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Thread: Russian interference in US politics - starts with James Comey Firing

  1. #3301

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    Just because Trump and Faux "News" say it isn't a crime doesn't make it so.

    Trump is latching on to a popular right-wing talking point about Michael Cohen that experts say is 'nonsense'

    "In cutting a deal with federal prosecutors, Cohen pleaded guilty on Tuesday to five counts of tax evasion, one count of making a false statement to a financial institution, and two counts related to campaign-finance violations. Cohen said under oath that Trump directed him to violate campaign-finance laws just before the 2016 presidential election to boost his candidacy.


    The latter two charges were in connection to payments to the former Playboy model Karen McDougal and the porn actress Stormy Daniels to silence their allegations of affairs with Trump. Cohen said that at Trump's direction, he moved to keep both former Playboy model Karen McDougal and porn star Stormy Daniels from publicly disclosing damaging information that would hurt Trump's campaign. He said under oath that the payments were for the purpose of benefiting Trump's candidacy.


    "Directing" Cohen to commit such a crime would make Trump a co-conspirator, legal experts say.


    Prosecutors wrote that they could back up Cohen's admissions through evidence obtained from the FBI's April raids on Cohen's home, office, and hotel room. The evidence, they wrote, included documents, electronic devices, audio recordings made by Cohen, text messages, messages sent on encrypted apps, phone records, and emails."

    https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...g-point-2018-8

  2. #3302

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    Round two coming up next month.

    Mueller team shortens estimate for length of 2nd Manafort trial

    Special counsel Robert Mueller's team is shaving its estimate for the length of former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort's upcoming trial, projecting that the prosecution case could be completed in as little as two weeks.


    "The government anticipates that its case-in-chief will last approximately ten to twelve trial days," prosecutors wrote in a filing Friday evening in U.S. District Court in Washington.


    Manafort is set to go on trial there beginning September 17 on charges of failing to register as a foreign agent, money laundering and obstruction of justice.

    https://www.politico.com/blogs/under...-second-796141

  3. #3303

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    It looks like Michael Cohen's attorney lied when he said that Choen had knowledge that Trump knew of Russian meeting. Almost every news outlet that is talking about it it reporting it now. No surprise to me.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.3963940564be


    All the misleading headlines, misleading stories with hidden retractions later on, and backpedaling days after reporting earth-shattering news is what Trump is pointing to when he says the press are the "enemy of the people".

  4. #3304

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    Trump is the enemy. My god the fabrications you have and believe in

  5. #3305

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    Did the press get the story wrong or did Cohen's lawyer get it wrong.

    Rather than MrAltReich attacking the media, why does he not attack Trump's lawyer's lawyer?

    The only of "enemy of the people" is Trump himself
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  6. #3306
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Reminder: every single one of the charges against Paul Manafort - every single one - are for crimes he committed 6-12 years ago.

    Not a single one of them to do with Russia. Nothing to do with Trump.
    This is false. Totally and utterly false. Why do you continually make claims that are factually incorrect, and easily proven to be so? It's especially hypocritical coming from you, given your crusade against supposed "fake news" when CNN has a comma out of place.

    A number of the charges in his upcoming second trial are specifically about his dealings in Ukraine working for Russian oligarchs, which was as recently as 2015 or you know, immediately before he joined the Trump campaign pro bono. Not to mention he had charges added for obstruction of justice from his attempts to tamper with witnesses in the last year. Some of the charges he was just found guilty on are related to banking transactions he was directing in 2016 while Trump's campaign Chairman. And even after he left the campaign, he was still whispering in the ear of Gates (who remained on the transition) to get a bank executive a plumb appointment in the Trump administration, in return for a massive loan that they should have turned down: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.1d34a38b34ce

    So to claim that "every single one" of the charges against Paul Manafort are for things 6+ years ago and have nothing to do with Trump or Russia is an outright lie. I mean, your reputation is pretty well established around these parts, but in case anyone had any doubts, here's yet another example of you lying through your teeth for seemingly little reason about something that is demonstrably false. Why do you persist in such behavior?
    Last edited by Marcel Petrin; 27-08-2018 at 03:41 PM.

  7. #3307

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    [QUOTE=Marcel Petrin;900360][QUOTE=MrOilers;899472]Reminder: every single one of the charges against Paul Manafort - every single one - are for crimes he committed 6-12 years ago.

    So are you saying that after 2012 he reported his secret foreign bank accounts to the IRS as required?

    Are you saying he didn't try to fraudulently get bank loans after 2012?

    I don't think so.

    Some of his crimes might have started 6 -12 years ago, but he didn't end them in 2012.

  8. #3308

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    Marcel asked a question about motives.

    ANSWER: Because MrAltReich is a lying, flamebaiting Russian backed troll.
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  9. #3309

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    A number of the charges in his upcoming second trial are specifically about his dealings in Ukraine working for Russian oligarchs, which was as recently as 2015 or you know, immediately before he joined the Trump campaign pro bono. Not to mention he had charges added for obstruction of justice from his attempts to tamper with witnesses in the last year. Some of the charges he was just found guilty on are related to banking transactions he was directing in 2016 while Trump's campaign Chairman. And even after he left the campaign, he was still whispering in the ear of Gates (who remained on the transition) to get a bank executive a plumb appointment in the Trump administration, in return for a massive loan that they should have turned down: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.1d34a38b34ce
    You are correct.


    So to claim that "every single one" of the charges against Paul Manafort are for things 6+ years ago and have nothing to do with Trump or Russia is an outright lie. I mean, your reputation is pretty well established around these parts, but in case anyone had any doubts, here's yet another example of you lying through your teeth for seemingly little reason about something that is demonstrably false. Why do you persist in such behavior?
    None of these charges - not one - are for anything to do with Trump and Russia. Not a single one (unless you use your imagination and make lots of additional unproven assumptions, like you have). So please spare your personal attacks.

    If I am wrong about something, then show me.
    Last edited by MrOilers; 27-08-2018 at 05:09 PM.

  10. #3310

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    Keep denying that Robert Mueller is using tried and true investigative techniques to work up the food chain of his staff, his associates, his friends, his lawyer, his partners and is following the money to get to his family members in the business and ultimately to; the Kingpin, Mr. Big, the top dog, the Head Honcho, the Big Kahuna, the Big Wheel, the Big Cheeze, the Big Orange, the Donald.

    That way, Mueller will have indisputable evidence of any crime committed.
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  11. #3311

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    Once again, you are assuming that everybody knows Trump is guilty of a crime and they need to do all sorts of work to figure out what it is. Well, that is not the way the justice system works.

  12. #3312

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    Never said there was a crime. If there was, Robert Mueller will find it and have sufficient evidence to convict.

    I ask you, if Trump is so innocent, why does he refuse to sit down with Robert Mueller. Trump is a very stable genius you know...


    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 27-08-2018 at 06:06 PM.
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  13. #3313

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    Looks like Mueller hunted down another witch.

    Lobbyist pleads guilty, says he helped steer foreign money to Trump inaugural and lied to Congress

    Washington lobbyist W. Samuel Patten pleaded guilty Friday to acting as an unregistered foreign lobbyist, and admitted to lying to the Senate Intelligence Committee and funneling a Ukrainian oligarch's money to Donald Trump's Presidential Inaugural Committee.


    Patten's plea and cooperation agreement is connected to special counsel Robert Mueller's ongoing investigation into Russian interference in the election and coordination with the Trump campaign -- even apparently reaching into former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort's inner circle in Ukraine.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/31/polit...ine/index.html

  14. #3314

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Looks like Mueller hunted down another witch.

    Lobbyist pleads guilty, says he helped steer foreign money to Trump inaugural and lied to Congress

    Washington lobbyist W. Samuel Patten pleaded guilty Friday to acting as an unregistered foreign lobbyist, and admitted to lying to the Senate Intelligence Committee and funneling a Ukrainian oligarch's money to Donald Trump's Presidential Inaugural Committee.


    Patten's plea and cooperation agreement is connected to special counsel Robert Mueller's ongoing investigation into Russian interference in the election and coordination with the Trump campaign -- even apparently reaching into former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort's inner circle in Ukraine.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/31/polit...ine/index.html
    It would only be a witch hunt, if Mueller was looking for witches - he is looking for and seems to keep on finding criminals and crimes.

