why it happened and we are all going to hell in a hand basket.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  37. #737
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^I don't think that the girl who had the hijab incident woke up that morning thinking this is what I am going to do today. Whatever circumstances happened I think they just got out of hand and then she had no control over it. She probably told one person then that one person tweeted another then before you know it it's half way around the world in 10 minutes. Then you get Tater Tot in on it. I'm sure this girl is worried sick about all this and just wants it over with.
    She didnt seem worried at her press conference, I'd like to know who did cut it..

  38. #738

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    Could this 'Make it Awkward' event not have been held at a less expensive place. Rent out a hall or a community space and hire/invite 2-3 food trucks to be outside. Now I'm sure in between speakers and talkers and squawkers there would be time to go out and have a bite. I get the impression this event is more for the movers and shakers in this town and not the actual downtrodden regular abused Joe Public (of any race or creed). A chance for those with the cash to be seen and also to be seen as worldly and all encompassing and the rest of the crap these SJW want you to swallow. Meanwhile the people who have actually been in the mist of bigotry/exclusion/hate crime/ etc are left outside with their noses pressed up against the window.
    Yes, I think his strategy is probably to get the movers and shakers to reflect on what they could do to change or make things better, not to just have those that have been victims talk. If it was, he would probably need a larger facility for that and the victims are not the ones that need to change.

    Perhaps he could have held the event at a less expensive place, but as someone who has on a few occasions been involved with organizing events, they often either don't seem to exist or if they are do they may not be suitable for such an event.

  39. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    The girl should apologise.
    I would imagine she has privately, and is probably in a whole mess of trouble with her family. Publicly? Absolutely not. With the idiocy of social media, public shaming, and outright death threats it would be incredibly problematic for her identity to be revealed in a public apology.

    And after I type that, I see the Journal article where her family came forward publicly. These people are either incredibly brave or incredibly naive. I hope that they're ready for the whirlwind likely heading their way. Or I hope I'm wrong.

  40. #740

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    As a society we are of course reinforcing a paradigm. Kind of a bizarre one. Any child could now know that if I make up something I could be talked about by my prime minister and world media within the hour and well before there is any confirmation whatsoever of what is alleged to have occurred. I can't fathom what a distortion of power that is that comes from this nature of reactionary zeal. I can't imagine what a child would think today about her world being so whacked that all this out of control reaction occurred. It would be scary in itself. If I made something up as a child and it made world news the same day as a reasonably sentient child I would just assume the world is insane.

    I wonder about a kid being sent to his/her room for a timeout just speed dialing the Prime Minister to claim injustice or refugee status..

    OK I'm jk with the latter but these are some crazy times.

    There’s times when kids are very deliberately ’weaponized’ and people in the know make no effort to correct the record, and if the truth ever comes out, even then those that should have come forward are never revealed. (It probably happens all the time in divorces.)


    Nayirah testimony - Wikipedia

    The Nayirah testimony was a false testimonygiven before the Congressional Human Rights Caucus on October 10, 1990 by a 15-year-old girl who provided only her first name, Nayirah. The testimony was widely publicized, and was cited numerous times by United States senators and President George H. W. Bush in their rationale to back Kuwait in the Gulf War. In 1992, it was revealed that Nayirah's last name was al-Ṣabaḥ (Arabic: نيره الصباح‎) and that she was the daughter of Saud Al-Sabah, the Kuwaiti ambassador to the United States. Furthermore, it was revealed that her testimony was organized as part of the Citizens for a Free Kuwait public relations campaign which was run by an American public relations firm Hill & Knowlton for the Kuwaiti government. Following this, al-Sabah's testimony has come to be regarded as a classic example of modern atrocity propaganda.[1][2]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nayirah_testimony


    Atrocity propaganda - Wikipedia

    Atrocity propaganda is the spreading information about the crimes committed by an enemy, especially deliberate fabrications or exaggerations.[citation needed] It is a form of psychological warfare.[citation needed]

    The inherently violent nature of war means that exaggeration and invention of atrocities often becomes the main staple of propaganda. Patriotism is often not enough to make people hate, and propaganda is also necessary.[1] "So great are the psychological resistances to war in modern nations", wrote Harold Lasswell, "that every war must appear to be a war of defense against a menacing, murderous aggressor. There must be no ambiguity about who the public is to hate."[2] Human testimony is deemed unreliable even in ordinary circumstances, but in wartime,...”


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrocity_propaganda
    Bolding is mine
    Last edited by KC; 16-01-2018 at 08:47 PM.

  41. #741

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    Some quite interesting follow up articles are coming out. (Everyone, it seems, is very quickly agreeing with the police conclusion on this - just one more of media’s rush to judgement it seems. It’s necessary for that in order to spread the ‘correction’ far and wide, however has the girl stated that she’d made it up or has she continued to say it happened?)

    Examples:

    Hijab-cutting incident: Experts warn of ethical issues with putting kids in media spotlight | Globalnews.ca

    https://globalnews.ca/news/3968787/h...ren-spotlight/


    An attacker did not cut her hijab, police say. But why did the TDSB let the tearful 11-year-old face the cameras? | Toronto Star

    https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...ur-police.html

  42. #742
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    Bizarre story

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    The girl should apologise.
    I would imagine she has privately, and is probably in a whole mess of trouble with her family. Publicly? Absolutely not. With the idiocy of social media, public shaming, and outright death threats it would be incredibly problematic for her identity to be revealed in a public apology.

