Results 1 to 75 of 75

Thread: How many LED bulbs in your house?

  1. #1

    Default How many LED bulbs in your house?

    Anyone curious about how the movement away from incandescent bulbs is going and how fast LEDs are replacing incandescent, compact fluorescent and other bulbs in homes?

    So of all the light fixtures and lamps you have, how many now have LEDs in them?


    And just came across this article (below). I'd read the referenced one about the manufacturers creating cheaper bulbs that would burn out sooner and wondered about LEDs. Seems that that is a possibility. Maybe time to think about finding the best quality LEDs and getting them in place.
    Uh-oh: LED Light bulbs may last too long
    BY JOHN MATARESE MONDAY, AUGUST 29TH 2016
    http://wjla.com/features/7-on-your-s...-last-too-long
    Last edited by KC; 30-08-2016 at 01:20 PM.

  2. #2
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Edmonton
    Posts
    3,569

    Default

    We just moved in to our new house.
    We have ten incandescent bulbs in the old edison filament style. I know them make LED versions of these, and I have a couple to try out.
    We also have incandescent bulbs in the motion activated security lights, but they're on for maybe 20 mins a day, so I'm not concerned about them.
    The rest (well over 100) are all LED. Replaced all our xmas lights with LED's as well. All our landscape lighting will also be LED.

    I'm very curious to see what our power consumption is in the house vs our old house. I'm looking for a 5-10% drop despite the new house being twice as big with substantially more lights.

  3. #3
    C2E Continued Contributor
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Iqaluit, Nunavut
    Posts
    1,942

    Default

    All of our bulbs are LED I believe. Oh, except the bathroom fixture which has some T8 florescents I think?

    edit: 1 year old condo that had nothing installed previously.
    Last edited by Channing; 30-08-2016 at 01:55 PM.

  4. #4

    Default

    I think we have a few other threads on this topic. Personally, I have removed all the LED's I had as they expired, and they expired very fast (typically die by flickering). I now get halogen or similar, not impressed at all by this technology, its nice in theory but not in practice when you have to replace expensive bulbs after only a couple of years. I simply don't believe the OP article on led life, not my experience at all, but maybe manufacturers are doing what it suggests, sabotaging them.
    Last edited by moahunter; 30-08-2016 at 01:51 PM.

  5. #5
    C2E Stole my Heart!!!!
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Downtown Edmonton
    Posts
    9,542

    Default

    When I bought my place from my brother 10+ years ago, he left behind a big ol'box of spare lightbulbs for the various types of fixtures in my place. I've still got a handful left of the old incandescents that I intend on using before moving to LED's. As far as I'm concerned, it's just as wasteful and bad for the environment to throw out perfectly good incandescents. A few fixtures are already on LED's, as I ran out of the old bulbs. GU20 type, I think. Stupid things burnt out continuously and were quite expensive to replace. The new LEDs look nearly identical in terms of appearance and light quality, and they've already lasted several times longer than the old ones. And I think they were close to the same price (bought some no name ones off Amazon). I also had some custom millwork done a year ago, and made sure that the fixtures built in to those were LED as well.

    Long story short, I'm somewhere around 50/50 for LED vs. incandescent at this point.

  6. #6

    Default

    100%

    All Phillips, one remote control bulb for the bedroom. All 'bright white' (halfway between 'daylight' and 'soft'.)
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  7. #7

    Default

    None. Most bulbs are CFL's.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  8. #8

    Default

    None.

    I was all about the CFL's when they came out but just like Moa was disappointed in longevity. I also had problems with CFL size, color and lumens. I stocked up on incandescent before their demise. Hopefully the LED come down in cost and up in reliability before my stock runs out!

  9. #9

    Default

    I have all incandescent bulbs, I prefer the light. Stocked up in two stages, first time was the initial phase on 100watts second go was on the 60's. Should be good for 5 years. I believe incandescent 100watt bulbs are still available through acklands or Gregg distributors, construction grade bulbs. These are identical as your normal bulb with the difference being more bump resistant and a coating (film)that prevents shards of glass everywhere if broke.

  10. #10

    Default

    Phillips "bright white" looks better than any incandescent, and for the price, they pay for themselves if you watch your power bills.

    Another advantage for lights in floor/table/desk lamps is really low heat.

    No regrets.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  11. #11

    Default

    90%, as I upgrade the wiring and or replace fixtures I change out to LED. Soft white as I hate daylight. I am about to change out the Florescent tubes in the basement with LEDs. The house is a 70s build so anything that I can do to make it more efficient the better.

  12. #12

    Default

    ^ try "bright white". Much better than either "daylight" or "soft white".

    Although if you're looking "whole house", probably find a lot more low-hanging-fruit in refrigerators and freezers.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  13. #13
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Edmonton (Norwood)
    Posts
    4,343

    Default

    Mostly CFLs in my house, but they will slowly be replaced with LEDs as they die. That might take a while though, they don't seem to fail prematurely any more and I have about 8 spare CFLs right now.
    I don't get why orange (soft white, warm white, 2700 K) and blue (daylight, 5000 K) are so popular. I like most lights somewhere in the middle - "bright white" (3000 K) for general indoor use, and 3500 K or 4000 K for brighter areas like the kitchen. 3000s can usually be found if you look around a while, but I have yet to find any 3500 K or 4000 K LEDs

  14. #14

    Default

    ^I prefer soft white, I find it more relaxing / less harsh, but to each their own I guess.