    However, I suppose if Trump called it a criminal hunt it wouldn't sound as good for him politically. It would be more truthful and accurate though.

  15. #3315

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    What is supposed to happen is a crime takes place, then investigators look for suspects.

    What is happening here is that investigators are looking for people, THEN trying to find crimes. I am sure that every single person in Washington DC could be shook down for *something* if you dig deep enough and far enough back in time.

  16. #3316

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What is supposed to happen is a crime takes place, then investigators look for suspects.

    What is happening here is that investigators are looking for people, THEN trying to find crimes. I am sure that every single person in Washington DC could be shook down for *something* if you dig deep enough and far enough back in time.
    That’s not “what’s supposed to happen”. Where did you get such a limited view of law, security and defence?

    All over society, in every society, there are provisions to prevent and mitigate threats. Whenever there is a suspected threat to a society (including the USA) there are laws and legislation that investigate and inspect products, animals and people.

    A disease, a potentially invading virus or bacteria or something becomes a suspected threat and we don’t have to wait until people die before vaccinations start or food or animals are prevented from entering the country or are investigated when in the country.

    Tourists or immigrants or refugees show indications of potentially committing a crime (maybe just an anonymous phone call) and there are laws to permit monitoring and tracking them.

    Every country’s intelligence service is involved in monitoring foreign activities and their connections with domestic citizens. Out of that intelligence collection process they can and should investigate citizens and determine what other citizens may also be conspiring to act in unapproved ways.

    Plus investigations of any kind can turn up evidence of other suspected crimes having been committed. Those suspected crimes may not have been known to or reported by anyone beforehand. Nonetheless, if another crime is then suspected that too should be investigated.


    So in this case, they may have followed the money. Found a foreign transaction that led through a money launderer to a campaign - Trump’s campaign.

    Wouldn’t it be great if they could find cause to investigate every campaign like they have with Trump’s campaign. (Or just better audits.) It would sure clean up the democratic process.
    Last edited by KC; 04-09-2018 at 11:18 AM.

  17. #3317

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Wouldn’t it be great if they could find cause to investigate every campaign like they have with Trump’s campaign. (Or just better audits.) It would sure clean up the democratic process.
    This I completely agree with.

    The rest of this investigation is all just Washington being Washington. A lot of political theater. If Trump colluded with Russia to steal a whole Presidential election, it would be proven by now.

  18. #3318

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    It took years to investigate Nixon and Clinton. Why are you so eager to close an investigation that is getting convictions at a rapid pace?

    If Trump has nothing to hide, why is he acting like he does? He should sit down with Mueller, better yet on TV with Mueller and show the world how innocent he is.


    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-growing-fast/
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  19. #3319

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What is supposed to happen is a crime takes place, then investigators look for suspects.

    What is happening here is that investigators are looking for people, THEN trying to find crimes. I am sure that every single person in Washington DC could be shook down for *something* if you dig deep enough and far enough back in time.
    Well the reason for the investigation was there was a suspicion crimes were committed and they sure weren't committed by potted plants or chihuahua's, so yes people would be investigated.

    Everyone else does things is not a legal defense, nor is it even necessarily true. I suppose using this argument would mean Trump has gone from saying drain the swamp to leave us alone we are just trying to fit in with the rest of the swamp creatures here. Sad.

  20. #3320

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Wouldn’t it be great if they could find cause to investigate every campaign like they have with Trump’s campaign. (Or just better audits.) It would sure clean up the democratic process.
    This I completely agree with.

    The rest of this investigation is all just Washington being Washington. A lot of political theater. If Trump colluded with Russia to steal a whole Presidential election, it would be proven by now.
    And it may have been proven by now. At least at the campaign staff level.

  21. #3321

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Wouldn’t it be great if they could find cause to investigate every campaign like they have with Trump’s campaign. (Or just better audits.) It would sure clean up the democratic process.
    This I completely agree with.

    The rest of this investigation is all just Washington being Washington. A lot of political theater. If Trump colluded with Russia to steal a whole Presidential election, it would be proven by now.
    And it may have been proven by now. Proven beyond a shadow of a doubt may be another matter.




    Iran-Contra May Be a Roadmap for How Trump Could Emerge Unscathed From the Russia Investigation - The Atlantic

    “But more was at work that explains the fizzle, all of which remain relevant today. The absence of a “smoking gun” was essential. Since there was no piece of evidence that directly implicated Reagan in the illegal assistance to the Contras, it was impossible to prove that the president knew what had happened. Throughout the proceedings, Reagan liked to remind reporters that “there ain’t no smoking gun” to keep the temperature dialed down. Rather, the story that most Americans heard revolved around unscrupulous advisors doing bad things without the president’s clear knowledge—not unlike what we know so far about the Russians and the 2016 election. The majority report of the congressional committee investigating the scandal, who said the Reagan’s policies revealed “pervasive dishonesty” as well as “deception and disdain for the law,” also admitted that “all of the facts may never be known” about the president’s direct involvement. The irony, as the sociologist Michael Schudson has argued, is that Watergate probably saved Reagan since the scandal raised the bar so high for what was needed to prove culpability in a presidential investigation.”

    https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ergate/554345/

  22. #3322

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    The only political theater is Trump's Snake Oil Show.

    The reality is that people who have done crimes ard admitting to them or being convicted and now provide even more evidence to the FBI and Mueller.

    It is true that Mueller has not caught a single witch. He has caught a lot of criminals that had access to Trump or were doing his bidding. Many are foreigners or being paid by others.

    Colusion is not a crime but being a traitor is.
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  23. #3323

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    It appears that the Republicans secrecy and obstruction is coming back to bite them.

    Conservative columnist hints Kamala Harris may be sitting on bombshell linking Kavanaugh to Russia investigation

    "In a column for the Washington Post, a conservative commentator highlighted a little-noticed exchange between Sen. Kamala Harris (D-CA) and Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh that indicated that she is holding back a bombshell that would link President Donald Trump’s appointee to the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation.


    According to Jennifer Rubin, late Wednesday night Harris asked Kavanaugh about any communications he may have had about the Russia investigation with anyone at Kasowitz Benson Torres, the law firm founded by President Trump’s lawyer Marc Kasowitz.


    Kavanaugh replied, “I would like to know the person you’re thinking of,” to which Harris cryptically shot back, “I think you’re thinking of someone and you don’t want to tell us,” which appeared to baffle the judge.


    According to Rubin, Harris’ line of inquiry has observers and White House aides scrambling to see what she might have been leading up to.


    “If Harris has evidence he had an inappropriate or conflict-creating interchange with the president’s lawyer, it is critical we hear about it. If not, it is unfair to leave the inference hanging out there,” Rubin wrote before adding that Harris may be restrained “because of the cockamamie restrictions on documents that Republicans have erected.”"

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/09/con...investigation/

  24. #3324

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    Mueller - "We'd like to interview you in regards to our investigation."

    Trump - ""I am looking forward to it, actually, Here is the story: There has been no collusion whatsoever. There is no obstruction whatsoever. And I am looking forward to it." - January 25, 2018

    Mueller "We're still waiting."

    Trump "I'll only answer questions in writing"

    Mueller - "OK, we'll accept that if that's the only way to get you to answer the questions.

    Trump - "I won't answer questions in writing" - Today

  25. #3325

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    George Papadopoulos, the guy who's conversation started this whole Russia investigation, jailed for a whole 14 days - not for colluding with Russia - but for his part in lying to the FBI during the investigation (Mueller wanted 6 months).

    https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/wor...08-p502j4.html


    Here's a video of him saying he plead guilty for lying (not for collusion): https://twitter.com/FoxNews/status/1039702311101231104


    This is the same thing that happened to Flynn. The lesson here is to only speak to the FBI with your lawyer present. If he had done that, he wouldn't have been sentenced to anything.

    They got some career criminals (Manafort) on things like taxes and other procedural crimes having to do with the investigation itself, but there is still zero evidence that the Trump campaign worked with Russia to win the election.

    This investigation was started under spurious accusations, and is being run by a bunch of dirty cops. Trump's right to tell them to get lost.

  26. #3326
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    ^ You mean Trumps former Campaign Advisor? That's quite the spin.

    Edit: Actually completely incorrect.

