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Thread: Edmonton Folk Fest wants liquor rules relaxed to cut beer lineups

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    Default Edmonton Folk Fest wants liquor rules relaxed to cut beer lineups

    About time... tis ridiculous.

    Edmonton Folk Fest wants liquor rules relaxed to cut beer lineups

    BILL MAH

    Thirsty festivalgoers stuck in a two-hour lineup for beer at the annual Edmonton Folk Music Festival have Terry Wickham’s sympathy.

    “It’s unfair for people to have to wait two hours in the sun for beer. I never would,” the producer of the Folk Fest said.

    But he’s also planning more concrete steps to try to reduce waiting times for festivalgoers to get a beer.

    It’s complicated by what he calls “our somewhat outdated liquor laws.”

    The size of the beer tent at this summer’s Folk Fest, which runs Aug. 4-7, will be increased to accommodate 200 to 250 patrons at a time as a stop-gap measure. “This will help the problem a bit, but it will not solve it,” Wickham said.

    He hopes to meet with the Alberta Gaming and Liquor Commission (AGLC) to see what can be improved for next year.

    http://edmontonjournal.com/business/...t-beer-lineups
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    One of the big issues is that for an all-site licence apparently the AGLC current requirement is 1 security person for every 50 people on site(whether or not the latter are drinking or not).

    The math works out according to Terry to in excess of 500 extra security personnel....

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    The requirements for an all-site license are way too high. We were at a festival in England that was three or four times the size of the folk fest that functioned just fine with beer and cider available across the site.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

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    It’s complicated by what he calls “our somewhat outdated liquor laws.”
    Interesting, because there are many people who consider the ban on drinking in parks and other public locations to be an "outdated liquor law".

    I wonder if Wickham favours repealing that law, allowing everyone to BYOB, including to events like the Folk Fest. After all, it would mean less lining-up in the heat to buy beer from the Folk Fest booze monopoly.

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    How doe the sports teams (Eskies ) get away with 50000+ fans and an open license - I don't think they carry 1000 + security staff?? That being said it doesn't take much beer sales to offset the cost of security @ 50-1.

    Yes there should be varying levels (ratios) depending on the audience, and history. i.e. a one time outdoor rock concert should require more than a hockey game.

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    Top_Dawg figgers they should relax the 50-1 requirement.

    Most of the burnouts at Folk Fest are so baked that they can't do anything anyways.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    The requirements for an all-site license are way too high. We were at a festival in England that was three or four times the size of the folk fest that functioned just fine with beer and cider available across the site.
    Mind you, there was that Canada day riot a few years back. I guess folk fest is a more "laid back crowd", but I'm not sure how you can have rules that define it that way for one event, but not, say, a rap, dance hall or heavy metal concert, without being discriminatory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    The requirements for an all-site license are way too high. We were at a festival in England that was three or four times the size of the folk fest that functioned just fine with beer and cider available across the site.
    Mind you, there was that Canada day riot a few years back. I guess folk fest is a more "laid back crowd", but I'm not sure how you can have rules that define it that way for one event, but not, say, a rap, dance hall or heavy metal concert, without being discriminatory.
    You already can drink at all those events. It's the outdoor ones that are discriminated against. And arguably the issue with the Canada Day riot was the restriction on where you could drink. When you confine it to small areas people tend to binge once they get in. You're more likely to drink reasonably if you don't have to wait in line for an hour to get into the beer tent.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Top_Dawg View Post
    Top_Dawg figgers they should relax the 50-1 requirement.

    Most of the burnouts at Folk Fest are so baked that they can't do anything anyways.
    I've volunteered in the Beer Gardens at Folk Fest as well as been a very avid customer in years past, and there's virtually never any security incidents there other than people trying to sneak in. It's just not a scene or vibe that would lead to significant problems. It seems idiotic to have a rule laying out security requirements that would apply the same formula or ratio to something like Boonstock (which was an absolute gong show the one year I went) as it would Folk Fest.