  15. #15
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Edmonton
    Posts
    3,569

    Default

    As a photographer, I'm somewhat more attuned to light colour, light quality, and specularity and it took me a long time to find some LED potlight trims that were comparable to a good halogen pot. I did find a brand that is perfect though. I think it's 2900K, 95 CRI which I find important. And LED more closely resembles a single spot of light (with reflector similar to PAR or GU styles) rather than the typical LED trims which are just an opaque circle (more reminiscent of the BR style pot bulbs). Expensive at $50 a piece, but since it was new construction, I just consider it a capital cost. I did buy a few extra as spares as you don't want to have to mix and match trims in the future especially since the trim is integrated these days.

    I also found some of the LED bulbs at Ikea are not too bad. High CRI, though some of them are inconsistent with a pinkish tinge. Not all their bulbs have high CRI though.

    All the bulbs in the house are 2700-2900K and the bulbs outside are 3000K.

  16. #16
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Sherwood park
    Posts
    2,261

    Default

    My electrician wanted me to change out the pot lights in a house to "flush mount" LED's. I looked at them in the house next door and also thought they trimmed out looking like crap.

    We have zero LEDs in our house.

  17. #17
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Edmonton (Norwood)
    Posts
    4,343

    Default

    ^^ I like the BR style (not a fan of sharp cutoffs for interior lighting) so I went with the standard "opaque circle" recessed LEDs in my basement (3000 K). Nice and small (mount in a 3 inch hole), and no worries about overheating like with incandescent recessed lights. I figure I will just change them all if they have been discontinued when they start to fail.

  18. #18

    Default

    Every single province........except Alberta.........offers some type of rebate on LED's. I suspect this will change in 2017 when the carbon tax details come out

  19. #19
    Plug C2E into my veins!!!
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Edmonton, Alberta, Westwood
    Posts
    16,041

    Default

    All my fixtures or bulbs etc are LED except for a couple lamps I am waiting to burn out.

  20. #20

    Default

    Restrictions on incandescent light bulbs just a joke


    I just came back from Toronto during the TIFF festival.


    Going a round to bars, restaurants, stores and homes, everyone has these vintage Edison style light bulbs. You can buy them in all the stores. Many of the restaurants I went to or looked into had 40, 50 or 60 of them glowing dimly, increasing not only the amount of energy used compared to a normal incandescent bulb by probably a factor of four but also increasing the air conditioning load.


    I admit I like them but how come these things are allowed? Is it because they can sell them for $10 each compared to 2 for a dollar of the ordinary type. Is it all about profit for the huge light bulb manufacturers and the whole efficiency thing is just a ruse to ban them? I saw some LED versions Edison style light bulbs for sale but not in use, in any place I went.


    IMHO, if they wanted to ban inefficient light bulbs, the vintage ones would be the first banned.

    (originally posted in wrong thread)
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  21. #21

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by happydays View Post
    Every single province........except Alberta.........offers some type of rebate on LED's. I suspect this will change in 2017 when the carbon tax details come out

    LED manufacturer's must be thrilled with rebates. It allows them to keep prices artificially high and get taxpayer money. IMHO, the free market should be allowed to prevail, not artificial incentives and corporate welfare.

    It is disgusting that a single bulb for home use should cost $50, $60 and even $75.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  22. #22

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Restrictions on incandescent light bulbs just a joke


    I just came back from Toronto during the TIFF festival.


    Going a round to bars, restaurants, stores and homes, everyone has these vintage Edison style light bulbs. You can buy them in all the stores. Many of the restaurants I went to or looked into had 40, 50 or 60 of them glowing dimly, increasing not only the amount of energy used compared to a normal incandescent bulb by probably a factor of four but also increasing the air conditioning load.


    I admit I like them but how come these things are allowed? Is it because they can sell them for $10 each compared to 2 for a dollar of the ordinary type. Is it all about profit for the huge light bulb manufacturers and the whole efficiency thing is just a ruse to ban them? I saw some LED versions Edison style light bulbs for sale but not in use, in any place I went.


    IMHO, if they wanted to ban inefficient light bulbs, the vintage ones would be the first banned.

    (originally posted in wrong thread)
    Did you actually feel heat from them? I strongly suspect what you're seeing is actually an LED bulb:



    Antique LED Filament Bulbs
    Popular in restaurants, lobbies, coffee shops, or even old diners, antique light bulbs have made a huge resurgence over the last few decades. Better still, LED lights have recently been developed to mimic these beautiful bulbs with an LED "filament" that looks similar to the classic wire wound filament of an incandescent. That's right, the warm glow of a vintage reproduction incandescent now comes in energy-efficient Edison, Victorian, globe, chandelier, and tubular styles. Not sure what the differences are? Call our expert staff here at 1000Bulbs.com. We'll help you find the best size and style for your space.
    Source
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  23. #23

    Default

    Yes, I actually did touch the bulbs. They look similar but up close, you can easily see and feel the difference, filaments are much finer and hotter. Most of the ones in restaurants are in low slung fixtures and being 6'3" tall makes it easy for me to check them out. Over our table in a pizza restaurant, the fixture had 12 medium base bulbs and they were very hot and we talked about them wherever we went. Out of the couple of dozen stores and restaurants we went to over the 5 day weekend, me and my friends must have checked out a dozen and a half of them. It became a sport.