    He was jailed for lying about his Russian contacts during the 2016 Presidential Campaign. You know, when he still worked for Trump?

    George Papadopoulos, a former Trump campaign adviser, was sentenced on Friday to 14 days in prison for lying to the F.B.I. about his contacts with Russian intermediaries during the 2016 presidential race, becoming the first Trump adviser to be sentenced in the special counsel investigation.
    Prosecutors argued that Mr. Papadopoulos’s repeated lies during a January 2017 interview with investigators hampered the Russia investigation at a critical moment. In part because Mr. Papadopoulos misled the authorities, prosecutors
    said in court papers
    , they failed to arrest a London-based professor — suspected of being a Russian operative — before he left the United States in February 2017, never to return.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/07/u...stigation.html


    Try harder.
    Last edited by seamusmcduffs; 12-09-2018 at 02:39 PM.

  27. #3327
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    George Papadopoulos, the guy who's conversation started this whole Russia investigation, jailed for a whole 14 days - not for colluding with Russia - but for his part in lying to the FBI during the investigation (Mueller wanted 6 months).

    https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/wor...08-p502j4.html


    Here's a video of him saying he plead guilty for lying (not for collusion): https://twitter.com/FoxNews/status/1039702311101231104


    This is the same thing that happened to Flynn. The lesson here is to only speak to the FBI with your lawyer present. If he had done that, he wouldn't have been sentenced to anything.

    They got some career criminals (Manafort) on things like taxes and other procedural crimes having to do with the investigation itself, but there is still zero evidence that the Trump campaign worked with Russia to win the election.

    This investigation was started under spurious accusations, and is being run by a bunch of dirty cops. Trump's right to tell them to get lost.
    Ahahahahahahahahaha

    I find it hilarious that you fail to mention Papadopoulos has said that the campaign was fully aware of his efforts to talk to the Russians. Papadopoulos did stuff wrong, he's only being charged with lying to the FBI. Also, dirty cops? Seriously?
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  28. #3328

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    George Papadopoulos, the guy who's conversation started this whole Russia investigation, jailed for a whole 14 days - not for colluding with Russia - but for his part in lying to the FBI during the investigation (Mueller wanted 6 months).

    https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/wor...08-p502j4.html


    Here's a video of him saying he plead guilty for lying (not for collusion): https://twitter.com/FoxNews/status/1039702311101231104


    This is the same thing that happened to Flynn. The lesson here is to only speak to the FBI with your lawyer present. If he had done that, he wouldn't have been sentenced to anything.

    They got some career criminals (Manafort) on things like taxes and other procedural crimes having to do with the investigation itself, but there is still zero evidence that the Trump campaign worked with Russia to win the election.

    This investigation was started under spurious accusations, and is being run by a bunch of dirty cops. Trump's right to tell them to get lost.
    Ahahahahahahahahaha

    I find it hilarious that you fail to mention Papadopoulos has said that the campaign was fully aware of his efforts to talk to the Russians. Papadopoulos did stuff wrong, he's only being charged with lying to the FBI. Also, dirty cops? Seriously?
    “but there is still zero evidence that the Trump campaign worked with Russia to win the election. ”

    This statement is also most certainly wrong. The public isn’t aware of all the evidence, is it?

  29. #3329

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    "Paul Manafort's cooperation agreement with the special counsel does not include matters involving the Trump campaign, according to a person familiar with the case, @johnson_carrie reports."

    https://twitter.com/NPR/status/1040641168378347520

  30. #3330
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    So, is that information correct, or not correct? I mean... that's an unnamed source that you're posting information from, right?
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  31. #3331

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    "Paul Manafort's cooperation agreement with the special counsel does not include matters involving the Trump campaign, according to a person familiar with the case, @johnson_carrie reports."

    https://twitter.com/NPR/status/1040641168378347520
    more fake news from the biggest fake news generator, the white house under TRUMP the liar.

    Here's the TRUTH:

    Manafort's plea agreement: He "shall cooperate fully, truthfully, completely, and forthrightly with the Government...in any and all matters as to which the Government deems the cooperation relevant."

  32. #3332

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    "Paul Manafort's cooperation agreement with the special counsel does not include matters involving the Trump campaign, according to a person familiar with the case, @johnson_carrie reports."

    https://twitter.com/NPR/status/1040641168378347520
    Can you get a real source on that? You are repeating what Rudy has said, and quoted by NPR.... Like fact check much? I know you fail at that... but come on man. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...iani-statement


    Rudy Giuliani, Trump’s lawyer, issued a statement saying, “Once again an investigation has concluded with a plea having nothing to do with President Trump or the Trump campaign. The reason: the President did nothing wrong and Paul Manafort will tell the truth.”
    But just minutes later, Giuliani issued a revised statement that conspicuously omitted the “and Paul Manafort will tell the truth” part and merely said “The President did nothing wrong.”
    of course TRUMPS defense is not going to admit to wrong-doing by Trump and try to deflect, deny, discount anything against Trump. You've got to be the biggest gulliable ignorant, naive closet racist on C2E ever.,

  33. #3333

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    So, is that information correct, or not correct? I mean... that's an unnamed source that you're posting information from, right?
    You decide.

  34. #3334

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    Anything MrOilers posts should be taken with a large grain of salt, and fact checked. 99.999999% of his posts are straight from the Trump's whitehouse propaganda machine, which has never been known to provide factual or correct information. MrOilers, of course, soaks it all up and regurgitates it here. He will attempt to make it look like it comes from a different source, but that source always ends up just regurgitating Trumps machine.

    Trump KNOWS fake news, because he is the biggest purveyor in fake news generation.

  35. #3335

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    So, is that information correct, or not correct? I mean... that's an unnamed source that you're posting information from, right?
    You decide.
    Why? Why would anyone “decide” whether it’s correct or not?

    If it can’t be substantiated then it’s just like much of the other Trump related commentary found in books, etc. Just what it is. It might be correct or it might not be correct. Or it might be something in between.

  36. #3336

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    THE RUSSIA CONNECTION
    Document: Superseding Criminal Information Against Paul Manafort
    By Quinta Jurecic Friday, September 14, 2018, 9:32 AM

    “The special counsel's office has filed a superseding criminal information in the case against Paul Manafort. The document is available here and below. The plea agreement and statement of offense are also available below.

    Our prior coverage of the Manafort case is available here. ...”
    https://www.lawfareblog.com/document...-paul-manafort

  37. #3337
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    So, is that information correct, or not correct? I mean... that's an unnamed source that you're posting information from, right?
    You decide.
    Well, I'm asking because you've previously posted that unnamed sources can't be trusted, yet here you are referencing one. It almost appears as if you're a hypocrite, having no problem posting stuff that backs up your opinion, yet writing it off it it goes against your opinion.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  38. #3338

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    Interesting perspective on history:


    “...a release from the frustrations, complexity, and compromises of representative government. A large part of society clasped with joy the extended hand of totalitarian certainty. Life was suddenly simplified by conformity to a single, uncontested power. “



    ‘Silence Is Health’: How Totalitarianism Arrives | by Uki Gońi | NYR Daily | The New York Review of Books

    “Those who have lived their entire lives in functioning democracies may find it hard to grasp how easily minds can be won over to the totalitarian dark side. We assume such a passage would require slow, laborious persuasion. It does not. The transition from day to night is bewilderingly swift. Despite what many assume, civilized coexistence in a culture of tolerance is not always the norm, or even universally desired. Democracy is a hard-won, easily rolled back state of affairs from which many secretly yearn to be released.

    Lest there be any doubt of its intention, the dictatorship titled itself the “Process of National Reorganization.” Books were burned. Intellectuals went into exile. Like medieval Inquisitors, the dictatorship proclaimed itself—in fiery speeches that I hear echoed in the conspiracist rants of American populists and nationalists today—to be waging a war to save “Western and Christian civilization” from oblivion. Such a war by definition included
    the physical annihilation of infected minds, even if they had committed no crime.

    Another horrifying characteristic of totalitarianism is how it picks on the weakest ...”


    “For many Argentines, then, the military represented not a subjugation to arbitrary rule, but a release from the frustrations, complexity, and compromises of representative government. A large part of society clasped with joy the extended hand of totalitarian certainty. Life was suddenly simplified by conformity to a single, uncontested power. For those who cherish democracy, it is necessary to comprehend the secret delight with which many greeted its passing. A quick...”

    https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/0...anism-arrives/
    Last edited by KC; 14-09-2018 at 06:20 PM.