    And after I type that, I see the Journal article where her family came forward publicly. These people are either incredibly brave or incredibly naive. I hope that they're ready for the whirlwind likely heading their way. Or I hope I'm wrong.
    I don't see where they came forward.. Better to keep playing the victim. I was so sad that she went through all this, now we find out it's a lie..

  44. #744
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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L.
    I don't see where they came forward..
    How could you? It's readily apparent you don't read a single link or article provided in any thread, and just operate on your ignorant, disconnected from factual reality assumptions on just about every topic. Post #723 contained this link: http://edmontonjournal.com/news/toro...6-2de8c21d6323

    A Toronto District School Board spokesperson put the media in touch with the child’s mother, Saima Samad, who agreed to do interviews. That is how a child who was thought to be the victim of a hate crime was being interviewed about it inside her own school, identified by name, and invited by reporters to address her alleged attacker on television.“This was the decision of the family, not the TDSB,” said Ryan Bird, who is also a spokesman for the TDSB.
    Although it would appear that her identity was outed publicly BEFORE the allegations were found to be false, it was incredibly irresponsible of the parents to expose a minor to such public scrutiny even if the allegations were 100% true. Some blame probably needs to be shared with the TDSB and police for not cautioning the parents much more extensively about the implications of identifying her. As I said, her family must be incredibly naive or brave. And the media should have known better than to publish her identity as well. It seems most outlets are no longer doing so, but the internet is forever.
    Last edited by Marcel Petrin; 17-01-2018 at 11:20 AM.

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    How could you? It's readily apparent you don't read a single link or article provided in any thread, and just operate on your ignorant, disconnected from factual reality assumptions on just about every topic. Post #723 contained this link:
    Yo, bighead, I said I can't open many links in this forum, keep up!BTW, In any thread, are you a troll?You're an Ignorant know it all, who knows zip!
    I said she didn't come forward with an apology!!..we all know what she said when she lied to make trouble!
    Last edited by H.L.; 17-01-2018 at 11:46 AM.

  46. #746

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    If you're not gonna keep yourself informed you might wanna drop the "well, I haven't seen anything..." schtick, since you're a willing prisoner of your own ignorance.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  47. #747

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L.
    I don't see where they came forward..
    How could you? It's readily apparent you don't read a single link or article provided in any thread, and just operate on your ignorant, disconnected from factual reality assumptions on just about every topic. Post #723 contained this link: http://edmontonjournal.com/news/toro...6-2de8c21d6323

    A Toronto District School Board spokesperson put the media in touch with the child’s mother, Saima Samad, who agreed to do interviews. That is how a child who was thought to be the victim of a hate crime was being interviewed about it inside her own school, identified by name, and invited by reporters to address her alleged attacker on television.“This was the decision of the family, not the TDSB,” said Ryan Bird, who is also a spokesman for the TDSB.
    Although it would appear that her identity was outed publicly BEFORE the allegations were found to be false, it was incredibly irresponsible of the parents to expose a minor to such public scrutiny even if the allegations were 100% true. Some blame probably needs to be shared with the TDSB and police for not cautioning the parents much more extensively about the implications of identifying her. As I said, her family must be incredibly naive or brave. And the media should have known better than to publish her identity as well. It seems most outlets are no longer doing so, but the internet is forever.
    Having a wrong side of the bed day?


    I read the came forward comment as referring to the correction of the record and not the initial accusation which identified the girl. (Events there seemed to have got away from everyone involved in the manic response.) Of course I could be wrong.

    The who, what, when, where and why of the finding that it didn’t happen is very recent news and with the media show, it would be scary to correct the record.
    Last edited by KC; 17-01-2018 at 11:56 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    If you're not gonna keep yourself informed you might wanna drop the "well, I haven't seen anything..." schtick, since you're a willing prisoner of your own ignorance.
    Noodle brain, back off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L.
    I don't see where they came forward..
    How could you? It's readily apparent you don't read a single link or article provided in any thread, and just operate on your ignorant, disconnected from factual reality assumptions on just about every topic. Post #723 contained this link: http://edmontonjournal.com/news/toro...6-2de8c21d6323

    A Toronto District School Board spokesperson put the media in touch with the child’s mother, Saima Samad, who agreed to do interviews. That is how a child who was thought to be the victim of a hate crime was being interviewed about it inside her own school, identified by name, and invited by reporters to address her alleged attacker on television.“This was the decision of the family, not the TDSB,” said Ryan Bird, who is also a spokesman for the TDSB.
    Although it would appear that her identity was outed publicly BEFORE the allegations were found to be false, it was incredibly irresponsible of the parents to expose a minor to such public scrutiny even if the allegations were 100% true. Some blame probably needs to be shared with the TDSB and police for not cautioning the parents much more extensively about the implications of identifying her. As I said, her family must be incredibly naive or brave. And the media should have known better than to publish her identity as well. It seems most outlets are no longer doing so, but the internet is forever.
    Having a wrong side of the bed day?


    I read the came forward comment as referring to the correction of the record and not the initial accusation which identified the girl. (Events there seemed to have got away from everyone involved in the manic response.) Of course I could be wrong.

    The who, what, when, where and why of the finding that it didn’t happen is very recent news and with the media show, it would be scary to correct the record.
    As did I..

  50. #750

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    Just as a comment the school should not have allowed the reporters inside the school or been the venue in which the information from the family was divulged. it is quite clear from citations that the school was not divulging anything to the media, that it was up to the family to do that if they wanted to. However the school became the venue for this which was not conducive to the school operation, to this family, or the students benefit. I'm quite surprised this media scrum was allowed to transpire inside the school with its circus of distraction and of course every student in the family knowing by now who the girl in question was.
    More reason why any divulging of such attack should occur to the police, in confidential quarters, and not in a public facility.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  51. #751

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    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?