    In fact, this weekend was the first time I saw the LED type in use and that was in a lighting store. They told me that they sell 10 times more of the filament type than the LED except if the person can afford them or if the architect/interior designer specs them in. We saw them in one Thai restaurant.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  24. #24

    Default

    Bulb Still Burning After 100-Plus Years ...
    http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/business...ss-back-to-us/


    I once saw these in Florida - still being used:

    Edison`s Home In Florida Still Aglow With The Spirit Of Inventive Genius
    February 10, 1985|By Jerry Morris, Boston Globe.

    Then I think of Thomas Edison`s winter home in Ft. Myers. The lights Edison installed in here in 1925 are still burning, and they`ve been doing so 12 hours every day. The light bulbs, though, are just part of the remarkable story to be found here.

    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1...anical-gardens
    Last edited by KC; 13-09-2016 at 01:41 PM.

  25. #25

    Default

    Low temp DC bulbs last almost forever, high temp AC bulbs burn out faster

    My brother still has several 1920's filament bulbs taken out of a mine mill they were demolishing and burning down in the Yukon.

    On each bulb was etched "STOLEN".

    If you were caught with a stolen bulb in your bunkhouse back in the 20's and 30's, you would be fired.

    In looking for a picture, I found this article about bulbs in Anyox, BC


    source
    Istvan Hernadi
    http://globalnews.ca/news/1473140/gh...-of-anyox-b-c/

    I have heard that the high prices of LED bulbs lead to a lot being stolen today.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  26. #26

    Default

    Fascinating.

    I bought one "antique LED" bulb maybe three years ago (can't remember where) (and can't presently find it.) I think it was three watts and it's practically indistinguishable from a filament version at a distance. I found it good for 2 day novelty, but just as I don't like "soft white" I quickly put it in a drawer or box somewhere.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  27. #27
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Edmonton (Norwood)
    Posts
    4,343

    Default

    ^^ It has nothing to do with AC vs DC, although lower voltage does help. Lifetime and efficiency are inversely related for incandescent bulbs. As you make the filament hotter the light output goes up much faster than the electricity consumption, but the evaporation rate goes up rapidly as well. A 40 W bulb rated for 1000 hours and a 60 W bulb rated for 5000 hours had roughly the same light output. Lowering the voltage allowed the filament to be made a bit shorter and thicker and thus more resistant to evaporation.

  28. #28

    Default

    I still have quite a few incandescents in pot lights in 'lightly' used rooms. Have replaced incandescent and CFs in the kitchen, living room, half bedrooms, hallways, plus half the outdoor lights are now LEDs. My garage is crappy, routinely prematurely failing CFs - but I have more to use up.

    So I grabbed an online savings calculator and started playing with the numbers using a 90% drop in wattage. (Trying to justify replacing more bulbs.) In the little used rooms I guessed usage equals maybe at most an hour a day, assuming 2 hrs / day in the winter and none in the summer, and that usage/consumption may be WAY TOO HIGH. At 4-8-cents/kWh the savings become very negligible (pennies a year) even by cutting the LED bulb price in half of current market (assuming they will get cheaper and cheaper).

    So, while I may still replace some bulbs, their usage is so low in those locations that I don't think I can financially gain any more from bulb replacement. I have years worth of incandescent bulbs in storage due to replacing them.

    Now, in terms of the environment does it make any sense to buy more big honking resource sucking LED bulbs (compared to the near nothing in resouces in the incandescent bulbs) to save a bit of air pollution at the cost of mining, shipping,refining, producing and shipping these LED bulbs here from China?


    Also, if I'm a decent example of people making the shift to LED bulbs, it shows that this market's CO2 savings will quickly meet its maximum benefit - residental benefit. Therefore, what's next? Just my furnace motors and my appliances, incl. various "Screens".
    Last edited by KC; 30-09-2016 at 08:50 PM.

  29. #29
    C2E Continued Contributor
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    YEG
    Posts
    1,499

    Default

    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)

  30. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)
    And your reasoning is?

  31. #31
    C2E Continued Contributor
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    YEG
    Posts
    1,499

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)
    And your reasoning is?
    I stated it right in what I wrote. The cost of the LED bulb is too high.

  32. #32
    Plug C2E into my veins!!!
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Edmonton, Alberta, Westwood
    Posts
    16,041

    Default

    They last 25 years. I don't have to replace them. And i save on electricity costs. Sounds worth $7 to me.

  33. #33
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Westmount, Edmonton
    Posts
    5,326

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)
    LED bulbs are far cheaper than incandescent over their lifespan. During the lifespan of an LED you'd replace an incandescent around 40 times. While the upfront cost is high, if you replace the bulbs as your incandescent's burn out that cost will be spread out. Also consider each bulb will be drawing 1/5th of the power for equivalent lumens so your power bill drops a bit as well.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

  34. #34
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Where ever the pilot takes me
    Posts
    2,047

    Default

    ^This summer I bought a pack of 8 LED bulbs @ Costco for $17.
    Did my dog just fall into a pothole???

  35. #35

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by norwoodguy View Post
    ^This summer I bought a pack of 8 LED bulbs @ Costco for $17.
    If they are 100w equivalent that would be a price I could justify. I find a lot of bulbs are 60w and too dim for my liking. For me, the lights I use most are kitchen and bathroom. Kitchen I can use anything, but my bathroom has that long array of globes and those are still way too expensive. I might consider them if my CFL's go, but the ones I have now have been going strong for 5 years so there's no point replacing them until they die.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  36. #36

    Default

    They are rapidly falling in price but I figure if I can get payback in one to two years time then why put in another incandescent. When I've bought a pack I pull the incandescent and put in theLED a sap to start making back the money. If i move in the near future, I may be pulling all those old incandescents out of storage and installing them while taking the LEDs with me.