  39. #3339
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    Here's what Seth Abramson had to say about the news today:

    There are four types of cooperation deals that Paul Manafort could have entered into with Special Counsel Mueller—we don't know which one he has yet, but we can discuss each of them in turn and that's what I do in this thread. I hope you'll read on and share with others.

    The biggest bombshell would be if Manafort decided to give Mueller the goods on Trump—it'd be a bombshell because it'd break Manafort's Joint Defense Agreement (JDA) with Trump, end Manafort's chance at a pardon from Trump, and run a very high chance of ending this presidency.

    As authority for the claim Manafort flipping on Trump would endanger Trump's presidency I cite... Trump. NBC reported months ago that Trump was telling friends on the phone that he could "crush" Mueller and wasn't afraid of his probe *because* Manafort wasn't going to "flip."

    Indeed, Manafort is the only witness in the Trump-Russia probe who Trump has ever spoken of in this way—as someone who could legitimately endanger him. In addition to implicitly confirming Trump thinks he committed a crime, the NBC report made Manafort Mueller's biggest "get."

    Manafort informing on Trump has led many—not so much me, but many out there—to talk quite a bit about Manafort's safety. His plea deal in DC resolves all DC charges and his remaining 10 Virginia charges with a maximum of 10 years in a federal prison. Here's why that matters.

    Manafort is already facing sentencing on 8 charges in Virginia. If these two counts he's now pleading to in DC lead to sentences—whether 10 years or less than that—running *consecutive* (rather than concurrent) to his other sentences, he'll still be in prison for a long time.

    When I say a "long time," I mean Manafort is likely to be in prison through the end of Trump's natural life, through the end of this scandal, through Putin's final term as Russian president, through (possibly) any of his anger at any aspect of his plot being publicly revealed.

    Many defendants—I say this from my experience defending accused criminals—look at prison as an "I will do anything not to go for even a single day" proposition. Manafort *doesn't have that luxury*. He's at the "could I have 10 years at the end of my life outside prison" phase.

    A second possibility is Manafort is offering up a *lateral* target for Mueller, of which there are *many* who were involved in different (and to be frank, more serious) elements of the Trump-Russia conspiracy: Kushner, Bannon, Prince, and Trump Jr. are four *major* candidates.

    A "lateral" target would be someone who is at roughly the same level of *both* authority and culpability as Manafort. Manafort's venality involved Russia—as did Gates'; but Kushner, Bannon, Prince, and Trump Jr. were, I can report, colluding with more nations than just Russia.

    It is revealed in PROOF OF COLLUSION—and will be revealed to the public in due time—that the Trump-Russia conspiracy was in fact a *five-nation grand bargain* involving the United States, Russia, Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and Israel. Manafort's lateral co-conspirators know this.

    So the reason for Mueller to want a lateral target is that those other 4 targets I mentioned (and Flynn would be in the group too, but Mueller already has him) were in *many* meetings and calls with Saudis and Emiratis discussing Syria, Iran, and Qatar that Manafort *wasn't*.

    Manafort had a simple goal—help Russia/make money. Trump Sr., Kushner, Bannon, Prince, Don Jr., Flynn and a few lesser targets were focused on something far bigger. And that's what a lot of my research for PROOF OF COLLUSION was about—i.e. there's still *much* to be revealed.

    Manafort giving Mueller a lateral target or two also gives Mueller a chance of coming at Trump from another angle (remember, in *this* theory of Manafort's cooperation deal, unlike the first possibility, we're assuming that Manafort is *not* directly giving up Trump himself).

    So Manafort "giving up" Bannon, say, could not only help Mueller get Bannon on various charges but also, if Mueller can get Bannon now, open up an entirely new window on Trump's activities during (say) the presidential transition—a real "win-win" for the special counsel.

    A third possibility for the cooperation deal between Manafort and the feds is that Manafort is feeding information on *one* lesser target *but*—and this is *key*—it's a lesser target who, because of the narrow information the lesser target has, can help Mueller to nail Trump.

    The Trump-Russia probe is replete with such *potential* targets (I say "potential" because we can't know for *sure* exactly how much legal liability they have right now, or if they can help Mueller nab Trump). Examples might be J.D. Gordon or Thomas Barrack or K.T. McFarland.

    Needless to say, there are also many Russian (and some Ukrainian or Russian-Ukrainian) targets that might fit this definition, but Mueller wouldn't take info on them from Manafort as valuable unless he believed that he could get those people extradited from Russia (unlikely).

    An adjunct to this third possibility is Manafort is able to offer up a large number of lesser targets—say, targets just one level below Manafort—who *don't* directly have the goods on Trump but are still worth getting for Mueller if he knows Manafort is still going to prison.

    The fourth possibility is more abstract but still possible—that Manafort in some way has information on an entire "scheme" underlying the Trump campaign that may or may not *directly* implicate anyone *by name* but which Mueller can follow up on to great investigative profit.

    Because the Trump-Russia investigation is headed in a money laundering-, RICO-, bribery-type direction—remember, allegations of collusion *never* had to do with Trump or his aides *literally hacking* anyone—information on a common scheme or plan would be valuable to Mueller.

    For instance, if Manafort knows something about how money was being moved around—or can peg Russian/Ukrainian actors involved in such a scheme even if they can't be extradited and tried—it could lead Mueller down a whole *new* path with a mountain of hard evidence at the end.

    Given that Manafort is still getting a lot of prison time here, there is an unlikely but still not impossible fifth possibility: that Manafort is *merely* telling Mueller *everything* that *he* did in great detail, which could nevertheless give investigative leads to Mueller.

    In that scenario, Manafort wouldn't be giving up Trump—technically, but only *really* questionably, preserving his shot at a pardon, as Trump wouldn't know for *certain* what Manafort gave the feds—and indeed might not *technically* be giving up any other Americans/Russians.

    The upshot is this: Mueller gave Manafort a *chance* at *maybe* not dying in prison—and to many defendants that is worth *everything*—so we should assume that whatever Mueller got in this deal, he has adjudicated it as being of significant value. We don't know that value yet.

    That last point is key—and the reason I wrote this thread. There are 4 (maybe 5) types of deal that could've happened here—and we don't want to be those people assuming Manafort gave up Trump when there *are* other possibilities. But *Trump* may well think he's been given up.

    Right now, Trump's lawyers are trying to get as many leaks as they can on what type of deal Manafort was given (i.e., what Manafort offered). Trump and his legal team's reaction today and tomorrow may be our *best shot* at learning—in the near-term—what really happened here.

    Some are wondering how a cooperation deal can be divided up by target, and I should've been clearer—it can't *formally* be broken up this way. In criminal cases, one either cooperates and spills all the beans or one doesn't. *Officially*. That's not how it works in practice.

    In practice, the defendant makes a "proffer"—a statement of some kind, usually in person, but in theory not always—of what information he will offer the government. In some cases, the defendant may sit down with prosecutors and be questioned for a whole day on what he knows.

    The prosecutor then decides if the "proffer" is sufficient. The problem: defendants hold back. So when I said "Mueller may have accepted this deal in exchange for information on _________," what I am saying is that he may have accepted a proffer that only gave him _________.

    Anyone who tells you a prosecutor can know in advance if they're getting the whole story—or that a defendant always tells the whole truth in a proffer—has never practiced law in any jurisdiction in the U.S. (or anywhere else, for that matter).

    It just doesn't work that way.

    The whole reason prosecutors have to cut deals is that *they don't know things* and often *don't know what they don't know*. While they usually *are* able to tell if a defendant is lying as to *some* aspects of a proffer, there will be many others for which they can't tell.

    For instance, any one-on-one in-person conversation Manafort had with a Russian he can lie about. Any two-party telephonic communication he had with a Russian or American on a line he was certain was secure he can lie about (assuming the other party hasn't yet been charged).

    In each case, Mueller and his team are charged with hearing what Manafort has to say—who he's willing to *be honest about* and sell out—and then decide if they're willing to cut a deal. I am *not* saying (and would never say) the prosecutor dictates beforehand who they want.