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    Yeah, and what Top_Dawg heard from some people who were at the Leg concert on that Canada Day was that Molson was completely caught off guard by the size of the crowd that showed up.

    And kept coming throughout the day as word got out.

    By late afternoon / early evening Molson beer tent volunteers quit charging for the beer and started promoing it all which led to hundreds of extremely intoxicated people in a relatively confined space on a very hot day.



    POWDERKEG !

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    Quote Originally Posted by overoceans View Post
    It’s complicated by what he calls “our somewhat outdated liquor laws.”
    Interesting, because there are many people who consider the ban on drinking in parks and other public locations to be an "outdated liquor law".

    I wonder if Wickham favours repealing that law, allowing everyone to BYOB, including to events like the Folk Fest. After all, it would mean less lining-up in the heat to buy beer from the Folk Fest booze monopoly.
    Booze monopoly? I'm afraid you're getting access to public locations that don't charge admission confused with paid events like the Folk Festival. There is still an element of crowd control that needs to be monitored and host liability is a big issue. In a public park there is no host providing access to alcohol.

    Big Rock is a corporate sponsor that came on board when in the late 80s, early 90s the Festival was in dire financial straits and Molsons decided to put their energy into Molsons Rocks events with big stars in other cities and terminated their sponsorship. (They made inquiries about returning a few years later but that's another story )

    The Folk Fest honours its long-term corporate sponsors and the relationships that have developed.

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    This is line with England, which has pretty relaxed liquor laws compared to here. The festival site was open and we could have our own liquor in the camping areas but could not bring our own through the gate onto the main site.

    Didn't seem unreasonable and allowed the festival the ability to cut people off if deemed necessary.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

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    While reviewing the OP EJ article and comments I became aware of this;

    Lineapple, lol;

    http://www.lineapple.com/

    An application to avoid waiting. Don't leave home without it.

    If I'm standing in line for something the one thing that would cause instant frustration would be for a bunch of people not in the real line, the actual line, bumping in because of some contrived app.

    Really the whole concept of lines is being able to decide whether the wait is worth it judging from the actual physical lineup. Imagine if the line also contains several hundred lineappled..

    Man, talk about an app that would instantly stir up ****. Glad they're not using it, can't believe somebody suggested it.

    That said the common practice of one person placeholding in line for a whole bunch of revellers that join in just before entry should also stop. Should be a limit to that. Maybe 4 people.

    "lineapple, you're important, your time is golden you precious little narcissists, just use the app and jump the cue on all the luddites, they don't count"

    edit; Oh, the person that suggested "lineapple" in the EJ comments is apparently the actual founder of lineapple. Figures.
    Last edited by Replacement; 08-06-2016 at 07:26 AM.
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    A number of comments on EFMF facebook page are fine with the present beer garden setup and don't want to have the festival involve more alcohol, drinking, or have it "all grounds" in a family festival. Really theres several other music fests that cater to more drinking, and if that's your cup of tea maybe those are better fit?

    That said seems like one stage area could be alcohol open and just have that fenced off and with max numbers and security for that stage. Seems like the only way they would swing this under current guidelines. Getting 1/50 security for the whole fest is not tenable and would be overkill.

    maybe somebody should open a pub in the area. Make a killing once a year...
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    This is basically the same system that Disneyland uses. Haven't been myself but a coworker says there you can get an electronic wristband that will notify you when it's your turn to board a ride. Allows them to not have people stuck in long lines waiting.

    For the folk fest, if they have to have a beer tent, it would be great for the patrons and the festival. People would likely spend less time in the tent and they'd have better flow through. Currently if you spent two hours in a line to get in, you don't have one beer and leave. With something like this you could register, go get something to eat (bonus for the food venues not in the beer tent) or hang out at a nearby stage.