  37. #37

    Default

    Yeah I haven't purchased any incandescent bulbs since I moved to the current place over 5 years ago. I swapped them out for CFL's as they went (other than kitchen and bath which I replaced immediately due to consumption). Will check out LED as the CFL's die off.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  38. #38

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)
    LED bulbs are far cheaper than incandescent over their lifespan. During the lifespan of an LED you'd replace an incandescent around 40 times. While the upfront cost is high, if you replace the bulbs as your incandescent's burn out that cost will be spread out. Also consider each bulb will be drawing 1/5th of the power for equivalent lumens so your power bill drops a bit as well.
    Not my experience, the LED I have had, all seem to fail early / flicker. LED's are nice in theory, but I don't think the technology is mature enough yet to be worth the money. I buy cheap halogens now, I like the color and I don't stress when they burn out about the waste. I stay away from CFL's (bad experience re color and how long last).

    Maybe when the carbon tax kicks in I'll have to reconsider lol.
    Last edited by moahunter; 03-10-2016 at 12:15 PM.

  39. #39

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)
    LED bulbs are far cheaper than incandescent over their lifespan. During the lifespan of an LED you'd replace an incandescent around 40 times. While the upfront cost is high, if you replace the bulbs as your incandescent's burn out that cost will be spread out. Also consider each bulb will be drawing 1/5th of the power for equivalent lumens so your power bill drops a bit as well.
    Not my experience, the LED I have had, all seem to fail early / flicker. LED's are nice in theory, but I don't think the technology is mature enough yet to be worth the money. I buy cheap halogens now, I like the color and I don't stress when they burn out about the waste. I stay away from CFL's (bad experience re color and how long last).

    Maybe when the carbon tax kicks in I'll have to reconsider lol.
    I've had lots of CFs fail. To the point of going back to incandescents to get more longevity even when I had more CFs in my cupboard. Mostly the cheapest brand CFs mind you. A couple looked dangerously overheated as well.

    All I can recall is one LED out of maybe 20 or so failing and that was just the other day (see post above). Zero flicker issues even on those used outside. However I believe I've only bought Phillips and Cree, and maybe a GE.

    As for colour, indoors I can only handle the soft white. The day light makes it seem like I'm in a welding shop.
    Last edited by KC; 03-10-2016 at 12:34 PM.

  40. #40

    Default The big lie about LED lighting

    ^I think modern energy efficeint halogens are the best of all worlds. They are very cheap, they last longer than traditional incandescent, 30% better energy over traditional incandescent, and they can have a good color. You might be right some LED's do better (the cheap ones suck per my experience), but I think those cost a lot, more than I am willing to gamble on lasting.

    Here's an article on the flicker / failure issue, it seems the issue is that an LED circuit is larger than with incandescent (I guess to connect all the LED bulbs into one unit), which increases the risk of failure of any aspect of it:

    Scott Elder, principal engineer with Linear Technology discusses why LED lighting fails earlier than consumers might expect.

    I've had it with LED lamps. The world has been told that LEDs are the future, in part because they are economically the right form of long-term lighting, and there are environmental benefits as a great aside. Well, maybe the environmental argument is true, but the economical one is not.

    My wife has converted a substantial amount of our home lighting, as well as our holiday decoration lighting, to LED bulbs. Despite all this investment, I have yet to experience the primary benefit of long life. This made me sit down recently and ask myself why.

    As it turns out, the answer is quite simple. The lifetime is not a function of the LED, but rather the total circuit solution.
    http://www.electronics-eetimes.com/n...t-led-lighting

    I'm guessing the high end LED's have good components, and high quality manufacturing, in those much more complex than incandescent circuits, the bargain ones people are picking up in Supermarkets for 10 or 15 dollars don't.



    That's going to create a backlash against LED from people like me, who try it, see it fail to get anywhere near the life promised on the box (the LED bulbs themselves lasts, but not all the electrical stuff connecting them all into a unit), and go back to what works. If I hear a house is all LED, its actually a purchasing turn off, not a positive, odds are its been retrofitted, or built, with the cheapest LED's on the market.

    Here is a consumer report on Cree:

    The tests. Our engineers conduct a number of different tests for brightness, energy use, light color, and more. Cycle testing tells us how the bulbs hold up after being frequently turned on and off. That on/off affects CFLs, but hadn’t affected LEDs, until now. Four of the eight Cree LEDs died after about a third of the way through the test.

    And in our 3,000 hours life test, two of the 10 LEDs died, something that is unusual for LEDs but we have seen this in the past. One Cree LED went out before 500 hours and the other around 1,700 hours. This LED is meant to last 25,000 hours, or nearly 23 years when used 3 hours a day.
    http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/n...ests/index.htm

    That one is interesting because the lights performed worse when switched on and off a lot. That might be part of my issue, I switch off lights when I leave a room, if I left them on all the time, maybe the LED's would have done better.
    Last edited by moahunter; 03-10-2016 at 01:12 PM.

  41. #41
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Westmount, Edmonton
    Posts
    5,326

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GranaryMan View Post
    I have Zero LED bulbs in my house. I will not buy them either until they cost the same price as the incandescent light build ($3 for a pack of 4?)
    LED bulbs are far cheaper than incandescent over their lifespan. During the lifespan of an LED you'd replace an incandescent around 40 times. While the upfront cost is high, if you replace the bulbs as your incandescent's burn out that cost will be spread out. Also consider each bulb will be drawing 1/5th of the power for equivalent lumens so your power bill drops a bit as well.
    Not my experience, the LED I have had, all seem to fail early / flicker. LED's are nice in theory, but I don't think the technology is mature enough yet to be worth the money. I buy cheap halogens now, I like the color and I don't stress when they burn out about the waste. I stay away from CFL's (bad experience re color and how long last).