    Granted, in situations in which a proffer is subject to live interrogation, the prosecutor will grill the defendant on *all* those who they want information on. But—and prosecutors never seem to get this—it is, sadly, finally the *defendant* who chooses what info comes out.

    So I beg you all not to confuse legal analysts who talk about theory with those who talk about practice: yes, *in theory*, a defendant "gives up everything they have." As a defense attorney who worked directly with criminals, I'll tell you it doesn't actually work that way.

    UPDATE/ Based on the info coming out this morning, this is sounding more and more like Scenario #1: Manafort plans on giving Mueller everything and not trying to hold anything back. But we'll see. I do wish more folks had written on that NBC report about Trump's fear of Manafort.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  40. #3340
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    "Paul Manafort's cooperation agreement with the special counsel does not include matters involving the Trump campaign, according to a person familiar with the case, @johnson_carrie reports."

    https://twitter.com/NPR/status/1040641168378347520
    So, this information was clearly incorrect.

    [b]Manafort agreed to ‘full cooperation’[b]

    Manafort agreed to cooperate in Mueller’s investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election in full, a potentially important moment for the prosecutorial team.

    Manafort's plea agreement requires him to “fully, truthfully, completely, and forthrightly” cooperate with the special counsel’s investigation and any other matters in which the government deems his cooperation relevant.

    That includes submitting for interviews, handing over documents, and testifying before the grand jury and at any other forthcoming trials in Washington or elsewhere. Manafort also waived his right to have his lawyers present during interviews with government investigators and attorneys.

    Former prosecutors say that the cooperation agreement is standard, and will afford government prosecutors unfettered access to any details Manafort might have that inform the broader investigation.

    “That means the sky’s the limit with Manafort,” said Joyce Vance, a law professor at the University of Alabama and former U.S. attorney.
    http://thehill.com/homenews/administ...orts-plea-deal

    Also to note is that Manafort has forfeited $46 million in assets over his plea deal, which means Mueller's investigation is running in the black. Guess the Republicans can chill a bit now, as they won't have to worry about the investigation costing the taxpayers for at least another few years.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  41. #3341

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    This is an example that the Mueller Investigation is not a Trump witch hunt as they are now catching Democratic witches as well. The investigation has proven it is above political interference.

    Let's see if Trump now agrees with Mueller to investigate all crime activity. At least Mueller is drain the swamp.

    Federal prosecutors weigh charges against Democratic powerbroker in Manafort-linked probe

    CNN) Federal prosecutors in New York are weighing criminal charges against former Obama White House counsel Greg Craig as part of an investigation into whether he failed to register as a foreign agent in a probe that is linked to former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort, according to sources familiar with the matter.

    In addition, these sources said, prosecutors in the US Attorney's Office for the Southern District of New York are considering taking action against powerhouse law firm Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP, where Craig was a partner during the activity under examination. Prosecutors are considering a civil settlement with the firm or a deferred prosecution agreement with Skadden, these sources said.
    Funny that it is reported by CNN that some call fake news...
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  42. #3342

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    Mueller is playing 3-D chess and Trump is a pigeon strutting around on a checker board.



    Trump-proof aspects of Manafort deal rankle lawyers


    Special counsel Robert Mueller’s plea agreement with Paul Manafort on Friday took unusual and possibly unprecedented steps to undercut President Donald Trump’s ability to pardon his former campaign chairman.


    The plea deal Mueller struck with Manafort contains several provisions that appear intended to discourage the former Trump aide from seeking a pardon and to rein in the impact of any pardon Trump might grant.

    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...r-trump-827898

  43. #3343

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    What does that have to do with Russian interference in the 2016 election? Nothing, that's what.

    In fact, it's looking more and more like they are using this investigation to send a message to scare and discourage non-establishment people from running for office like Donald Trump did. All these shakedowns by these dirty cops is a deterrent from others away from supporting non-establishment candidates in future elections as well. This is what the D.C. swamp wants - to fill the office of the President with "groomed", pre-chosen candidates like Jeb Bush or Hillary Clinton instead of who the voters choose.

  44. #3344

    Default

    Because, Russian/Ukrainian connections are intertwined in the campaign.

    You know this as fact but you keep ignoring the truth because you can't handle the truth.

    2) Paul Manafort, Trump’s former campaign chair, was indicted on a total of 25 different counts by Mueller’s team, related mainly to his past work for Ukrainian politicians and his finances. He had two trials scheduled, and the first ended in a conviction on eight counts of financial crimes. To avert the second trial, Manafort struck a plea deal with Mueller in September 2018.
    5-20) 13 Russian nationals and three Russian companies were indicted on conspiracy charges, with some also being accused of identity theft. The charges related to a Russian propaganda effort designed to interfere with the 2016 campaign. The companies involved are the Internet Research Agency, often described as a “Russian troll farm,” and two other companies that helped finance it. The Russian nationals indicted include 12 of the agency’s employees and its alleged financier, Yevgeny Prigozhin.
    22) Alex van der Zwaan: This London lawyer pleaded guilty to making false statements to the FBI about his contacts with Rick Gates and another unnamed person based in Ukraine.
    23) Konstantin Kilimnik: This longtime business associate of Manafort and Gates, who’s currently based in Russia, was charged alongside Manafort with attempting to obstruct justice by tampering with witnesses in Manafort’s pending case this year.
    24-35) 12 Russian GRU officers: These officers of Russia’s military intelligence service were charged with crimes related to the hacking and leaking of leading Democrats’ emails in 2016.
    Sam Patten: This Republican operative and lobbyist pleaded guilty to not registering as a foreign agent with his work for Ukrainian political bigwigs, and agreed to cooperate with the government.
    About two dozen overseas Russians have been charged with election interference. Mueller has also filed two major indictments of Russian nationals and a few Russian companies for crimes related to alleged interference with the 2016 election: the troll farm indictment, and the email hacking indictment.

    The troll farm indictment: In February, Mueller brought charges related to the propaganda efforts of one Russian group in particular: the Internet Research Agency. That group’s operations — which included social media posts, online ads, and organization of rallies in the US — were, the indictment alleges, often (but not exclusively) aimed at denigrating Hillary Clinton’s presidential candidacy and supporting Donald Trump’s.

    Mueller indicted the Internet Research Agency, two other shell companies involved in financing the agency, its alleged financier (Yevgeny Prigozhin), and 12 other Russian nationals who allegedly worked for it.
    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...nts-grand-jury
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  45. #3345

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    Sure are catching a lot of witches.


  46. #3346

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    swamp starting to drain

  47. #3347
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    David Petraeus, Obama's CIA Director was guilty of mishandling classified information and sentenced to two years probation so your chart above is wrong./\/\

  48. #3348

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    Quote Originally Posted by ralph60 View Post
    David Petraeus, Obama's CIA Director was guilty of mishandling classified information and sentenced to two years probation so your chart above is wrong./\/\
    No source link, so consider it fake news.

  49. #3349

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    What does that have to do with Russian interference in the 2016 election? Nothing, that's what.

    In fact, it's looking more and more like they are using this investigation to send a message to scare and discourage non-establishment people from running for office like Donald Trump did. All these shakedowns by these dirty cops is a deterrent from others away from supporting non-establishment candidates in future elections as well. This is what the D.C. swamp wants - to fill the office of the President with "groomed", pre-chosen candidates like Jeb Bush or Hillary Clinton instead of who the voters choose.
    That’s party politics.

    And Trump got party votes.

    And Trump represents a political party.

    And Trump DID NOT CHOOSE TO run as an independent.

    And voters could choose independent candidates.

    Maybe if a billionaire candidate ran as an independent, financed his or her own campaign, stayed free of swamp connnections, voters - those sick of the establishment - would vote for an anti-establishment candidate in droves. (Or maybe voters aren’t sick of the establishment so they vote according to their old tribalistic ideological party lines.)

    Trump IS establishment. “The King is dead. Long live the King.”

    It’s a farce to think he’s anti-establishment. The republican swamp is protecting and supporting him and he’s pandering to them while lambasting the Democrats. He’s doing everything he can to pick loyal followers rather that statesmen and women. He wants a swamp of mindless followers just like every other establishment politician that does favours to get favours and support back. He’s just inexperienced and inept compared to all the rest that have gone before him.
    Last edited by KC; 18-09-2018 at 07:33 PM.