  52. #752
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...

  53. #753

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    ^I don't get the impression that she is still being treated as the victim. Most people realize she is young and did something stupid. Now as the saying goes 'enquiring minds would like to know' did she rip or cut the hijab herself and it so why. If it was ripped because she caught it on something why is she not telling people that. I'm wondering if she did not want to wear it and was making excuses of why not to, i.e. it's ripped. Of course if this is the case I doubt her parents would be telling people she did not want to wear it as it looks like she is forced to wear it and who wants to start that merry go round. Now I know that is speculation but this is what happens when we don't get the facts or the rest of the story.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  54. #754

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
    I never got in front of a mic, with the bloody world watching! She lied, she won't lie again!
    Stop bringing your obsession into ever thread we have, you mind numbing *****!

  56. #756

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Should she apologize and set the record straight?.

    http://torontosun.com/opinion/column...ology#comments
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  57. #757
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^I don't get the impression that she is still being treated as the victim. Most people realize she is young and did something stupid. Now as the saying goes 'enquiring minds would like to know' did she rip or cut the hijab herself and it so why. If it was ripped because she caught it on something why is she not telling people that. I'm wondering if she did not want to wear it and was making excuses of why not to, i.e. it's ripped. Of course if this is the case I doubt her parents would be telling people she did not want to wear it as it looks like she is forced to wear it and who wants to start that merry go round. Now I know that is speculation but this is what happens when we don't get the facts or the rest of the story.
    Oh she is, now the politicians that fell all over themselves, are doing the same thing to say his awful it would of been. JT has made Canada stupid, 100% stupid, and he's dangerous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Should she apologize and set the record straight?.


    http://torontosun.com/opinion/column...ology#comments
    I saw that last night, of course she should apologise, I'm glad they did. That doesn't mean I'm not concerned how or if the clothing was cut, or by whom.
    I'd feel the same way for any 11 year old

  59. #759

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    ^Thing is if something like that really did happen in the future the public would be a bit leary of it and maybe it would not get the attention it needed.
    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^Thing is if something like that really did happen in the future the public would be a bit leary of it and maybe it would not get the attention it needed.
    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
    Yes, the boy who cried wolf syndrome.
    I'm still worried about the missing woman in Edmonton( Atwe,) and why at her vigil of all places, something happened and it turned violent. I don't go out and search for anyone usually, but I joined the search for this woman. It was so cold and she had one shoe on, she had gone missing before, she suffers with depression ( as I do) so for whatever reason I felt compelled to search. I just hope the police are STILL looking into all this.
    Sorry, I went off track...I just have a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach, that someone is lying

  61. #761

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
    These two are not blaming an 11 year old as you imply. However, the 11- year old is to blame (or someone else?), as are those in the chain of expanding unprofessional publicity thereafter.

    They are pointing out that even when the crime is determined not to have happened, the proponents of human rights have used the retraction as an opportunity to remind everyone that such hostility still does occur. These human rights proponents are doing what in finance is called “talking their book”. (Note in the articles their minimal concern for the situation the girl is in of the bad impression of Canada it sent the world. That’s because such concerns simply are not their business, their agenda.) Trump does this all the time too. It’s just being defensive if not opportunistic.
    Last edited by KC; 18-01-2018 at 12:00 PM.

  62. #762

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
    I never got in front of a mic, with the bloody world watching! She lied, she won't lie again!
    Stop bringing your obsession into ever thread we have, you mind numbing *****!
    So sorry Hello Lady. Guess you think an 11 year old child has all the consequences all figured out beforehand.
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  63. #763

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
    I never got in front of a mic, with the bloody world watching! She lied, she won't lie again!
    Stop bringing your obsession into ever thread we have, you mind numbing *****!
    So sorry Hello Lady. Guess you think an 11 year old child has all the consequences all figured out beforehand.
    You really are having a hard time understanding H.L.’s position which seems to have shown more real concern for the child than your more ideology grandstanding.

  64. #764

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    The child should certainly not be made to apologize in front of media or any cameras that made this into the shitstorm in the first place. Its not her fault she's living in a batshit crazy news world that is springloaded to report anything like this. I'm sure she's already apologized to school, family, anybody involved.

    The only consequence for child should be a timeout, maybe grounding, loss of privs, standard parenting stuff. The recommendation for the family is that they have a much longer talk about this and what led to the child reporting this. Something else probably going on. When your child is reporting something unusual like this, and it turns to be a lie, much more family discussion should ensue getting the child to elaborate, within the family, on what is going on.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  65. #765
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
    I never got in front of a mic, with the bloody world watching! She lied, she won't lie again!
    Stop bringing your obsession into ever thread we have, you mind numbing *****!
    So sorry Hello Lady. Guess you think an 11 year old child has all the consequences all figured out beforehand.
    You really are having a hard time understanding H.L.’s position which seems to have shown more real concern for the child than your more ideology grandstanding.

    I think the poster you are talking about likes to call names and run..this poster is not very bright, as one can tell from reading his posts. He's in attack mode 24/7 which leads me to believe, he is not a pant wearer at home

  66. #766
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    The child should certainly not be made to apologize in front of media or any cameras that made this into the shitstorm in the first place. Its not her fault she's living in a batshit crazy news world that is springloaded to report anything like this. I'm sure she's already apologized to school, family, anybody involved.