    Maybe when the carbon tax kicks in I'll have to reconsider lol.
    Not my experience but we haven't used a lot yet as we tend to switch bulbs out through attrition. I did have issues like this with CF's which really didn't like the power in my old house. It'll be interesting to see how it goes.

    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong"

  42. #42

    Default

    All Phillips, zero failure.

    My power bill loves me.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  43. #43

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    ^I think modern energy efficeint halogens are the best of all worlds. They are very cheap, they last longer than traditional incandescent, 30% better energy over traditional incandescent, and they can have a good color. You might be right some LED's do better (the cheap ones suck per my experience), but I think those cost a lot, more than I am willing to gamble on lasting.

    Here's an article on the flicker / failure issue, it seems the issue is that an LED circuit is larger than with incandescent (I guess to connect all the LED bulbs into one unit), which increases the risk of failure of any aspect of it:

    Scott Elder, principal engineer with Linear Technology discusses why LED lighting fails earlier than consumers might expect.

    I've had it with LED lamps. The world has been told that LEDs are the future, in part because they are economically the right form of long-term lighting, and there are environmental benefits as a great aside. Well, maybe the environmental argument is true, but the economical one is not.

    My wife has converted a substantial amount of our home lighting, as well as our holiday decoration lighting, to LED bulbs. Despite all this investment, I have yet to experience the primary benefit of long life. This made me sit down recently and ask myself why.

    As it turns out, the answer is quite simple. The lifetime is not a function of the LED, but rather the total circuit solution.
    http://www.electronics-eetimes.com/n...t-led-lighting

    I'm guessing the high end LED's have good components, and high quality manufacturing, in those much more complex than incandescent circuits, the bargain ones people are picking up in Supermarkets for 10 or 15 dollars don't.



    That's going to create a backlash against LED from people like me, who try it, see it fail to get anywhere near the life promised on the box (the LED bulbs themselves lasts, but not all the electrical stuff connecting them all into a unit), and go back to what works. If I hear a house is all LED, its actually a purchasing turn off, not a positive, odds are its been retrofitted, or built, with the cheapest LED's on the market.

    Here is a consumer report on Cree:

    The tests. Our engineers conduct a number of different tests for brightness, energy use, light color, and more. Cycle testing tells us how the bulbs hold up after being frequently turned on and off. That on/off affects CFLs, but hadn’t affected LEDs, until now. Four of the eight Cree LEDs died after about a third of the way through the test.

    And in our 3,000 hours life test, two of the 10 LEDs died, something that is unusual for LEDs but we have seen this in the past. One Cree LED went out before 500 hours and the other around 1,700 hours. This LED is meant to last 25,000 hours, or nearly 23 years when used 3 hours a day.
    http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/n...ests/index.htm

    That one is interesting because the lights performed worse when switched on and off a lot. That might be part of my issue, I switch off lights when I leave a room, if I left them on all the time, maybe the LED's would have done better.

    Very interesting. Much like solar panel failures the industry is seeing. High upfront capital cost, high upfront capital lost.

    If you want to kill an emerging industry, legislate or impose the product's use, produce crappy quality product and wait for the backlash.*

    Score:
    Alberta's energy industry: 1
    Militant Environmentalists: 0


    * think: Edmonton's bike lane and LRT strategies.


    BTW Phillips isn't perfect. As I said above, my one LED failure was a Phillips bulb.
    Last edited by KC; 03-10-2016 at 05:50 PM.

  44. #44

    Default

    ^ well excuuuuuse me.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  45. #45

    Default

    Controversially I've just realised I actually have two Cree Par38s (wider spread than the Phillips) which are also functioning flawlessly for 10+ hours daily for three years now.

    Oh the horror.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  46. #46

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    Controversially I've just realised I actually have two Cree Par38s (wider spread than the Phillips) which are also functioning flawlessly for 10+ hours daily for three years now.

    Oh the horror.
    Just don't let anyone near that light switch. One flip too many and...

  47. #47

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    All Phillips, zero failure.

    My power bill loves me.
    Interesting. My choice of bulbs has such a negligible impact on my bills. I'm sure 98% of my power usage is my appliances and computer. If we really want to save the planet, find a way to make efficient cooling (refrigerators and AC).
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  48. #48

    Default

    ^ every bit counts though, and besides, Phillips "Bright White" is excellent colour, and LED is lower heat too.

    I am newly set-up with pretty close to top efficiency appliances everywhere but the dishwasher, so there's not too much left for low hanging fruit anymore (besides adjusting lifestyle, I guess.)

    If/when I get some data I'll try to estimate.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  49. #49

    Default

    Jaybee, how's your hot water consumption? To reduce your reduce your energy consumption, take 3 minute, cold showers and limit it to once per month.

    Make those 3 minutes count.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 07-10-2016 at 06:51 AM.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  50. #50

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chmilz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    All Phillips, zero failure.

    My power bill loves me.
    Interesting. My choice of bulbs has such a negligible impact on my bills. I'm sure 98% of my power usage is my appliances and computer. If we really want to save the planet, find a way to make efficient cooling (refrigerators and AC).
    You are just producing needed heat, electric heat, most of the year ( winter months and summer nights) thus reducing your furnace run time.