  50. #3350
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ralph60 View Post
    David Petraeus, Obama's CIA Director was guilty of mishandling classified information and sentenced to two years probation so your chart above is wrong./\/\
    No source link, so consider it fake news.
    It takes about 2 seconds to search for a news article about it:
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/23/polit...ing/index.html

    Now, that IS CNN, so it could be fake news...
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  51. #3351

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    OK, Obama had one misdemeanor. In 8 years.

  52. #3352

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    Was she Russian?

    Nope...

    No pee tape either...
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  53. #3353

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ralph60 View Post
    David Petraeus, Obama's CIA Director was guilty of mishandling classified information and sentenced to two years probation so your chart above is wrong./\/\
    No source link, so consider it fake news.
    It takes about 2 seconds to search for a news article about it:
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/23/polit...ing/index.html

    Now, that IS CNN, so it could be fake news...
    It’s not my job to research and verify everything. If it’s not easy to verify I simply discount it’s value. If the person posting information wants hard enough for people to believe that it’s valid or factual then they can spend the two seconds. If they don’t care. I’m fine with that too.

  54. #3354
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    If it's some obscure thing then a link should be provided, but don't whine that someone hasn't provided a link for something that you know just looking at it (such as this) that it would take 2 seconds to verify.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  55. #3355

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ralph60 View Post
    David Petraeus, Obama's CIA Director was guilty of mishandling classified information and sentenced to two years probation so your chart above is wrong./\/\
    No source link, so consider it fake news.
    It takes about 2 seconds to search for a news article about it:
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/23/polit...ing/index.html

    Now, that IS CNN, so it could be fake news...
    onus probandi

  56. #3356

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ralph60 View Post
    David Petraeus, Obama's CIA Director was guilty of mishandling classified information and sentenced to two years probation so your chart above is wrong./\/\
    No source link, so consider it fake news.
    It takes about 2 seconds to search for a news article about it:
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/23/polit...ing/index.html

    Now, that IS CNN, so it could be fake news...
    onus probandi
    Yes! I took two seconds to look it up. Because I felt like it.

    Buyer beware doesn’t really count in the age of selective perception and the embracing of echo chambers by people seeking confirmation to their bias.

    Those trying to find the closest thing to the truth though should not believe anything they read or the cartoons (aka memes) they see without the poster providing something of substance to support it.

  57. #3357

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    Woodward: No Evidence Of Trump-Russia Collusion, I Searched For Two Years | Video | RealClearPolitics

    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi...two_years.html



    The Russia Investigations: 'Where's The Collusion?' : NPR

    https://www.npr.org/2018/08/25/64165...-the-collusion

  58. #3358

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    Mueller has Trump backed into a corner.
    Watergate prosecutor explains how Mueller has effectively cornered Trump

    He continued: “I’ve been a criminal lawyer, both as, a prosecutor and criminal defense lawyer, for over four decades. Manafort’s ‘Superseding Criminal Information‘ sets forth the longest recitation of facts I have ever seen admitted to in a guilty plea — dozens of pages plus attached exhibits. In that document, Manafort admitted to every fact the government has alleged in both the District of Columbia and Virginia prosecutions.”


    He argued that Manafort’s conviction is now essentially “pardon proof.” The former campaign chair has now admitted, on the record, to crimes that states could bring against him even if Trump were to pardon him for all federal crimes, Akerman argued.


    This move undermines one of the biggest defenses Trump has in his arsenal, raising the likelihood that Mueller’s probe could uncover seriously damaging information about the president or those close to him.


    “When Manafort’s testimony is combined with the additional testimony of Flynn, Cohen and Gates, it appears that Mueller is quite likely on the verge of handing down new major indictments,” Akerman concluded. “These indictments could very well answer the ultimate question of what Trump knew and when he knew it.”

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/09/wat...ornered-trump/

  59. #3359

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    Trump's lies will start falling like dominoes

    REMINDER: Sources say Mueller has proof Michael Cohen was in Prague as Steele Dossier claims

    As McClatchy reported in April, special prosecutor Robert Mueller has proof that former Trump fixer Michael Cohen visited Prague in the summer of 2016 to meet with Russians, as alleged in the Steele Dossier.


    Cohen secretly made a late-summer trip to Prague, according to two sources familiar with the matter.


    The trip was a key claim in the dossier written by a former British spy, which made explosive claims about Trump’s conspiracy with Russia to steal the 2016 election.

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/09/mue...claims-report/

  60. #3360

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    The likelihood that Trump didn't know about the meeting and the fact it was with Russians peddling dirt is zero.

    Publicist who set up Trump Tower meeting believes Don Jr ‘did it for daddy’

    A British music publicist who set up the infamous Trump Tower meeting between top campaign staffers and a Russian attorney says he has little doubt Donald Trump was aware of the gathering.


    Rob Goldstone said he was asked to set up the June 9, 2016, meeting by pop start Emin Agalarov on behalf of his father Aras Agalarov, one of Russia’s wealthiest developers, and he admits he conveyed a “dirty offer,” reported NBC News.


    The publicist was surprised that Donald Trump Jr. included Jared Kushner and Paul Manafort in the meeting, which the candidate’s son set up by phone, and he said the Agalarovs tried to arrange another meeting between the president-elect and Russian attorney Natalia Veselnitskaya shortly after the November 2016 election.

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/09/pub...-don-jr-daddy/

  61. #3361

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    Deputy attorney general Rod Rosenstein RESIGNS before Trump can fire him | Daily Mail Online

    “Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein has verbally resigned to Chief of Staff John Kelly out of anticipation President Donald Trump will fire him, it was reported Monday.

    'He's expecting to be fired,' a source told Axios, which reported his firing.

    The White House has accepted his resignation, a source told Bloomberg News.

    Rosenstein is en route to the White House Monday morning to meet with Kelly. Trump is in New York for the U.N. General Assembly meeting.”


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-fire-him.html

  62. #3362

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    That news is premature. Rod Rosenstein is still working.
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  63. #3363

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Deputy attorney general Rod Rosenstein RESIGNS before Trump can fire him | Daily Mail Online

    “Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein has verbally resigned to Chief of Staff John Kelly out of anticipation President Donald Trump will fire him, it was reported Monday.

    'He's expecting to be fired,' a source told Axios, which reported his firing.

    The White House has accepted his resignation, a source told Bloomberg News.

    Rosenstein is en route to the White House Monday morning to meet with Kelly. Trump is in New York for the U.N. General Assembly meeting.”


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-fire-him.html


    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    That news is premature. Rod Rosenstein is still working.

    Premature news? I’d call it fake.


    Right now if you were to click on the link I posted above, the article you’d now find is this (the same link but premature news can easily be erased these days):

    Chaos at the White House: Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein DOESN'T resign and isn't fired over plans to wiretap Trump and use 25th Amendment to oust him – but ends up attending Cabinet meeting instead


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-fire-him.html



    It’s all hilarious! Like in the book 1984.


    Maybe this is responsible reporting:

    Rod Rosenstein to stay as US deputy attorney general for now, will meet Trump on Thursday | South China Morning Post

    https://www.scmp.com/news/world/unit...ng-white-house
    Last edited by KC; 24-09-2018 at 02:30 PM.

  64. #3364

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    Mueller shedding more attorneys in Russia investigation

    https://www.apnews.com/6266617d4617435f8573babae4c651a7

  65. #3365

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    Revealed: Russian billionaire set up US company before Trump Tower meeting | US news | The Guardian
    “Agalarov’s previously unreported shell company is another example of intriguing financial activity around the time of the Trump Tower meeting. Mueller is looking into such activity and whether any of the money involved could have been used to fund Russian meddling in the US election, which Agalarov denies.”
    ...
    “BuzzFeed News reported last month that Agalarov moved $19.5m from an offshore investment vehicle to a US bank account 11 days after the meeting. The transfer was reportedly flagged to US Treasury officials as suspicious. The Delaware company used the same name, Silver Valley Consulting, as the offshore vehicle.

    On the day of the money transfer, Trump fired his campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski, leaving his campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, in charge. Manafort, who has extensive business links to the former Soviet Union, is now cooperating with Mueller after having been convicted of financial crimes. ...”