    The only consequence for child should be a timeout, maybe grounding, loss of privs, standard parenting stuff. The recommendation for the family is that they have a much longer talk about this and what led to the child reporting this. Something else probably going on. When your child is reporting something unusual like this, and it turns to be a lie, much more family discussion should ensue getting the child to elaborate, within the family, on what is going on.
    They have apologised and wish to move on, that should suffice. I do call out the school board into question, having them make
    estatements, before the police have even finished..

  67. #767
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What bothers me most about the fallout of this fake hate crime is that we learned that if a Muslim person lies about being the victim of a crime, they are STILL considered a victim anyway.

    What is the scenario here where Muslims are NOT the victim?
    There isn't one...
    Sure, blame an 11 year old for creating a lie. As if you never lied as a child.

    Maybe ask the big orange ******** President about his lying record. Oh, that's right., he is the victim of the media.
    I never got in front of a mic, with the bloody world watching! She lied, she won't lie again!
    Stop bringing your obsession into ever thread we have, you mind numbing *****!
    So sorry Hello Lady. Guess you think an 11 year old child has all the consequences all figured out beforehand.

    It's HL, kindly follow the rules of this forum!

  68. #768

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    which rule?

    Or are you referring to KC when Hello Lady said, "He's in attack mode 24/7 which leads me to believe, he is not a pant wearer at home"

    HL or H.L. is Hello Lady for short, correct?

    Or am I not being politically correct? as in "
    Enough of these 'I'm Offended, It's not Politically Correct' people already"
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 18-01-2018 at 01:31 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    which rule?

    Or are you referring to KC when Hello Lady said, "He's in attack mode 24/7 which leads me to believe, he is not a pant wearer at home"

    HL or H.L. is Hello Lady for short, correct?

    Or am I not being politically correct? as in "
    Enough of these 'I'm Offended, It's not Politically Correct' people already"
    I changed to HL because I was being followed online.( I asked admin to change it for me) I would like you to respect that, so no, you're not correct( again)

  70. #770

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    Then respect others first.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  71. #771
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Then respect others first.

    I do. I have never respected you or your constant name calling.

  72. #772

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    The child should certainly not be made to apologize in front of media or any cameras that made this into the shitstorm in the first place. Its not her fault she's living in a batshit crazy news world that is springloaded to report anything like this. I'm sure she's already apologized to school, family, anybody involved.

    The only consequence for child should be a timeout, maybe grounding, loss of privs, standard parenting stuff. The recommendation for the family is that they have a much longer talk about this and what led to the child reporting this. Something else probably going on. When your child is reporting something unusual like this, and it turns to be a lie, much more family discussion should ensue getting the child to elaborate, within the family, on what is going on.
    Well said. Moreover, kids should not have to live with their mistakes anyway, and as you say, not because adults blew them out of all proportion.*

    And only in retrospect, those at the school are being seen to have used poor judgement in the self generated heat of their moment. I think they’ve quickly learned a now very obvious lesson so there should be no need for some bureaucratic review. Any effort should be put in to clarifying the shudda-cudda’s and mitigation of anc further issues or damage. (Basically look forward.)

    The media should also issue a couple story retractions. The readers of today’s news aren’t necessarily the readers of tomorrow’s news so corrections need to carry more weight and emphasis to limit reputational damage.


    * as an aside; adults make mistakes in judgement all the time. Say looking the wrong way and running a red light. If no one else is in the intersection and no one gets hurt, no one thinks a moment more about it. However should the VERY same mistake occur but where a car load of kids get killed - everything changes. Very same action different outcomes and different consequences to be paid. (Or take the case of typos: say one makes a typo in a large number. To the right of the decimal and ‘no sweat’. To the left of the decimal and the response can change dramatically. Or, shoot a gun in the air. Maybe get a fine. Kill someone and go to jail... same action, but due to an independent variable changing the consequences thus changes everyone’s perception of that action.)
    Last edited by KC; 18-01-2018 at 02:04 PM.

  73. #773

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^Thing is if something like that really did happen in the future the public would be a bit leary of it and maybe it would not get the attention it needed.
    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
    Yes, the boy who cried wolf syndrome.
    I'm still worried about the missing woman in Edmonton( Atwe,) and why at her vigil of all places, something happened and it turned violent. I don't go out and search for anyone usually, but I joined the search for this woman. It was so cold and she had one shoe on, she had gone missing before, she suffers with depression ( as I do) so for whatever reason I felt compelled to search. I just hope the police are STILL looking into all this.
    Sorry, I went off track...I just have a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach, that someone is lying
    Hard to say what happened or what is happening with the Atwe case. I did read there was an incident with the husband at the vigil. This lady may have depression but I am sure I also read she was taking meds for being bi-polar. Hopefully she is somewhere safe and not out on the streets. On the other hand I think if she was out on the street the cops would have been told to keep an eye out for her. It's not like she would be street smart. I cant imagine someone with no street smarts being out there let alone someone who needs meds for psychological problems. Must be real frightening for her.
    Gone............................and very quickly forgotten may I add.