  51. #51

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    ^ every bit counts though, and besides, Phillips "Bright White" is excellent colour, and LED is lower heat too.

    I am newly set-up with pretty close to top efficiency appliances everywhere but the dishwasher, so there's not too much left for low hanging fruit anymore (besides adjusting lifestyle, I guess.)

    If/when I get some data I'll try to estimate.


    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Jaybee, how's your hot water consumption? To reduce your reduce your energy consumption, take 3 minute, cold showers and limit it to once per month.

    Make those 3 minutes count.
    Cold shower! About those low hanging fruit...

  52. #52
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Edmonton
    Posts
    3,569

    Default

    The dryer and fridge account for over 20% of power consumption in your house on average. The dryer being the majority of that. Average Edmonton household uses 7200kWh a year and the dryer could be anywhere from 650-950kwh/yr. More if you have lots of kids!

    In our old house we were running 6150kWh a year. In our new house (twice the size with all LED and efficient appliances) my target was 5400kWh a year and it looks like we will meet or beat that.

  53. #53

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    ^ every bit counts though, and besides, Phillips "Bright White" is excellent colour, and LED is lower heat too.

    I am newly set-up with pretty close to top efficiency appliances everywhere but the dishwasher, so there's not too much left for low hanging fruit anymore (besides adjusting lifestyle, I guess.)

    If/when I get some data I'll try to estimate.


    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Jaybee, how's your hot water consumption? To reduce your reduce your energy consumption, take 3 minute, cold showers and limit it to once per month.

    Make those 3 minutes count.
    Cold shower! About those low hanging fruit...
    Hot water and heat included in condo fees.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  54. #54

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nobleea View Post
    The dryer and fridge account for over 20% of power consumption in your house on average. The dryer being the majority of that. Average Edmonton household uses 7200kWh a year and the dryer could be anywhere from 650-950kwh/yr. More if you have lots of kids!

    In our old house we were running 6150kWh a year. In our new house (twice the size with all LED and efficient appliances) my target was 5400kWh a year and it looks like we will meet or beat that.
    Running one of those Japanese single-drum washer/dryer units. It uses a heat pump internally to steam the clothes and re-condense the water. Uses a lot less space, which I love because the laundry room is basically a closet, and this allows the hampers stacked on top, but also less electricity.

    375 kWh for the whole unit in September, which would hit 4,500 kWh for the full year, but considering the amount of AC used in September, I think it gets lower than that. Like I said, the only appliance I'm looking at is the dishwasher.

    I think at that point LED are probably significantly noticeable in place of incandescent, but I haven't really had the chance to measure or calculate anything.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  55. #55

    Default

    Some rough data from September:

    2X 18 Watt LED floodlights (on green wall), ~12 hours per day = ~13 kWh.

    1X 14 Watt LED aquarium light, ~12 hours per day = ~5 kWh.

    = 18 kWh of 375 kWh for the month, not including the light used for reading/cooking/working/etc.


    Replacing:

    2X 90 Watt halogen floodlights = ~65 kWh

    2X 54 Watt T5 full spectrum fluorescents = ~39 kWh

    = ~104 kWh using non-LED technology with acceptable aesthetics


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Energy saved by using LED, 86 kWh, 19% of my power costs (not including transmission, obviously.)




    19%? Yeah, that's significant. I can see that. And again, not even including room lighting.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  56. #56

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chmilz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    All Phillips, zero failure.

    My power bill loves me.
    Interesting. My choice of bulbs has such a negligible impact on my bills. I'm sure 98% of my power usage is my appliances and computer. If we really want to save the planet, find a way to make efficient cooling (refrigerators and AC).
    You are just producing needed heat, electric heat, most of the year ( winter months and summer nights) thus reducing your furnace run time.
    That heat sure isn't needed in my condo, where I have to use AC for 5 months, and heat in the Winter is included in condo fees. Exactly the opposite: cooler bulbs/appliances = better/cheaper.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  57. #57
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Edmonton (Norwood)
    Posts
    4,343

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nobleea View Post
    The dryer and fridge account for over 20% of power consumption in your house on average. The dryer being the majority of that. Average Edmonton household uses 7200kWh a year and the dryer could be anywhere from 650-950kwh/yr. More if you have lots of kids!

    In our old house we were running 6150kWh a year. In our new house (twice the size with all LED and efficient appliances) my target was 5400kWh a year and it looks like we will meet or beat that.
    Which is why I don't understand the rarity of gas appliances. A majority of Canadian houses have natural gas service for heating, but I'd guess that 1 in 10 or less have a gas dryer and gas stove. Light bulbs and fridges have made great gains in efficiency in the last 15 years, but heating appliances haven't and never will. The amount of energy needed to heat and evaporate water isn't going to change.
    Last edited by Titanium48; 09-10-2016 at 12:31 PM.

  58. #58

    Default

    ^ correct that gas is the better heat source, but in my condo, no choice. Heat and hot water are communal gas, but IH stove and heat-pump dryer are as good as it gets.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  59. #59

    Default

    What do LED bulbs in private homes have to do with civic infrastructure?

  60. #60

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post

    Very interesting. Much like solar panel failures the industry is seeing. High upfront capital cost, high upfront capital lost.

    If you want to kill an emerging industry, legislate or impose the product's use, produce crappy quality product and wait for the backlash.*

    Score:
    Alberta's energy industry: 1
    Militant Environmentalists: 0


    * think: Edmonton's bike lane and LRT strategies.