    “Bykov dismissed suggestions that Agalarov was part of Russia’s election interference as “sensationalism” from critics of Trump. “Aras is a fantastic guy,” he said. “A great guy. ...”

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-tower-meeting



    Ecuador tried to move Julian Assange to Russia, new files confirm | Media | The Guardian

    https://www.theguardian.com/media/20...assy-documents





    .
    Last edited by KC; 18-10-2018 at 06:46 AM.

  66. #3366
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    With so many of the key players in the Trump/Russia story flipped by Mueller, the complete story will come out sometime in the future. The financial transactions will have to be explained.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  67. #3367

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    I just want to see Trump's tax returns to follow the money that he gets from foreign sources.

    Even Clinton gave her returns, why not Trump? Something to hide?
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  68. #3368

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I just want to see Trump's tax returns to follow the money that he gets from foreign sources.

    Even Clinton gave her returns, why not Trump? Something to hide?

  69. #3369

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    The last 2 years and this massive investigation have all been building up to this...


    Mueller report PSA: Prepare for disappointment
    And be forewarned that the special counsel’s findings may never be made public.


    President Donald Trump's critics have spent the past 17 months anticipating what some expect will be among the most thrilling events of their lives: special counsel Robert Mueller’s final report on Russian 2016 election interference.

    They may be in for a disappointment.

    That’s the word POLITICO got from defense lawyers working on the Russia probe and more than 15 former government officials with investigation experience spanning Watergate to the 2016 election case. The public, they say, shouldn’t expect a comprehensive and presidency-wrecking account of Kremlin meddling and alleged obstruction of justice by Trump — not to mention an explanation of the myriad subplots that have bedeviled lawmakers, journalists and amateur Mueller sleuths.

    Perhaps most unsatisfying: Mueller’s findings may never even see the light of day.

    “That’s just the way this works,” said John Q. Barrett, a former associate counsel who worked under independent counsel Lawrence Walsh during the Reagan-era investigation into secret U.S. arms sales to Iran. “Mueller is a criminal investigator. He’s not government oversight, and he’s not a historian.”
    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...indings-914754

  70. #3370

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    Paul Manafort in Wheelchair: 'Significant' Health Issues In Jail - Bloomberg

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...inia-courtroom

  71. #3371

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    The last 2 years and this massive investigation have all been building up to this...


    Mueller report PSA: Prepare for disappointment
    And be forewarned that the special counsel’s findings may never be made public.


    President Donald Trump's critics have spent the past 17 months anticipating what some expect will be among the most thrilling events of their lives: special counsel Robert Mueller’s final report on Russian 2016 election interference.

    They may be in for a disappointment.

    That’s the word POLITICO got from defense lawyers working on the Russia probe and more than 15 former government officials with investigation experience spanning Watergate to the 2016 election case. The public, they say, shouldn’t expect a comprehensive and presidency-wrecking account of Kremlin meddling and alleged obstruction of justice by Trump — not to mention an explanation of the myriad subplots that have bedeviled lawmakers, journalists and amateur Mueller sleuths.

    Perhaps most unsatisfying: Mueller’s findings may never even see the light of day.

    “That’s just the way this works,” said John Q. Barrett, a former associate counsel who worked under independent counsel Lawrence Walsh during the Reagan-era investigation into secret U.S. arms sales to Iran. “Mueller is a criminal investigator. He’s not government oversight, and he’s not a historian.”
    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...indings-914754
    Not news and not surprising. There’s always information being withheld. Redacted pages etc. (JFK, 911’s Saudis etc)

    Also, as you would have read yourself in that same article, but you didn’t quote (hence the link, right?):

    The White House, for one, has indicated it might try to butt into the proceedings. Trump personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani said earlier this summer that the White House had reserved the right to block the release of information in Mueller’s final report that might be covered through executive privilege. It’s unclear how salient that legal argument may be, but the president’s attorneys have been saying for months that a White House signoff will be needed because the Justice Department also falls inside the executive branch.

    Congress is also primed to have a say. While Democratic leaders are hoping a return to power in the upcoming November midterms could grant them subpoena power to pry as much information as possible from the special counsel’s office, Republicans might try to restrict the release of certain details that might embarrass the president.



    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...indings-914754

    That is an interesting article though and thanks for posting.

    Interesting discussion on different points.

    For instance I hadn’t realized how long some of these things were dragged out - 8 years for dirt on Clinton!

    Not even a report on the Republican politicians that outed Valerie Plame Wilson (treason only applies to the workers and the opposition party?)
    Last edited by KC; 20-10-2018 at 07:54 AM.

  72. #3372

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Paul Manafort in Wheelchair: 'Significant' Health Issues In Jail - Bloomberg

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...inia-courtroom

    Don't do the crime if you can't do the time...





    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  73. #3373

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Paul Manafort in Wheelchair: 'Significant' Health Issues In Jail - Bloomberg

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...inia-courtroom
    So Manafort wants out of prison because he is now in a eheelchair and finds his cell too confining.

    Cosby wants out because he is going blind and can't find dates.

    Next Trump will want a pardon because he can't profit from jail time and he has bone spurs...
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  74. #3374

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Paul Manafort in Wheelchair: 'Significant' Health Issues In Jail - Bloomberg

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...inia-courtroom
    All it would take for him to be in a wheelchair is him asking for one and refusing to walk. It's not like he'd need a doctor's note and they're not going to drag him in.

    Career FBI agent mocks Manafort’s sudden illness: It’s amazing how convicts always show up crippled for sentencing

    “I don’t know anything about his specific health problems today, but I will say this,” he deadpanned. “In my 25 year career I was amazed by the crippling and disabling injuries that would befall someone just as they are entering the court to talk about their sentencing.”

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/10/car...or-sentencing/

  75. #3375

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    As they say "Follow the money"

    The Planners Of The Trump Tower Meeting Moved Millions, And Mueller Is Now Investigating
    Documents show suspicious transfers began six days before the controversial meeting.

    On June 3, 2016, Donald Trump Jr. received one of the most striking emails of the presidential campaign, offering dirt on Hillary Clinton as part of the Russian government’s “support for Mr. Trump.”


    Trump Jr. responded 17 minutes later: “if it’s what you say I love it.”


    That email led to a meeting at Trump Tower that has become a central focus of the investigation into possible collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign.


    But the very day that email was sent, another exchange was taking place behind the scenes.


    Documents reviewed by BuzzFeed News show that $3.3 million began moving on June 3 between two of the men who orchestrated the meeting: Aras Agalarov, a billionaire real estate developer close to both Vladimir Putin and President Donald Trump, and Irakly “Ike” Kaveladze, a longtime Agalarov employee once investigated for money laundering.


    That money is on top of the more than $20 million that was flagged as suspicious, BuzzFeed News revealed earlier this month, after the money ricocheted among the planners and participants of the Trump Tower meeting. Special counsel Robert Mueller’s team, which has been investigating whether any individuals colluded with Russia to influence the 2016 presidential election, is examining the suspicious transactions, four federal law enforcement officials said. A spokesperson for Mueller’s office declined to comment.

    https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...-tower-meeting

  76. #3376

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    Career criminals now politicians.

  77. #3377

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    ^ Don't say that. You will make MrOilers cry
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  78. #3378

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    From the lefty Wall Street Journal.

    Mueller has recordings where Roger Stone bragged about plan to release stolen Democrat emails: WSJ report

    Longtime Trump adviser Roger Stone bragged about Wikileaks’ plans to release stolen emails from Democratic Party officials on conference calls during the run-up to the 2016 election, the Wall Street Journal reports.


    At least twice during August 2016, the Trump adviser had conference calls where he told callers about WikiLeaks’ plans to release information that he said would affect the 2016 presidential campaign before the election, the paper reports.

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/10/mue...ls-wsj-report/

  79. #3379

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    How a right-wing effort to slime Mueller with a sexual assault allegation fell apart
    https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/31/media...ons/index.html
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  80. #3380
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Strathcona - Mill Creek
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    5,441

    Default

    That's pretty pathetic. One thing to notice is how quickly things fell apart. Why'd they fall apart? Because journalists were doing their jobs researching the story.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  81. #3381

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    And now there's an obstruction of justice investigation into it. Or, as Trump calls it, a witch hunt or "fake news"

  82. #3382

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    Funny how recording things can come back to prove you wrong."

    ‘When was that?’: Watch Lindsey Graham bumble after Fox News airs his previous comments about Trump firing Sessions

    "Back in July 2017, Graham said there would be “holy hell to pay” if Trump fired Attorney General Jeff Sessions to quash the Robert Mueller probe and warned it would be “the beginning of the end of Trump’s presidency.”


    On Thursday night, Fox News asked Graham about his old comments, making him visibly uncomfortable.


    “When was that?” Graham said. “What year?”


    “July of 2017,” said anchor Martha MacCallum.


    “Hehehehehehehehe,” Graham said. “So… Hehe. Yeah… So, what I’ve been saying for months is that every president deserves an Attorney General they have confidence in.”"

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/11/wat...ring-sessions/

  83. #3383

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    A reporter asks a fair and straight forward question of the President and Trump attacks the reporter by calling her questions stupid.

    Trump does not respect the Constitutional right for the Press to ask relevant questions.

    Trump rips reporter for 'stupid question' on Mueller probe

    https://thehill.com/homenews/media/4...-mueller-probe
    In a gaggle with reporters, Trump was asked by Phillip if he was hoping that Matthew Whitaker, the acting attorney general appointed on Wednesday and a past critic of Robert Mueller's special counsel investigation, would "rein in" the Russia probe.

    "Do you want [Whitaker] to rein in Robert Mueller?" Phillip asked.

    "What a stupid question that is," Trump responded. "What a stupid question." "But I watch you a lot," the president continued. "You ask a lot of stupid questions."

    Declining to answer, Trump then walked away from the gaggle as Phillip and other reporters shouted questions in response.

    Trump's comments aimed at Phillip come as he increasingly feuds with CNN, the cable news network he has long battled. Trump also called April Ryan, a contributor to the network, a "loser" on Friday. And he again criticized CNN White House reporter Jim Acosta, with whom he is feuding. On Wednesday night, the White House suspended Acosta's press pass after the reporter pressed Trump on his statements about a migrant caravan at a press conference earlier that day.

    The White House then tweeted out a doctored video first posted by the conspiracy site InfoWars to claim that Acosta physically struck a White House intern who was attempting to take his microphone.
    Acosta's arm briefly brushed the White House aide's arm as she reached in to take his microphone, but Acosta did not put his hands on the aide. “We will ... never tolerate a reporter placing his hands on a young woman just trying to do her job as a White House intern," White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said in a statement. "This conduct is absolutely unacceptable.”

    CNN responded in a statement, stating that Sanders "lied" about the incident between Acosta and the intern, and used a "fraudulent" explanation to justify rescinding Acosta's press pass.
    “It was done in retaliation for his challenging questions at today's press conference,” the network said. “This unprecedented decision is a threat to our democracy and the country deserves better.”
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  84. #3384

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    Matthew Whitaker has experience advising con artists. Will he help more under Trump?
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...=.6c29d4eea99b
    Given all this, why was Whitaker chosen for an (acting) Cabinet post? Presumably because a Nigerian prince wasn’t available.

    Trump clearly loves to surround himself with fellow hucksters, snake-oil salesmen and others accused of questionable business behavior.

    Recall that Education Secretary Betsy DeVos backed a “brain performance” firm that advertised 90 percent success rates in curing illnesses such as attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, despite having no such evidence. Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ben Carson shilled for a miracle-cure dietary supplement company and continued doing so even after it settled a deceptive-marketing case with the state of Texas.

    A land deal involving Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke is under federal investigation. Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross is being sued by a former business associate who claims Ross stole from him. Ross has also joined former health and human services secretary Tom Price and former Centers for Disease Control and Prevention director Brenda Fitzgerald in making suspicious stock trades.

    And so on and so on.

    There’s also the grifter in chief. Besides the myriad contractors and small businesses he has stiffed over the years, President Trump recently settled a case over Trump University. Which — in separating naive customers from big sums of money while failing to fulfill the promises it made to them — looks an awful lot like World Patent Marketing.

    If Trump’s other appointments are any clue, Whitaker can be expected to exercise his newfound authority to help even more con artists — not just his boss, who clearly wants the Russia probe hobbled, but also others who stand to benefit from further scaling back Justice Department enforcement of white-collar crime.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  85. #3385

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    Trump originally said on Fox that he knows Matt Whitaker

    Today Trump distances himself from Matt Whitaker saying that he does not know him

    Trump on acting AG: ‘I don’t know Matt Whitaker’
    https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...aker/38453721/

    Memo to Matt; when Trump says he doesn't know you, watch him toss you under the next bus...
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  86. #3386

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    Which is it? According to Trump, it's both!

    BUSTED: Trump denies knowing Matt Whitaker — one month after saying ‘I know Matt Whitaker’ in Fox interview

    “I don’t know Matt Whitaker,” Trump claimed. “Matt Whitaker worked for Jeff Sessions. And he was always extremely highly thought of, and he still is. But I didn’t know Matt Whitaker.”


    However, during an October 11th interview with “Fox & Friends,” the president literally said that he knew Matt Whitaker.


    During the interview, Fox host Steve Doocy asked Trump if there was any truth to a Washington Post report claiming that the president was considering replacing then-Attorney General Jeff Sessions with Whitaker, who at the time was Sessions’ chief of staff.


    Trump wouldn’t say one way or another whether he really intended to replace Sessions with Whitaker, but he was full of praise for the man who would go on to become his acting AG.


    “I can tell you Matt Whitaker’s a great guy,” Trump said. “I mean, I know Matt Whitaker.”"

    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/11/bus...E8Scs.facebook

  87. #3387

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    White House 4 Step Job Application Process

    1. Go on Faux News
    2. Tell viewers that you have a way to extricate the President from his legal problems
    3. Wait by the Phone
    4. Get appointed as United States Attorney General
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  88. #3388

    Default

    This guy sounds like MrNazi.

    Trump’s New Acting Attorney General Claimed There Was No Evidence Russia Interfered in the 2016 Election
    Long after US intelligence declared Moscow intervened, Matt Whitaker said no “single fact” supported this.

    On one of his 2017 pundit outings, Whittaker even denied that Moscow had attacked the 2016 campaign. During a May 30, 2017, radio show appearance, he declared, “A foreign power attempting to interfere in elections is obviously a very salacious claim, but you know again I have not seen a single fact that would suggest that anything like that has happened. But this doesn’t prevent folks from going on CNN and other media outlets and saying that it happened.”


    Note the date. Whitaker said this five months after the US intelligence community had publicly released an assessment that concluded that “Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered an influence campaign in 2016 aimed at the US presidential election.” The report, issued on January 6, 2017, noted, “Russia’s goals were to undermine public faith in the US democratic process, denigrate Secretary [Hillary] Clinton, and harm her electability and potential presidency. We further assess Putin and the Russian Government developed a clear preference for President-elect Trump.” The document said the secret Kremlin scheme blended “covert intelligence operations—such as cyber activity—with overt efforts by Russian Government agencies, state-funded media, third-party intermediaries, and paid social media users or ‘trolls.'” In other words, Moscow attacked the United States with information warfare in part to help Trump win the presidency.


    What was Whitaker thinking when he said there was no evidence to back up the assertion that Russia assaulted the election?


    Here is a clue. In an interview a week earlier, Whitaker pushed the conspiracy theory that talk of Russia intervention was nothing but a hoax cooked up by the media and Trump’s political enemies: “You have a media that does not like this president or this administration. And it’s trying to—I think it’s successfully now hamstrung him and made him pretty ineffective at least in the near term with a special counsel being appointed to investigate the situation with Russia. I can’t see a single shred of evidence to suggest that anything happened. And so I think you have a media together with a minority party in the Democrats that you know don’t want to see Donald Trump’s vision for America implemented.” Got that? Nothing had happened. It was all a media fabrication concocted to lead to a special counsel investigation that would damage Trump’s presidency.


    Whitaker seemed to be ignorant of a basic fact: the Trump-Russia investigation was initiated by the FBI a year earlier in complete secrecy, due to information the bureau had received. Mueller was only appointed to lead the existing inquiry after Trump in May 2017 fired James Comey as FBI director. The media and Trump’s Democratic foes had nothing to do with the origins of the investigation.

    https://www.motherjones.com/politics...8NBBsqV0MCLA-U

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