  74. #774
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^Thing is if something like that really did happen in the future the public would be a bit leary of it and maybe it would not get the attention it needed.
    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
    Yes, the boy who cried wolf syndrome.
    I'm still worried about the missing woman in Edmonton( Atwe,) and why at her vigil of all places, something happened and it turned violent. I don't go out and search for anyone usually, but I joined the search for this woman. It was so cold and she had one shoe on, she had gone missing before, she suffers with depression ( as I do) so for whatever reason I felt compelled to search. I just hope the police are STILL looking into all this.
    Sorry, I went off track...I just have a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach, that someone is lying
    Hard to say what happened or what is happening with the Atwe case. I did read there was an incident with the husband at the vigil. This lady may have depression but I am sure I also read she was taking meds for being bi-polar. Hopefully she is somewhere safe and not out on the streets. On the other hand I think if she was out on the street the cops would have been told to keep an eye out for her. It's not like she would be street smart. I cant imagine someone with no street smarts being out there let alone someone who needs meds for psychological problems. Must be real frightening for her.
    Maybe she decided to just disappear..who knows.

    https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...d-violent.html

    When a woman was speaking at the vigil, Atwe's husband yelled at her, and someone else called him a murderer. ( sigh)

    Something doesn't sit right..

  75. #775
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    It sounds like someone definitely knows something we don't. Maybe he killed her. If he threw her body in the river it would be stuck under the ice somewhere downstream and not show up until spring.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 19-01-2018 at 09:57 AM.

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    Or maybe he's carrying a heavy burden protecting somebody that did kill her, we don't know.
    Mom said I should not talk to cretins!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    It sounds like someone definitely knows something we don't. Maybe he killed her. If he threw her body in the river it would be stuck under the ice somewhere downstream and not show up until spring.
    My husband said the same as you. How sad...

  78. #778

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    Different but the same. The same but different. Totally different. Exactly the same.

    Sure whatever YOU say.

    (Nolan is looking more and more insightful every passing day.)

    David Staples: Dark day as Citadel Theatre snubs controversial author

    David Staples, Edmonton Journal
    Published on: January 18, 2018

    “We made a decision at a leadership level that (Peterson’s talk) was not in keeping with our mandate, mission and values,” said Chantell Ghosh, executive director of the Citadel Theatre.

    I put it to Ghosh that the Citadel gets a great amount of public funding and that the institution should serve all of the public, so it should have permitted Peterson’s talk.

    “People have the ability to say whatever they like to think,” Ghosh said. “We reserve the right to determine who gets to use our space and how they get to use it and that’s what we did in this case.”
    ...

    That the Citadel has legal control of its space is a given. But I can only see its action as divisive and political, as picking one side over another, when the organization should champion free expression and be open to hosting a public talk from a credible voice. ...”


    http://edmontonjournal.com/opinion/c...n-not-shun-him

    Edmonton Muslim teen says she forgives shop owner who kicked her out - Edmonton - CBC News

    "He said 'It's not in my ethical beliefs to do business with you,'" Ghalab recalled. "He made it absolutely clear he didn't want me in the store at all."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmont...-out-1.3427399



    Hmm:



    Difference of opinion is advantageous in religion. The several sects perform the office of a Censor morum over each other. Is uniformity attainable? Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth. Let us reflect that it is inhabited by a thousand millions of people. That these profess probably a thousand different systems of religion. That ours is but one of that thousand. That if there be but one right, and ours that one, we should wish to see the 999 wandering sects gathered into the fold of truth. But against such a majority we cannot effect this by force. Reason and persuasion are the only practicable instruments. To make way for these, free enquiry must be indulged; and how can we wish others to indulge it while we refuse it ourselves. - Thomas Jefferson
    Bolding mine
    Last edited by KC; 20-01-2018 at 10:21 AM.

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    I think the difference between the two cases might be more obvious if they were both happening in the same sort of business.

    The Citadel's case would be like a bookstore refusing to sell a book because the owner dislikes it on political grounds.

    The shoe case would be like a bookstore refusing to serve a customer because the owner dislikes her religion.

    I think the first is allowed by law, ie. a bookstore doesn't have to promote any ideas it doesn't want to. The second, I'm pretty sure, is illegal discrimination.

  80. #780

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    Or: “I don’t like what I think you stand for so I don’t want to help you in any way.”

  81. #781
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Or: “I don’t like what I think you stand for so I don’t want to help you in any way.”
    Yeah, but in the case of the store and the veiled customer, giving her service is not in any way endorsing what she supposedly stands for. Whereas selling a book advocating a particular viewpoint is, if not outright endorsement, at least an implied statement that these sorts of opinions are tolerable in mainstream society.

    Back to my bookstore, I don't think they should discriminate against someone who belongs to a religion that teaches, for example, that it's okay to beat your wife. But they shouldn't have to sell a book by adherents of that faith called WHY BEATING YOUR WIFE IS THE BEST THING YOU CAN DO FOR HER.

  82. #782

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    For clarity the Citadel has released a statement apologizing for their decision in regards to Peterson and acknowledging they were wrong in not considering the event more fully.

    https://www.facebook.com/citadelthea...42367732469239

    I love the wording too;

    This week has reminded us that complex issues deserve exploration and conversation, not polarization"

    The polarization, btw, coming from select Trans activists that had admitted to contacting the Citadel to complain about Petersons talk and cite ungrounded fears and harm. The unfortunate thing, as I had mentioned on this board earlier in the week is the Citadel did not canvas wider public opinion, but which they were barraged with subsequent to their biased decision.

    So that this is like a person being in a store (Peterson having a signed, paid contract with Citadel which he has posted online) and some radicals walking into the store and complaining about why that person is being allowed in the store and thus being ejected on pretense grounds. The store later apologizing for the eviction of the person.