    The downside, of course would be for people who don't have a smartphone. Probably not a good idea in the short term but I think if we reached a point where 80 or 90 per cent of people had smart phones this could be implemented pretty safely.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    It's just not a scene or vibe that would lead to significant problems.
    I think its a bit of a slippery slope though to have different rules for different events based on who you think might be going or might not be going.

    Personally I'd like to see more liberalization, but it has to be across the board then, like 24/7 bars and similar. I'm not sure just making an exception for this one even, or that one event, or similar, is logical.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    The downside, of course would be for people who don't have a smartphone. Probably not a good idea in the short term but I think if we reached a point where 80 or 90 per cent of people had smart phones this could be implemented pretty safely.
    We're likely bumping up against that now, actually. Not everyone is blindly holding on to a mid-market, youth-oriented GSM music phone from 2006 it seems.

    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

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    Ah yes.

    It's that time again.

    The end of summer draws near which means the ol' Burnout Festival must be almost upon us.

    A quick check confirms that kick-off is at six bells tonight.

    In fact Top_Dawg recalls seeing members of the set-up crew on Connors Hill earlier this week.

    By Saturday afternoon the grounds will be teeming with wasted flower children from the sixties, now bald and pot bellied, wandering from stage to stage, floating in and out of consciousness, reliving their youth in that all too familiar Fog of Peace while openly smoking marijuana, hashish, methamphetamine and dropping acid.

    At least the heavy smell of pot will mask the stench of sweaty crotch and sour azz that these matriarchs and patriarchs of two generations of illegitimate welfare cheats usually reek of.

    Of course late Sunday night, after their kumbaya moment, this agglomeration of slobs will zombie away, leaving an ungodly mess, Top_Dawg unsure whether it's by happenstance or by design, and their spawn of grandchildren will work off their community service hours all of next week cleaning up this stinking heap of garbage.

    Top_Dawg will naturally avoid the area all weekend lest this social leprosy prove contagious.

    Kentucky thunder to all who partake.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Top_Dawg View Post
    Ah yes.

    It's that time again.

    The end of summer draws near which means the ol' Burnout Festival must be almost upon us.

    A quick check confirms that kick-off is at six bells tonight.

    In fact Top_Dawg recalls seeing members of the set-up crew on Connors Hill earlier this week.

    By Saturday afternoon the grounds will be teeming with wasted flower children from the sixties, now bald and pot bellied, wandering from stage to stage, floating in and out of consciousness, reliving their youth in that all too familiar Fog of Peace while openly smoking marijuana, hashish, methamphetamine and dropping acid.

    At least the heavy smell of pot will mask the stench of sweaty crotch and sour azz that these matriarchs and patriarchs of two generations of illegitimate welfare cheats usually reek of.

    Of course late Sunday night, after their kumbaya moment, this agglomeration of slobs will zombie away, leaving an ungodly mess, Top_Dawg unsure whether it's by happenstance or by design, and their spawn of grandchildren will work off their community service hours all of next week cleaning up this stinking heap of garbage.

    Top_Dawg will naturally avoid the area all weekend lest this social leprosy prove contagious.

    Kentucky thunder to all who partake.


    So much hyperbole. I love it. You should post this on Reddit.

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    ^^It gives old gits a chance to hear themselves complain and think they're superior, so there's that for you to be proud of.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    It gives old gits a chance to hear themselves complain and think they're superior, so there's that for you to be proud of.
    The lack of self-awareness in this post is hilarious.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

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    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    It gives old gits a chance to hear themselves complain and think they're superior, so there's that for you to be proud of.
    The lack of self-awareness in this post is hilarious.
    That's how you deflected once before.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    It gives old gits a chance to hear themselves complain and think they're superior, so there's that for you to be proud of.
    The lack of self-awareness in this post is hilarious.
    That's how you deflected once before.
    The lack of self-awareness in this post is hilarious.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

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    Well that certainly was.

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    The annual tarp race has always been an amusingly silly part of the fest to me. Makes me wonder if there's ever been any brawls over coveted space?

    BTW they shut down early tonight because of the coming storm.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Top_Dawg View Post
    Ah yes.

    It's that time again.

    The end of summer draws near which means the ol' Burnout Festival must be almost upon us.

    A quick check confirms that kick-off is at six bells tonight.

    In fact Top_Dawg recalls seeing members of the set-up crew on Connors Hill earlier this week.

    By Saturday afternoon the grounds will be teeming with wasted flower children from the sixties, now bald and pot bellied, wandering from stage to stage, floating in and out of consciousness, reliving their youth in that all too familiar Fog of Peace while openly smoking marijuana, hashish, methamphetamine and dropping acid.

    At least the heavy smell of pot will mask the stench of sweaty crotch and sour azz that these matriarchs and patriarchs of two generations of illegitimate welfare cheats usually reek of.

    Of course late Sunday night, after their kumbaya moment, this agglomeration of slobs will zombie away, leaving an ungodly mess, Top_Dawg unsure whether it's by happenstance or by design, and their spawn of grandchildren will work off their community service hours all of next week cleaning up this stinking heap of garbage.

    Top_Dawg will naturally avoid the area all weekend lest this social leprosy prove contagious.

    Kentucky thunder to all who partake.
    Yeah, 'cuz the real classy crowd is hangin' out at the jack shacks, right Top Dawg?

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Top_Dawg View Post
    Ah yes.

    It's that time again.

    The end of summer draws near which means the ol' Burnout Festival must be almost upon us.

    A quick check confirms that kick-off is at six bells tonight.

    In fact Top_Dawg recalls seeing members of the set-up crew on Connors Hill earlier this week.

    By Saturday afternoon the grounds will be teeming with wasted flower children from the sixties, now bald and pot bellied, wandering from stage to stage, floating in and out of consciousness, reliving their youth in that all too familiar Fog of Peace while openly smoking marijuana, hashish, methamphetamine and dropping acid.

    At least the heavy smell of pot will mask the stench of sweaty crotch and sour azz that these matriarchs and patriarchs of two generations of illegitimate welfare cheats usually reek of.

    Of course late Sunday night, after their kumbaya moment, this agglomeration of slobs will zombie away, leaving an ungodly mess, Top_Dawg unsure whether it's by happenstance or by design, and their spawn of grandchildren will work off their community service hours all of next week cleaning up this stinking heap of garbage.

    Top_Dawg will naturally avoid the area all weekend lest this social leprosy prove contagious.

    Kentucky thunder to all who partake.

    Ha ha! Love your perspective.

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    Looking forward to going tonight and all day tomorrow.
    www.decl.org

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    I'll keep a sharp eye on IanO so that he doesn't get too liquored up!

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    Thanks again for the hospitality. Great night 1. Back at it today.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Top_Dawg View Post
    Ah yes.

    It's that time again.

    The end of summer draws near which means the ol' Burnout Festival must be almost upon us.

    A quick check confirms that kick-off is at six bells tonight.

    In fact Top_Dawg recalls seeing members of the set-up crew on Connors Hill earlier this week.

    By Saturday afternoon the grounds will be teeming with wasted flower children from the sixties, now bald and pot bellied, wandering from stage to stage, floating in and out of consciousness, reliving their youth in that all too familiar Fog of Peace while openly smoking marijuana, hashish, methamphetamine and dropping acid.

    At least the heavy smell of pot will mask the stench of sweaty crotch and sour azz that these matriarchs and patriarchs of two generations of illegitimate welfare cheats usually reek of.

    Of course late Sunday night, after their kumbaya moment, this agglomeration of slobs will zombie away, leaving an ungodly mess, Top_Dawg unsure whether it's by happenstance or by design, and their spawn of grandchildren will work off their community service hours all of next week cleaning up this stinking heap of garbage.

    Top_Dawg will naturally avoid the area all weekend lest this social leprosy prove contagious.

    Kentucky thunder to all who partake.
    Rofl!

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