    BTW Phillips isn't perfect. As I said above, my one LED failure was a Phillips bulb.
    100% agree. The crappy painted line bike lanes in Edmonton sabotaged them. The crappy LEDs being sold on mass in supermarkets is sabotaging them. The technology / manufacturing process to build those circuits at a cheap enough price to justify the energy savings without failures when people switch on and off lights frequently (ie traditional energy saving behaviour), just isn't there yet. I am very happy with the way halogen technology has improved though, I expect it's going to be the type of bulb which wins a lot of support as people get more and more frustrated with LEDs and CFs.
    Last edited by moahunter; 10-10-2016 at 09:56 AM.

  61. #61

    Default

    ^
    #bitter #illogical #frustrated
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  62. #62
    C2E Posting Power
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Downtown Edmonton
    Posts
    944

    Default

    I changed over 28 bulbs since I moved into my condo downtown. In the second month I changed all but 8 of my bathroom globe lights. The electricity savings were significant. My Power Bill dropped about 6 bucks a month - a significance of about a 10% drop in the overall bill. I have had zero failures on my exterior bulbs, my utility room bulbs, or any of my general phillips 2700k bulbs and ambiance bulbs.

    Then something sweet happened a few months back. I went to go buy 8 globe bulbs for my condo from Wal Mart and the price tallied up over 240 dollars. I noticed the price was off by a couple bucks per bulb and made a passive comment about it. I didn't really care but still wanted to get the right price and it turned out they screwed up on the shelf pricing. SO; they gave me some sort of price code violation discount and I got the bulbs for six bucks a piece.

    You're living the life of an adult when something like that gets you pumped. lol

  63. #63

    Default

    Two interesting articles from the same site:

    A buyers guide:
    http://www.which.co.uk/reviews/light...ght-light-bulb

    Premature failure testing:

    Are your LED light bulbs burning out too soon?
    https://conversation.which.co.uk/hom...tcp-life-span/
    Last edited by KC; 10-10-2016 at 04:25 PM.

  64. #64

    Default

    95.7% LED, 45 Philips LED (including 3 outside lights) and 2 halogens in the master bathroom which are a special bulb, I think they're T3 bulbs. I've even replaced my under-cabinet lights in my kitchen with LED and they are those weird little G8 bulbs.

    I bought the LED's 4-5 years ago, and although it was quite expensive, I've had zero failures, and they're all warm-white. The great thing is that even in the -40 degree winters, the LED's outside still work great. Power bills are low, but I've also done other power-saving things, like how we charge our cellphones and tablets from a USB battery pack that recharges through solar, and switching to a Mini PC that runs off of 5 volts. This made a big change from my gaming PC which consumed 700-900 Watts, to the Mini PC which at idle is 5 Watts, and 18 Watts under heavy load.

  65. #65

    Default

    One thing to note about LED bulbs. There are a number of resellers selling lower cost bulbs that only have CE approval or UL, not ULC or CSA. If you have a fire because of one of these unapproved bulbs, your fire insurance may not cover your loss.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  66. #66

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    One thing to note about LED bulbs. There are a number of resellers selling lower cost bulbs that only have CE approval or UL, not ULC or CSA. If you have a fire because of one of these unapproved bulbs, your fire insurance may not cover your loss.
    I think that depends on your insurance policy. Mine are all CSA. However, if your insurance policy doesn't specifically state that your bulbs are required to be CSA approved, then I can't see how they could deny you a claim.

  67. #67

    Default

    Unapproved electrical devices
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  68. #68

    Default

    Still no LED's installed, but they had 4-packs on sale for $5 at Costco a few weeks ago so I picked up a couple. $1.25 per is about what I'm willing to spend on a lightbulb.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  69. #69

    Default

    Still not one LED installed. As a rule I don't go chasing after new tech, I NEVER believe the promises of longevity, and try to stay with the knowns. I'm a born skeptic so this comes easily to me. heh

    Skimmed through the thread and the economics of saving money by buying all LEDS is inferred on the manufacturers stated length of a product, on a new product.


    This reminds me of some companies in Edmonton selling "lifetime (standard tar based) shingles". They swear up and down they will last the rest of your life, you will never have to replace them. The company was in business for less than 10yrs. So I asked who's going to honor the warranty? Absolute silence. People are paying 1000's extra for these lifetime shingles that are still tar impregnated shingles. I don't get how they will last a lifetime.

    Oh wait, its lies.

    This one will drive the ladies nuts. But in Germany they used to make lifetime pantyhose, stockings and such. They actually did last a long time. They didn't tear, at all, the polymer used didn't tear. You could burn a hole in them with a cigarette, but they didn't tear. Pantyhose is exhibit A in products that are manufactured to fail. Where obsolescence is intentionally built into the product so that you'll spend the rest of your life replacing the ones you have.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  70. #70

    Default

    I've got maybe 50% LED. Still got a box of incandescent for rough duty, and still have a few spare CFLs yet. I've replaced all my halogens with LED, it actually makes a big difference in the summer keeping the room cool. For the ones in the bathroom I change them back for the winter; when a little extra heat doesn't hurt.

    I also replaced the rec room florescent tubes with LED tubes. they may not last the advertised lifespan but tubes weren't lasting long at all.
    There can only be one.

  71. #71

    Default

    Another good way to keep a room cool is to turn off all the lights. This also saves on power.

    Heh, I like everything darker than almost anybody else does. Wife is completely different. Left on her own she would turn every light in the house on. I was well trained to shut them all off...