    The most ironic thing about this is anybody even remotely familiar with Jordan Petersons talks and literature knows that what the Citadel did is the reaction expected from those not understanding the issues. To that end its not just that the Citadel made the decision to rescind the Peterson contract its that they did it seemingly unknowing of any of the past instances in which Peterson and those that have showed his material have been wrongly attacked. How could anybody that even remotely follows news in this country not be aware of the Wilfred Laurier TA scandal, and another institution that has had to be apologizing and doing damage control ever since. Its incompetent, actually, for the Citadel to be so unaware of the complex issues at hand.

    Finally, lets be clear here that the Citadel doesn't apologize at all were it not for Peterson, and those that support him having a strong enough voice to inform Citadel of their error.
    Last edited by Replacement; 20-01-2018 at 12:56 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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    I'm glad I got in touch with the citadel, and I know I wasn't alone.

  84. #784

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    Pretty amazing that the topic of the discussion wasn’t even announced except apparently something to do with his book. (That can be pretty broad.)

    Could their intent be to give others a taste of what being discriminated against is like?



    Transgender activists worry Jordan Peterson lecture will 'embolden' anti-LGBTQ views
    The controversial University of Toronto professor is scheduled to speak at Edmonton's Citadel Theatre on Feb. 11

    Published on Jan 16 2018
    Kevin Maimann
    METRO


    “An upcoming lecture by a controversial University of Toronto professor could embolden Edmontonians with anti-transgender views, some worry.

    Jordan Peterson, a psychology professor who gained notoriety in 2016 after he said he would refuse to use some transgender students’ proper pronouns, is scheduled to speak at the Citadel Theatre’s Zeidler Hall on Feb. 11, according to his website.

    On his website, he says the "precise topic" of discussion "has not yet been determined" for his public lecture at the Citadel, but at least part of it will be about his new book. ...”

    http://www.metronews.ca/news/edmonto...btq-views.html
    Last edited by KC; 20-01-2018 at 01:36 PM.

  85. #785

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    I'm glad I got in touch with the citadel, and I know I wasn't alone.
    I hope you will do the same when someone you abhor for some reason, is similarly prevented from likely just exercising their rights.

  86. #786

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    The polarization, btw, coming from select Trans activists that had admitted to contacting the Citadel to complain about Petersons talk and cite ungrounded fears and harm.
    It's wrong to quickly cave to pressure coming from a minute number of activists.

    Jordan Peterson himself has said many times that almost all of the letters he has received from self-described transgender people are in support of him (something like a 25 to 1 ratio), and these people tell him that a handful of vocal "trans activists" do NOT speak for them. Dr Peterson also said that most transgendered people who speak with him tell him that they DON'T want activists fighting political battles for them, because the last thing they want is to get spotlights on them while they are unwittingly dragged into national political debates about legislated/forced/coerced language to possibly lead to human rights charges.

  87. #787

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    I'm glad I got in touch with the citadel, and I know I wasn't alone.
    I hope you will do the same when someone you abhor for some reason, is similarly prevented from likely just exercising their rights.

    I certainly do. I NEVER support censorship, and I always oppose silencing people for their opinions.

  88. #788

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Pretty amazing that the topic of the discussion wasn’t even announced except apparently something to do with his book. (That can be pretty broad.)

    Could their intent be to give others a taste of what being discriminated against is like?



    Transgender activists worry Jordan Peterson lecture will 'embolden' anti-LGBTQ views
    The controversial University of Toronto professor is scheduled to speak at Edmonton's Citadel Theatre on Feb. 11

    Published on Jan 16 2018
    Kevin Maimann
    METRO


    “An upcoming lecture by a controversial University of Toronto professor could embolden Edmontonians with anti-transgender views, some worry.

    Jordan Peterson, a psychology professor who gained notoriety in 2016 after he said he would refuse to use some transgender students’ proper pronouns, is scheduled to speak at the Citadel Theatre’s Zeidler Hall on Feb. 11, according to his website.

    On his website, he says the "precise topic" of discussion "has not yet been determined" for his public lecture at the Citadel, but at least part of it will be about his new book. ...”

    http://www.metronews.ca/news/edmonto...btq-views.html
    No, just that as Staples mentioned in a much better article, the Citadel has lost its way. It was instead aligned with radical activists and apparently quite prepared to knee jerk react, on the basis of that, and nothing else. The article from Maimann is poor. He quotes Siobhan O Leary stating that Peterson is a Charlatan and that everything Jordan states is fraud. He quotes Marni Panas stating;

    Panas said Peterson uses his stature as a professor to share opinions that are not grounded in empirical evidence.
    “There is a difference between free speech, and somebody who is using myths and misunderstandings, purposely, to devalue other humans. And that is what he had done to our community,” So in Panas' view Peterson is just purposely using his platform to devalue other humans. Its unfortunate that's what she reduces from his body of work.

    Lets keep in mind Peterson is a longstanding Clinical Professor, a best selling author world wide, a highly sought after speaker that has demonstrated his spoken ability for years and that debunks criticisms like those expressed every day of the year.

    Maimann himself has been highly critical of Peterson and online even admitted he was one of the individuals contacting the Citadel to get the Peterson gig cancelled. Maimann even directly linked his own biased story as evidence to the Citadel.

    So that we have a huge problem of selective view here. Maimann is utilizing his influence as a local newsreporter to selectively quote his own community, canvas their isolated views, (which equal his own) and then throw together an article that is of course biased, and that makes no attempt to citation those supporting Peterson, and Maimann even takes it upon himself to be the news by contacting others further to demand that the Peterson talk be cancelled. With no apparent realization whatsoever about what role he had played, or why taking that role is inappropriate, and that it is instead self serving.

    In Petersons own words; Activists do not speak for the entire community. Yet sadly in this instance that is precisely what occurred.
    Last edited by Replacement; 20-01-2018 at 02:40 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  89. #789
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    I'm glad I got in touch with the citadel, and I know I wasn't alone.
    I hope you will do the same when someone you abhor for some reason, is similarly prevented from likely just exercising their rights.
    How will I know, I seldom follow people I abhor..

  90. #790

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    The polarization, btw, coming from select Trans activists that had admitted to contacting the Citadel to complain about Petersons talk and cite ungrounded fears and harm.
    It's wrong to quickly cave to pressure coming from a minute number of activists.

    Jordan Peterson himself has said many times that almost all of the letters he has received from self-described transgender people are in support of him (something like a 25 to 1 ratio), and these people tell him that a handful of vocal "trans activists" do NOT speak for them. Dr Peterson also said that most transgendered people who speak with him tell him that they DON'T want activists fighting political battles for them, because the last thing they want is to get spotlights on them while they are unwittingly dragged into national political debates about legislated/forced/coerced language to possibly lead to human rights charges.
    Its simple as this, and I'll repeat, in Jordan Petersons worlds; "Activists do not speak for the entire community." I can see how this occurred though. Marni Panas, particularly has been given endless licence to speak on behalf of her won trans community and has received so much accolade, so much voice, and been in a consulting capacity with so many orgs that it could well be that he/she (whats the pronoun?) actually thinks that this weeks instance is speaking for broader, and not selective community. All the power to Marni, sure, and she is tireless in her campaigning. But she is also an undergraduate that has been put into a position as expert speaker and ironically with far less educational or read background then Peterson whom her fraternity refers to as a Charlatan speaking beyond scope of expertise. Theres irony here if one looks at it.

    Panas, Maimann, and Siobhan O leary have all been curiously quiet since the Citadel has apologized, realized that they bought into polarization, and that Jordan Peterson quickly just obtained another show, at the Hyatt, which is already sold out.

    So what really have the above, and the Citadel accomplished in this? Alienating many people?
    Last edited by Replacement; 20-01-2018 at 02:58 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  91. #791

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    I'm glad I got in touch with the citadel, and I know I wasn't alone.
    I hope you will do the same when someone you abhor for some reason, is similarly prevented from likely just exercising their rights.
    How will I know, I seldom follow people I abhor..
    I don't abhor people but I do follow those with significantly opposed pov. Better sometimes to know what the adversary is up to. Its interesting that it took Peterson just minutes to determine the root sources of the Citadel cancellation. The only thing I was wondering all week is how long it would take them to apologize for their obvious shortsighted and polarized decision. lets be clear here too. Ghosh, only recently hired at the Citadel. despises Peterson and any thought of Patriarchy. She's not exactly objective on this front. As David Staples mentioned the Citadel, indeed has lost its way. I was disgusted with how this was handled. I do think the apology is just placating attempt. I think they just worried about losing subscribers as online and in ph calls and emails they have had a barrage of complaints from people questioning continued patronage of the Theatre. Its been tragic. Sales are down this season as it is.

    The irony being that a Theatre with constant revenue problems threw away a sold out crowd. They could have done a series of sold out Peterson talks. Theres mention of being multiple talks at the Hyatt as the first sold out so quickly. A problem the Citadel never has..
    Last edited by Replacement; 20-01-2018 at 02:57 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  92. #792

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    Just another comment. The Citadel, under new Director Daryl Cloran is often looking for feedback and solicits this in emails from patrons and STH. The contact being regular. This is good, but it is curious that something like this that was guaranteed to be news. (Peterson is news around the planet) and not one email, solicitation, poll or canvassing of their audience regarding this contracted performance. I asked them why this was not done. Got no good answer for that. Unfortunately management in this instance acted on their own, rather than their audiences belief system. I'm left wondering how a gate revenue operation thinks it better to act on its own recognizance in this matter. As a facility one would think they would know how damaging to reputation it has been in the past when campuses or auditoriums have attempted such cancellation or refusal to allow accomplished public speakers. Its invariably a bad, and polarizing decision which calls into question the current competence of the org. This was all so predictable.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  93. #793

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    Apparently some people don't realize that the Citadel also has the right of freedom of expression. However, here's an explanation.

    Opinion: Theatre's refusal to host is also freedom of expression
    Avnish Nanda is a public law litigator and sessional instructor in constitutional law at the University of Alberta’s Faculty of Law, and has argued several free expression cases, including at the Supreme Court of Canada.

    These comments around the Citadel failing to uphold the free expression rights of Peterson betray a fundamental misunderstanding of free expression in Canada.


    Expression, under Canadian law, refers to any activity that conveys or attempts to convey meaning. The reason why a wide-ranging definition was adopted — encompassing any form of non-violent expressive activity, from words to conduct — is that it plays such an integral role in our society. Free expression facilitates the pursuit of truth, participation in the community, and individual self-fulfillment and human flourishing.


    As a Charter protection, free expression is meant to protect against the state limiting the communications of individuals or corporations. Private entities, such as the Citadel, are not typically subject to the Charter. While there are circumstances where a private venue’s refusal to provide publicly available space to an individual may contravene our human rights code (for instance when the refusal is based on race, religion, or gender), it can deny services for other reasons, including opposition to the message expressed.


    There are plenty of reasons why a private venue should be permitted to deny hosting a specific speaker or event, regardless if it receives public funding. For instance, it should be the right of a synagogue or mosque to deny an alt-right organization’s request to rent out their basement for a group meeting. Their charitable status should not be questioned, and government grants should not be revoked, if they decline to host a group whose message is an affront to their dignity and values.

    http://edmontonjournal.com/opinion/c...-of-expression

  94. #794

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    ^Nobody here has stated that the Citadel couldn't make the decision they have. Its whether a gate revenue operation should have made this decision. I'm not aware of anybody here framing this as simply a freedom of expression argument. I know that's out there, and plenty of people have, but its not the crux of the issue as I see it. Its that the Citadel, that caters to a diverse audience has sought out a very selective opinion in cancelling this presentation.

    The question is whether it is an astute or plausible business decision for them to do that. I think given their speedy apology and recant I would say they have realized their error. Albeit I think with present management it would occur again.

    Peterson is sold out his one show at Hyatt and is willing to do another show in Edmonton. Perhaps the Citadel should pick up the phone and put their integrity where their apology is and have a Peterson talk after all AT the Citadel. I think that would be the best pr salvage they could do at this point. The better would have been to not screw this up in the first place.

    Think about it as well. Its all about incompetence on the Citadel end. Somebody in management at the Citadel first books and signs Peterson, contract paid, somebody else then has a rethink, cancels it, states the presentation doesn't fit the theater mandate, (Yet they signed him) so at best extensive miscommunication all round within the management structure. All the Citadel had to do in the first place, to not be in this controversy is to not have first signed Peterson, then unilaterally rescind the contract (which they can) but which has only resulted in bad publicity.
    Last edited by Replacement; 20-01-2018 at 03:26 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  95. #795

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    The Citadel receive many grants from different levels of government.

    Workers at the Citadel selectively silencing certain people, due to disagreeing with their politics, is NOT something they should be doing.

  96. #796
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Apparently some people don't realize that the Citadel also has the right of freedom of expression. However, here's an explanation.

    (...)


    There are plenty of reasons why a private venue should be permitted to deny hosting a specific speaker or event, regardless if it receives public funding. For instance, it should be the right of a synagogue or mosque to deny an alt-right organization’s request to rent out their basement for a group meeting. Their charitable status should not be questioned, and government grants should not be revoked, if they decline to host a group whose message is an affront to their dignity and values.

    http://edmontonjournal.com/opinion/c...-of-expression
    Interesting. So, when C2E was originally conceived, we were supposed to be partnered with the City of Edmonton. However, when actual opinions started to come on stream, many people who one could characterize as left to hard left immediately started writing the City, the then EDE, and other partners to disavow any association with us, and to then also withdraw any funding of "public dollars" to this atrocious website that allows diverse opinions, or more accurately, does not immediately ban people and delete differing opinions that they find "offensive".

    The City, while not actually funding us, backed away. As did the EDE and others.

    There seems to be a huge double standard when this argument is invoked.
    Ow

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    Quote Originally Posted by Admin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Apparently some people don't realize that the Citadel also has the right of freedom of expression. However, here's an explanation.

    (...)


    There are plenty of reasons why a private venue should be permitted to deny hosting a specific speaker or event, regardless if it receives public funding. For instance, it should be the right of a synagogue or mosque to deny an alt-right organization’s request to rent out their basement for a group meeting. Their charitable status should not be questioned, and government grants should not be revoked, if they decline to host a group whose message is an affront to their dignity and values.

    http://edmontonjournal.com/opinion/c...-of-expression
    Interesting. So, when C2E was originally conceived, we were supposed to be partnered with the City of Edmonton. However, when actual opinions started to come on stream, many people who one could characterize as left to hard left immediately started writing the City, the then EDE, and other partners to disavow any association with us, and to then also withdraw any funding of "public dollars" to this atrocious website that allows diverse opinions, or more accurately, does not immediately ban people and delete differing opinions that they find "offensive".

    The City, while not actually funding us, backed away. As did the EDE and others.

    There seems to be a huge double standard when this argument is invoked.
    Thank you for your input!

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    11,753

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    ^^

    apparently only the federal liberal party can do that in canada... but only when they choose to (ie. they choose to for summer student grant funding but not for indiginous and northern affairs funding).
    Last edited by kcantor; 20-01-2018 at 05:35 PM.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  99. #799

    Default

    We need more objective reasoned and informed “perspective”. Plus in looking at the numbers are the largest or most affected groups getting the media coverage and official knee jerk statements that their numbers indicate they deserve?


    Let's keep some perspective here: one false story does not mean Islamophobia doesn't exist - CBC News | Opinion

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/opinion/false...tory-1.4490489

    The following was sourced by tho above article. Note the upward sloping line in the graph while the numbers indicate otherwise.

    “Perspective” distorting things like this are sloppy.

    Hate crimes against Muslims in Canada increase 253% over four years


    “Overall, the number of police-reported hate crimes across the country decreased 3.8 per cent to 1,362 from a high of 1,414 in 2012.

    Still, that total has increased since 2013 when the overall number was 1,165, representing a 14.5 per cent hike over three years.“




    https://globalnews.ca/news/3523535/h...canada-muslim/
    Bolding mine
    Last edited by KC; 21-01-2018 at 10:43 AM.

  100. #800

    Default

    ^Yeah.

    Holy misleading graphic and citation. Hate numbers are down since 2012 but the visual is an upwards bar with numbers that don't correspond to any linear increase, and don't correspond to an increase at all. Hate crimes would be a function of population of those experiencing the hate. Thus with more muslims there would be expected to be some increase in overall numbers even if rate stayed the same.

    Shame on Global news. Please be better than this.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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