    We get along well.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  72. #72

    Default

    LEDs aren't exactly a new tech anymore. Been available to regular consumers around a decade now.

    I've had a few LED recessed bulbs from 3 or 4 years back. Use them everyday for about 3-5 hours. Don't notice a high pitched squeal like I do from the CFLs and it's instant on as opposed to the CFLs which take about a minute to get fully lit up.

    Anyhow, Lowes and HD had some sales on bulbs, which in conjunction with the gov'ts instant rebate, which came out to $0.99 a bulb. I think the limit was 6 or something.

    I've actually adopted some of the Philips Hue LED bulbs which let you control the brightness and the temperature of the bulbs and I have it programmed to change during certain hours...helps on the winter nights when i rather not have a bright harsh white blasting the room. Sales on those seem more frequent now, I might pick up a Philips coloured LED strip for bias lighting behind my TV.

  73. #73

    Default

    I do reluctantly have a bunch of CFL's, I eventually caved on that. I find they don't last as long either as advertised which seems par for the course.

    For the hard to reach fittings that require a ladder to replace I would pay the difference. But for bulbs that are easily located and replaced I just don't care.

    The energy savings for me would be less because I just use lights a lot less than most people. I like daylight, I'm outside a lot (I have a head cold now so thus I'm indoors typing..)

    Finally, incandescents, afaik, are not too toxic, don't some CFLS and other bulbs contain mercury and other such contaminants. Whats the breakdown and enviro cost of that? Whats the cost of how those should properly be discarded.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  74. #74

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Still not one LED installed. As a rule I don't go chasing after new tech, I NEVER believe the promises of longevity, and try to stay with the knowns. I'm a born skeptic so this comes easily to me. heh

    Skimmed through the thread and the economics of saving money by buying all LEDS is inferred on the manufacturers stated length of a product, on a new product.


    This reminds me of some companies in Edmonton selling "lifetime (standard tar based) shingles". They swear up and down they will last the rest of your life, you will never have to replace them. The company was in business for less than 10yrs. So I asked who's going to honor the warranty? Absolute silence. People are paying 1000's extra for these lifetime shingles that are still tar impregnated shingles. I don't get how they will last a lifetime.

    Oh wait, its lies.

    This one will drive the ladies nuts. But in Germany they used to make lifetime pantyhose, stockings and such. They actually did last a long time. They didn't tear, at all, the polymer used didn't tear. You could burn a hole in them with a cigarette, but they didn't tear. Pantyhose is exhibit A in products that are manufactured to fail. Where obsolescence is intentionally built into the product so that you'll spend the rest of your life replacing the ones you have.
    My oldest LED bulbs are over 5 years old and still work fine. They were actually from the last house I lived in, and we brought them when we moved to a bigger house. Haven't replaced one yet. And my outside lights are on whenever it's dark out, which is quite long in the winter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    I've got maybe 50% LED. Still got a box of incandescent for rough duty, and still have a few spare CFLs yet. I've replaced all my halogens with LED, it actually makes a big difference in the summer keeping the room cool. For the ones in the bathroom I change them back for the winter; when a little extra heat doesn't hurt.

    I also replaced the rec room florescent tubes with LED tubes. they may not last the advertised lifespan but tubes weren't lasting long at all.
    Yeah, makes a difference in heat for sure. Especially on hot evenings/nights when you gotta have lights on.

  75. #75

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by alkeli View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Still not one LED installed. As a rule I don't go chasing after new tech, I NEVER believe the promises of longevity, and try to stay with the knowns. I'm a born skeptic so this comes easily to me. heh

    Skimmed through the thread and the economics of saving money by buying all LEDS is inferred on the manufacturers stated length of a product, on a new product.


    This reminds me of some companies in Edmonton selling "lifetime (standard tar based) shingles". They swear up and down they will last the rest of your life, you will never have to replace them. The company was in business for less than 10yrs. So I asked who's going to honor the warranty? Absolute silence. People are paying 1000's extra for these lifetime shingles that are still tar impregnated shingles. I don't get how they will last a lifetime.

    Oh wait, its lies.

    This one will drive the ladies nuts. But in Germany they used to make lifetime pantyhose, stockings and such. They actually did last a long time. They didn't tear, at all, the polymer used didn't tear. You could burn a hole in them with a cigarette, but they didn't tear. Pantyhose is exhibit A in products that are manufactured to fail. Where obsolescence is intentionally built into the product so that you'll spend the rest of your life replacing the ones you have.
    My oldest LED bulbs are over 5 years old and still work fine. They were actually from the last house I lived in, and we brought them when we moved to a bigger house. Haven't replaced one yet. And my outside lights are on whenever it's dark out, which is quite long in the winter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    I've got maybe 50% LED. Still got a box of incandescent for rough duty, and still have a few spare CFLs yet. I've replaced all my halogens with LED, it actually makes a big difference in the summer keeping the room cool. For the ones in the bathroom I change them back for the winter; when a little extra heat doesn't hurt.

    I also replaced the rec room florescent tubes with LED tubes. they may not last the advertised lifespan but tubes weren't lasting long at all.
    Yeah, makes a difference in heat for sure. Especially on hot evenings/nights when you gotta have lights on.
    However, in the winter and a good portion of summer evenings, incandescent lighting would be heating occupied rooms, lessening the need to set the thermostat higher to heat the other 90% of the house.

    In the future I predict the rise of radiant room heaters to reduce the waste of heating an entire house for the sake of a couple rooms.
    Last edited by KC; 08-08-2017 at 07:31 AM.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •