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Thread: Trump on immigration, big beautiful walls, etc

  1. #601

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Yes, this Imam is an ***. But so are many Christian ministers (particularly evangelicals), Rabbis and others.

    Christians didn't make this Imam say those hateful things.

    Stop being an apologist for Islamic hate crimes.

  2. #602

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Imagine if all those people were black. There'd be black bodies littering the ground.

    Thomas Robb publishes The Crusader, a quarterly publication, an official publication of The Knights Party or the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan. The newspaper also uses the slogans "The Political Voice of White Christian America - The Premier Voice of the White Resistance"

    Why are you posting that crap here?

    Is the far-left actually making no distinction between conservatives and actual racists anymore?

  3. #603

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    That protest was a protest against removing the Thomas Jefferson statue from Jefferson University.

    Left-leaning journalists will focus on some of the racists that commandeered the protest:

    Imagine being half as brave as this black teen standing dead center in a circle of racist white nationalists with torches
    https://archive.fo/WsEVY#selection-3583.0-3583.121
    That black teen she is assuming is a victim was one of the organizers of the protest.

  4. #604

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    All those citronella candles helped keep the mosquitoes away.
    I am in no way entitled to your opinion...

  5. #605

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    And the right hands raised were for swatting the mosquitoes away.
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  6. #606

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    All those citronella candles helped keep the mosquitoes away.
    "The war on mosquitoes is racist"
    - the left (probably)

  7. #607

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post

    Is the far-left actually making no distinction between conservatives and actual racists anymore?
    Seeing as there isn't a distinction between conservatives and actual racists anymore, there's no reason to. The newspaper is the official paper of the KKK and has a front page editorial endorsing Donald Trump. They're not just racists, they're his base.

  8. #608

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    there isn't a distinction between conservatives and actual racists

    And there it is, folks - the left's agenda. Just like Islam.

    "You must agree with our politics OR ELSE."

  9. #609

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    Says the guy that there's no distinction between ISIS and billions of peaceful Muslims.

    As long as you can look at these girls and stand by your comment that they're terrorists, you can wear that badge with honour.

    Ooooohhhh, scary!


  10. #610

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Says the guy that there's no distinction between ISIS and billions of peaceful Muslims.
    Of course there's a distinction. I make a distinction between the people (including Muslim people).

    However, ISLAM is a dangerous, intolerant, oppressive, and hateful political ideology which I oppose and condemn. I also believe that all people who value Western democratic freedoms should as well.

  11. #611

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    Oh I see, you condemn Islam but not the people that follow it. That's why you called a girls robotics team terrorists.

    Here's a clue, billions, literally billions of Muslims are peaceful, law abiding people.

    Meanwhile, Christianity can do things like this with nary a peep from those on the right.

    And he's factually wrong on one point. The Bible isn't against rape. Numerous times it tells it's followers to kill the men and take the women for their own. Also, if your daughter is raped, her rapist can pimply buy her from your for a few pieces of silver, currently valued at about $400.
    "As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you." - Deuteronomy 20:10-14
    If some Muslims want to distort the Koran and you want to condemn the entire religion for it, why don't you do the same thing when Christians do the same?

    ‘Stone the apostates’: Pastor linked to Ted Cruz says pro-LGBTQ schools should be burned down

    “Rape is also against God’s law and I guess it must be against state law; I’m not getting why, though,” Swanson — who in the past has called for the execution of LGBTQ people — said. “Why in the world is a sexual crime against the law in the state of Washington if the other forms of crimes are not against the law in the state of Washington? See, this is confusing to me.”


    Swanson called the state’s public schools “whorehouses” and said, “the worst possible abominations are accepted in the state of Washington.”


    “We need to burn ’em down,” said Jack.

    http://www.rawstory.com/2017/08/ston...kMXbs.facebook
    Last edited by kkozoriz; 12-08-2017 at 05:54 PM.

  12. #612

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    And here's David Duke, former Grand Wizard of the KKK spelling it in terms even MrOilers can understand.

    KKK leader David Duke confirms ‘Unite the Right” march ‘fulfills the promises of Donald Trump’

    Prominent white supremeacist David Duke is marching in Donald Trump’s name at the violent “Unite the Right” rally in Charlottesville, VA.


    “This represents a turning point for the people of this country,” the former Grand Wizard of the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan said at the rally.


    “We are determined to take our country back,” Duke continued.


    “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump,” Duke said. “That’s what we believed in, that’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to ‘take our country back’ and that’s what we gotta do.”

    http://www.rawstory.com/2017/08/kkk-...-donald-trump/

  13. #613

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    Once again, you are quoting people that nobody cares about. And I have no respect for violent religious nuts of any stripe.


    However, if you think white supremacy and Christian terrorism is such a problem, how come there aren't any listed on the FBI's most wanted terrorist list?

    See for yourself: https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/terrorism

  14. #614

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    If some Muslims want to distort the Koran and you want to condemn the entire religion for it, why don't you do the same thing when Christians do the same?
    Because Christianity is a religion but Islam is a political ideology.

    I disagree with both philosophies, but Christianity has the societal advantage of letting non-Christians have "free will" to choose to follow their religion or not. Islam doesn't.

  15. #615

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    Yeah by calling for them to be stoned to death and burning down schools and bombing mosques and shooting Muslims at prayer and shooting doctors who perform abortions and.....

    Christianity, particularly in the US these days is as much a political movement as a religion.

    And Islam is a religion that, just like Christianity, gets perverted into a political ideology.

    In the UK the monarch is also, MUST also, be the head of the church. No catholics or Mormons or Muslims or Buddhists or Atheists need apply. Can't get a lot more intertwine of politics and religion there. And that's just one example.

  16. #616

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    If some Muslims want to distort the Koran and you want to condemn the entire religion for it, why don't you do the same thing when Christians do the same?
    Because Christianity is a religion but Islam is a political ideology.

    I disagree with both philosophies, but Christianity has the societal advantage of letting non-Christians have "free will" to choose to follow their religion or not. Islam doesn't.
    You know absolutely nothing about Christianity or Islamic religion. You clearly state that Islam is an ideology which is totally wrong. It is a religion and your ignorance of that proves it. You other comments continue to prove you ignorance.
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  17. #617

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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton prt View Post
    you clearly state that islam is an ideology which is totally wrong.

    hahahahahahaha

  18. #618

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    There is something seriously wrong with you. Seek help for your flame baiting ignorance.

    A Muslim is someone who follows or practices Islam, a monotheistic Abrahamic religion. Muslims consider the Quran (Koran), their holy book, to be the verbatim word of God as revealed to the Islamic prophet and messenger Muhammad. ... "Muslim" is an Arabic word meaning "one who submits (to God)".
    Muslim - Wikipedia
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  19. #619

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    All Islamic countries are dictatorships. Islam is an oppressive political ideology masquerading as a religion.

  20. #620

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    That is not what you said. You said nothing about countries. You said Islam is not a religion.

    You are backpedaling because you got caught again in your lies, fake news and ignorance. Please stop commenting on things you know nothing about and spinning misrepresentations of the facts and rewriting what you clearly posted. Things that you continue to post that are untrue even after other posters have proven you wrong again and again.

    Face it, you got caught.
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  21. #621

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    Islam is an ideology, which is why all Muslim-majority countries become oppressive theocratic dictatorships.

    It's an oppressive, hateful, and intolerant ideology that refuses to meet free societies (such as Western democracies) halfway.

  22. #622

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    Wrong!

    Please keep up with your public display of ignorance.
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  23. #623
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    Here is a short list of Muslim majority countries and that are not dictatorships (sourced from the CIA world factbook):


    • Malaysia - federal parliamentary constitutional monarchy
    • Indonesia - presidential republic
    • Turkey - parliamentary republic
    • Algeria - presidential republic
    • Albania - parliamentary republic
    • Tunisia - parliamentary republic
    • Jordan - parliamentary constitutional monarchy
    • Morocco - parliamentary constitutional monarchy


    Of course one could argue how truly democratic, how authoritarian, how politically stable these countries are and how smooth the transfer of power may be.

    According to Wiki, two countries from the above list, are secular states (Albania and Turkey) and there are many others that are as well.
    Last edited by norwoodguy; 13-08-2017 at 03:34 AM. Reason: additional infomration
    Did my dog just fall into a pothole???

  24. #624

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    My mistake. It seems that only 42 out of 50 of Muslim-majority countries are oppressive theocratic dictatorships.

  25. #625

  26. #626

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    MrClosetRacist.
    Time for a joke:



    I'm curious - why is concern about Islam, and the attitudes towards women and free speech, in the countries that follow it, considered racism? People of all races can be Muslim. Yakupov for example, is a Muslim, or cat Stevens, of the late Muhammad Ali.
    Last edited by moahunter; 14-08-2017 at 09:35 AM.

  27. #627

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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    I'm curious - why is concern about Islam, and the attitudes towards women and free speech, in the countries that follow it, considered racism?

    The left relies a lot on public shaming and "piling on" to control discourse when they have no argument. But since calling people names (racist, _____ phobic, etc.) is a useless debate tactic and only affects how people act, and not how they think, the backlash from the right wing has been harsh (as evidenced by Donald Trump's rise to power).


    Here is a piece from the Wall Street Journal (written by a liberal Humanities Professor) that attacks identity politics and claims that most Americans (including young people, women and minorities) are rejecting the term “liberal" saying that it seems aloof, elitist, and out of touch.

    I think this is a worthwhile read no matter what your political affiliation is.




    The Liberal Crackup
    Liberals should reject the divisive, zero-sum politics of identity and find their way back to a unifying vision of the common good


    ...


    The politics of identity has done nothing but strengthen the grip of the American right on our institutions. It is the gift that keeps on taking. Now is the time for liberals to do an immediate about-face and return to articulating their core principles of solidarity and equal protection for all. Never has the country needed it more.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-lib...56857?mod=e2tw

  28. #628
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    All those citronella candles helped keep the mosquitoes away.
    Honestly, when I saw that picture of them all standing around the statue, I couldn't help but laugh at all the tiki torches. Their march of white supremacists loses some of it's intimidation when they're using those instead of some good old pine pitch torches.

    It would appear that Tiki is none too thrilled about being associated with this idiots: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/tik...sts-2017-08-13

  29. #629

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    I like it when when racists march with tiki torches, in clothes & shoes made by Asians. You can hate us but you can't escape us boo
    — David So (@davidsocomedy) August 13, 2017

    Nothing says "Defending White Culture" like carrying a Tiki Torch. A polynesian cultural product to defend and assert white supremacy

    — KJW (@Walakk) August 13, 2017

    When you think you're the master race but you can't figure out how to make your own damn torch. pic.twitter.com/vwSCQofDkm
    — Rex Huppke (@RexHuppke) August 12, 2017
    I love how the usual under, or uneducated masses of racists, neo-nazis, and other 'white power' pieces of **** that are empowered by 'Trump the Racist' being in power, thinking now is their time, that they are the master race, and the rest of humanity is of some lesser. No, no, idiots, dumb-fukkas, You are not the master race. You are white trash. You are filth. You are disgusting. you are what is wrong with America.

  30. #630

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    They are Trump's base. He was endorsed by the KKK, The American Nazi Party, The Daily Stormer. He was telling them what they wanted to hear. All Muslims were bad. Immigrants were the reason they were not doing well financially. Even "Make America Great Again" harkens back to a time when blacks and other minorities "knew their place".

    He let them know that the reason he couldn't "get a fair trial" in his Trump University suit wasn't because he'd been caught running a scam. It was because the judge was Mexican, even though he'd been born in Chicago. The message being that non-caucasian/white Europeans shouldn't be judged by anyone who doesn't share their ethnic heritage.

    And he continued it by bringing Bannon, Gorka and the rest into the White House.

    Would Trump have said the fault lies on both sides if the driver of the car had been black or Muslim?

    And he still has not spoken out about the bombing of the mosque in Minnesota that happened 10 days ago.

  31. #631

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    Trump has to disavow every single fringe group he never avowed in the first place?

  32. #632
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    He does when he repeatedly dog whistles at them, uses their coded terminology and outright re-posts their memes. He's been pussy footing with white supremacists and their ilk from the very start.

  33. #633

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    His "disvowals" have looked like hostage confessions in their lack of sincerity.
    I am in no way entitled to your opinion...

  34. #634
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    Does anyone have a video of the press conference where Trump is asked to speak out about the attack, and just walks away? He might as well put out a letter of endorsement at this point.

  35. #635

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    Yup

    Press conference starts at the 3:28 minute mark
    Finishes with him running away at 3:51
    23 second press conference

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  36. #636

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    If some Muslims want to distort the Koran and you want to condemn the entire religion for it, why don't you do the same thing when Christians do the same?
    Because Christianity is a religion but Islam is a political ideology.

    I disagree with both philosophies, but Christianity has the societal advantage of letting non-Christians have "free will" to choose to follow their religion or not. Islam doesn't.
    So much wrong with this post that it deserves to be quoted again. Others have already rebuked it. I have no idea why someone would make a distinction that Islam is not a religion and Christianity is. Or that Christianity is associated with free will.

    People can say whatever they want. But to say something as deluded as that whole post is astounding.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  37. #637

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    Just days after a crowd of people were mowed down by a terrorist, The President of Hate, retweets a symbolic member of the press being mowed down by a train

    Trump is deplorable and AGAIN is dog whistling his base to attack the press, attack people and inciting violence.

    Trump Shares, Then Deletes, Twitter Post of Train Hitting Cartoon Person Covered by CNN Logo

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/15/u...-by-train.html
    WASHINGTON — President Trump shared on Twitter a cartoon on Tuesday morning of a train running over a person with a CNN logo covering the person’s head, three days after a fatal collision in Charlottesville, Va. Mr. Trump deleted his retweet minutes later.

    Mr. Trump has been under fire for how he has publicly addressed bloody demonstrations by white nationalists over the weekend. Promoting a cartoon of a person being run over by a train appeared to belittle the attack by a driver who ran into a crowd of counterprotesters, leaving a 32-year-old woman dead on Saturday and 19 others injured. An Ohio man has been charged with second-degree murder in the crash.
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  38. #638

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    Charlottesville attacker SPAT on his wheelchair-bound mom and threatened her with a knife when he was a teen in repeated pattern of violent behavior that forced her to call 911 multiple times


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz4pq34ZOve
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
    -Kentucky 911 records show that Samantha Bloom called police at least three times on her son, suspected Charlottesville attacker James Alex Fields, 20
    -The phone records were from 2010 and 2011, when Fields was 13 and 14
    -On one occasion, Bloom threatened his mom, spit in her face and stood behind her with a 12-inch knife in front of one of her friends
    -On another occasion, Bloom locked herself in a bathroom after her son exploded in anger when she told him to stop playing video games
    -In the third incident, she told police that her son threatened her and she was scared
    -Fields killed one woman and injured 19 others when he rammed his car into a crowd of protesters in Charlottesville, Virginia on Saturday
    -That night, Bloom was surprised to hear about what her son had done
    -She said she thought he was going to a Trump rally, not a white supremacist march


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz4pq3NUMv2
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
    "She said she thought he was going to a Trump rally, not a white supremacist march"

    EXACTLY THE SAME THING...


    Family disowns racist outed at Charlottesville rally
    http://nypost.com/2017/08/14/family-...ia-disown-him/
    The family of a white nationalist who joined in the violent supremacy rally in Charlottesville, Va., on Saturday has publicly announced they are disowning him and his “hateful beliefs.”

    Pete Tefft of Fargo, ND was one of many neo-Nazi marchers to have his identity revealed, along with his photo, on the “Yes, You’re Racist” Twitter account after the deadly demonstration, prompting his family to speak out.
    “He once joked, ‘The thing about us fascists is, it’s not that we don’t believe in freedom of speech. You can say whatever you want. We’ll just throw you in an oven,’” the letter continued.


    The father close the letter with: “Peter, you will have to shovel our bodies into the oven, too. Please son, renounce the hate, accept and love all.”
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  39. #639

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    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    Does anyone have a video of the press conference where Trump is asked to speak out about the attack, and just walks away? He might as well put out a letter of endorsement at this point.

    Yup, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lZXOIb2o9o

  40. #640

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I have no idea why someone would make a distinction that Islam is not a religion and Christianity is.
    Yes, Christianity is a religion.

    Yes, Islam is a political ideology that claims it is also a religion.

  41. #641

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I have no idea why someone would make a distinction that Islam is not a religion and Christianity is.
    Yes, Christianity is a religion.

    Yes, Islam is a political ideology that claims it is also a religion.
    Yes, the centuries of the papacy being in bed with European kings was not political at all. Or the current influence of the Christian base on the Trump administration.

  42. #642

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    ^^Your distinction, or that Christianity is inured with free will exists only in your mind. Its interesting that you can even think what you wrote is plausible. Its entertaining that you would write this publicly to face obvious rebuttal. Which apparently you don't comprehend.

    In anycase expand on Christianity being all about free will, never being ideological, and expound on its societal advantage. We could all use a laugh.
    Last edited by Replacement; 15-08-2017 at 10:55 AM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  43. #643

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    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I have no idea why someone would make a distinction that Islam is not a religion and Christianity is.
    Yes, Christianity is a religion.

    Yes, Islam is a political ideology that claims it is also a religion.
    Yes, the centuries of the papacy being in bed with European kings was not political at all.

    Which they stopped many hundreds of years ago, in case you didn't notice. Islam has had no such reformation.

    And this is why the greatest countries to live in the world for most people are Western-style democracies, and most of the worst places to live in the world are Islamic dictatorships.

  44. #644

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    ^^Your distinction, or that Christianity is inured with free will exists only in your mind.
    You're wrong.

  45. #645

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    ^Brilliant rebuttal.

    Lets play Monty Python argument.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  46. #646

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    Please list as many free democratic Christian-majority countries in the world vs free democratic Muslim-majority countries in the world as you can. My point will be apparent to you.

  47. #647

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    There is no Christian doctrine even close to Islam's pronouncement of death for apostates, for example. Things like the Spanish inquisition and various persecutions of heretics through history are at odds with actual Christian teachings and were rooted in either nationalist fervor where part of the national identity is "Christian", or in maintaining the power of an establishment church and it's royal allies.

    Which is where 15th century spain and today's USA are similar.
    There can only be one.

  48. #648

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Please list as many free democratic Christian-majority countries in the world vs free democratic Muslim-majority countries in the world as you can. My point will be apparent to you.
    Moving goalposts is the telltale signpost of being wrong. You've gone from an indefensible statement, which for some reason you made, (and I quoted) to completely different points. While indicating you have a clear and cogent point.

    Next time maybe start with an opening statement you can defend rather than the bait yourself and switch you have engaged in.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  49. #649

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    Accusing someone of moving goalposts when they are giving an example that supports their argument is a surefire way of telling them that your only rebuttal is saying "Nope".

  50. #650

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post


    Which they stopped many hundreds of years ago, in case you didn't notice. Islam has had no such reformation.

    And this is why the greatest countries to live in the world for most people are Western-style democracies, and most of the worst places to live in the world are Islamic dictatorships.
    A Christian reformation was relatively easy because most of what needed reformation wasn't at all supported in Christian scripture; reformed Christianity was more like the Christianity of the first 350 years of the church, before it ever became the state religion of anywhere.

    Islam's roots weren't at all like that, you get wars of conquest and conversion by the sword within the lifetime of Mohammad. Which is how ISIS could claim to be returning to an original, pure religion.
    Last edited by Highlander II; 15-08-2017 at 11:27 AM.
    There can only be one.

  51. #651

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    So defend your original statements then instead of changing them.

    "Because Christianity is a religion but Islam is a political ideology.

    I disagree with both philosophies, but Christianity has the societal advantage of letting non-Christians have "free will" to choose to follow their religion or not. Islam doesn't."

    or

    "Yes, Christianity is a religion.

    Yes, Islam is a political ideology that claims it is also a religion."


    Statements that are so specious and biased they rebuke themselves. You're invoking patent "in the eyes of the beholder" bias without even realizing it.

    The difficulty with what you wrote is that your distinction is tenous at best and indefensible. Which you are demonstrating by moving away from those statements.
    Last edited by Replacement; 15-08-2017 at 11:31 AM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  52. #652

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    Islam's roots weren't at all like that, you get wars of conquest and conversion by the sword within the lifetime of Mohammad.
    True. Murdering non-believers and raping 9-year-olds was how Mohammed founded Islam.

    Sadly, it is still happening today, and I think that apologists for Islam are PREVENTING Islam from evolving and doing a great disservice for moderate Muslims who want to see Islam go through a reformation that allows it to coexist peacefully with people of other religious faith and political viewpoints.

  53. #653

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    So defend your original statements then instead of changing them.
    Let me break it down:

    Islam is a political ideology (that claims it is also a religion). This is why almost every single Islamic country in the world is a theocratic dictatorship.

    Christianity is a religion which respects that people have free will to choose to follow their saviour (or not). This is why the majority of Christian-majority countries are free democratic nations.

    It isn't this way because of "luck"

  54. #654

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    Both are religions. Repeating yourself isn't argument. Stating emphatically one only claims to be a religion while the other is one is impartial at best. You've done little to explain YOUR difference in defining of religions, you've distracted by the present day application of said religions.

    Its an important distinction when viewing that all religions can be distorted, even perverted, for specific gain.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  55. #655

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    So the Spanish inquisition which killed millions of Muslims and Jews is labeled as against church's teachings (even though the Pope was front and centre of it. ) but ISIS's actions are labeled Islamic?

    Just another way to justify your own prejudice and bias.

    Try reading "Ornament of the East" -- historical publication on the coexistence of three major religions in Andalusian Spain until the forces backed by the Church took over and massacred everyone. But I take it you much prefer Fox News as your source of info.

  56. #656

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I have no idea why someone would make a distinction that Islam is not a religion and Christianity is.
    Yes, Christianity is a religion.

    Yes, Islam is a political ideology that claims it is also a religion.
    Yes, the centuries of the papacy being in bed with European kings was not political at all.

    Which they stopped many hundreds of years ago, in case you didn't notice. Islam has had no such reformation.

    And this is why the greatest countries to live in the world for most people are Western-style democracies, and most of the worst places to live in the world are Islamic dictatorships.
    BOY ARE YOU WRONG, AGAIN!

    Let's not forget "The Troubles" in Northern Ireland and all the mixing of Church and State in the Duplessis Years. The KKK being a Christian based organization,
    The ritual of lighting crosses was steeped in Christian symbolism, including prayer and hymn singing. Within Christianity the Klan directed its hostilities against Catholics. Modern Klan organizations remain associated with acts of domestic terrorism in the United States.
    Maybe you should read about all the Christian backed terrorism in Lebanon, Africa, India and especially that paragon of virtue; the United States of America

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism
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  57. #657

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    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    Try reading "Ornament of the East" -- historical publication on the coexistence of three major religions in Andalusian Spain until the forces backed by the Church took over and massacred everyone.
    That was a defensive war waged by Christians against Muslim occupiers.

    And no, I don't have to apologize for any of that - I am not Christian.

  58. #658

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    @ PRT Just to add that if one is indigenous one doesn't have to search too far or too long to see the Christian based intolerance, persecution, assimilation waged in this country. Which still occurred during my lifetime in the Christian country we're living in. Looks like reformation didn't work..

    looks like it didn't involve free will and respect for others either..

    Boiled down non secular appears to work better. No matter what religion is silenced.
    Last edited by Replacement; 15-08-2017 at 12:22 PM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  59. #659

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    Try reading "Ornament of the East" -- historical publication on the coexistence of three major religions in Andalusian Spain until the forces backed by the Church took over and massacred everyone.
    That was a defensive war waged by Christians against Muslim occupiers.

    And no, I don't have to apologize for any of that - I am not Christian.
    As I said, whatever justifies your prejudices.

  60. #660

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    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    Try reading "Ornament of the East" -- historical publication on the coexistence of three major religions in Andalusian Spain until the forces backed by the Church took over and massacred everyone.
    That was a defensive war waged by Christians against Muslim occupiers.

    And no, I don't have to apologize for any of that - I am not Christian.
    As I said, whatever justifies your prejudices.
    Its amazing that somebody living in Canada would think that the reformation cured Christianity and that its been all about freewill and respect ever since. An insular Caucasian view if I ever saw one. Perhaps Mr Oilers could avail himself of some Truth and Reconciliation.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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    Faraz, a couple of quick points;
    First, the Spanish Inquisition did not kill "millions of Muslims and Jews". The total number of people killed in the Inquisition was less than 5000. The church kept meticulous records that are a great source today for historical information.
    And, the coexistence of the three major religions under the Muslims in Spain was not peaceful, the Muslims conquered Spain, destroyed the Visigoth empire and financed their conquest through taxation on non-muslims. Their own people were not subject to the same taxes. So while things were relatively stable, it was still the middle ages and it was a dark and brutal time, regardless of your religion.

  62. #662

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    Quote Originally Posted by faraz View Post
    So the Spanish inquisition which killed millions of Muslims and Jews is labeled as against church's teachings (even though the Pope was front and centre of it. ) but ISIS's actions are labeled Islamic?

    Just another way to justify your own prejudice and bias.

    Try reading "Ornament of the East" -- historical publication on the coexistence of three major religions in Andalusian Spain until the forces backed by the Church took over and massacred everyone. But I take it you much prefer Fox News as your source of info.
    Yep.

    You see, the teachings that define Christianity are the teachings of Jesus, called Christ and his immediate disciples. The pope does not define Christianity.

    Meanwhile, the religion formerly known in the west as Mohammedanism has a bunch of stuff written or said by Mohammed. No imam or Ayatollah defines it. if it's consistent with what Mohammed did and said it's pretty well muslim.

    The Reconquista was a gradual reconquest/liberation of spain by Spanish armies and kings over hundreds of years. Roughly 1/3 of spain was ruled by Christian kings prior to crusade-era church supported reconquest becoming a thing. And while some Muslim kingdoms were religiously tolerant it was far from universal - much like in the Christian kingdoms.
    There can only be one.

  63. #663

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    An insular Caucasian view if I ever saw one.
    Yes, because there are no black, Asian, Central American, Middle-Eastern, nor South American Christians. Christians are only white.

    Take a hike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    Does anyone have a video of the press conference where Trump is asked to speak out about the attack, and just walks away? He might as well put out a letter of endorsement at this point.

    Yup, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lZXOIb2o9o
    Meanwhile:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7894271.html
    Charlottesville: Donald Trump quietly slashed funds to groups fighting white supremacy months ago
    Actions speak louder than those incredibly delayed words.

  65. #665

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    An insular Caucasian view if I ever saw one.
    Yes, because there are no black, Asian, Central American, Middle-Eastern, nor South American Christians. Christians are only white.

    Take a hike.
    Was waiting for the ultimate no argument reaction where you just respond with **** off.

    Look, YOU were the one, being a Canadian at that, who chose to specifically cite Christian reformation, that it is inclusive, respectful, and allowed others free will. You made that amazingly incongruent and sweeping generalization while being a Canadian. When brought to your attention how absolutely inane those comments are your response is take a hike and you bury your head back in the sand.

    Nor did I state the above. I inferred that YOU are Caucasian and insular. I doubt I'm wrong on that part either.

    All that said you are conscious you are wrong and intentionally miswording that which I stated is obviously more indication of that. You know this, you would be calling out the same.
    Last edited by Replacement; 15-08-2017 at 02:00 PM.
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  66. #666

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    An insular Caucasian view if I ever saw one.
    Yes, because there are no black, Asian, Central American, Middle-Eastern, nor South American Christians. Christians are only white.

    Take a hike.

    Yes, because there are no black, Asian, Central American, North American, nor South American Muslims. Muslims are only terrorists.

    Take a hike.
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  67. #667

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    An insular Caucasian view if I ever saw one.
    Yes, because there are no black, Asian, Central American, Middle-Eastern, nor South American Christians. Christians are only white.

    Take a hike.

    Yes, because there are no black, Asian, Central American, North American, nor South American Muslims. Muslims are only terrorists.

    Take a hike.
    If somebody hijacked an account and was trying to make the person sound illogical they would be stating what Mr Oilers has stated. Its simply flailing away at this point. I think its clear as well when someone is reacting instead of reasonably responding. I don't think he's even so much as thinking for an instant before sending.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  68. #668

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    There is no Christian doctrine even close to Islam's pronouncement of death for apostates, for example. Things like the Spanish inquisition and various persecutions of heretics through history are at odds with actual Christian teachings and were rooted in either nationalist fervor where part of the national identity is "Christian", or in maintaining the power of an establishment church and it's royal allies.

    Which is where 15th century spain and today's USA are similar.
    Yeah, nowhere in the Bible does it tell people to kill non-believers.

    Nowhere at all.

    Except, for example, Deuteronomy 13:6-10

    6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
    Yeah, nowhere at all.

    Except also in 2 Chronicles 15:13
    “All who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman.”

    There's lots more places where Christianity "doesn't" call for non believers to be put to death.

  69. #669

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    Will Donald resign or be indited first?
    Longtime Trump business partner ‘told family he knows he and POTUS are going to prison’: report

    Felix Sater, one of Donald Trump’s shadiest former business partners, is reportedly preparing for prison time — and he says the president will be joining him behind bars.


    Sources told The Spectator‘s Paul Wood that Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s deep dive into Trump’s business practices may be yielding results.


    Trump recently made remarks that could point to a money laundering scheme, Wood reported.


    “I mean, it’s possible there’s a condo or something, so, you know, I sell a lot of condo units, and somebody from Russia buys a condo, who knows?” the president said.


    Sater, who has a long history of legal troubles and is cooperating with law enforcement, was one of the major players responsible for selling Trump’s condos to the Russians.


    And according to Wood’s sources, Sater may have already flipped and given prosecutors the evidence they need to make a case against Trump.

    http://www.rawstory.com/2017/08/long...prison-report/

  70. #670

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    At least 12 dead and 50 injured as van runs over crowd of people in Barcelona. The 2 suspects are radical Muslims.

    Will the left condemn this attack, or will they revert back to, "If you call them that, that's what they'll do"?

  71. #671

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    Are you that stupid? What does the attack in Barcelona have to do with Trump or immigration, or building walls?? Or are you grasping for straws as much as possible?

  72. #672

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    Sorry, I didn't know we couldn't talk about Islamic terror attacks in a discussion thread about immigration (a major point in Donald Trump's election campaign).


    (The alt-left is very angry these days! So much hate!)

  73. #673
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    I'm not sure, I'll have to wait for the facts to come out. Some of those beach goers looked pretty dark skinned to me. And it's Spain, afterall. Probably radical Communists. I'm not saying they all were. There were very fine people on both sides; they're not all bad by any means. But those radical Communists are some bad hombres, let me tell you. And wasn't it a weekday over there? What were they doing crowding a beach? Shouldn't they be working? Believe me, those Communists were not up to any good.

  74. #674

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    I'm not sure, I'll have to wait for the facts to come out.
    That's OK. Take your time. Don't want to misplace any blame whenever there is such an awful tragedy, but the suspects have been caught, and ISIS has claimed responsibility. But you can denounce it when you feel ready - I won't judge.

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    You realize he's mocking Trump right?

  76. #676
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    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    You realize he's mocking Trump right?
    Yeah, not that he needs much help. In his tweets about Barcelona, he once again rehashed a myth: http://www.businessinsider.com/trump...-attack-2017-8

    Muslims? Lightning quick condemnation, followed by a false anecdote to hammer in how they're basically sub-human and should be treated as such. Neo-Nazis? Whoa whoa whoa, let's not be so quick to judge here. Not everyone marching with those Nazis are themselves Nazis. Both sides! Both sides!

  77. #677

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    Trump is always taking credit when the stock market goes up.

    So you Trump supporters, why did the market take a tumble today? Let me guess, nothing that Trump did right...

    Or the new standby, "I'm not sure, I'll have to wait for the facts to come out."
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  78. #678

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    Unless he thinks Muslims or Mexicans are involved...

  79. #679

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    You realize he's mocking Trump right?
    Yeah, not that he needs much help. In his tweets about Barcelona, he once again rehashed a myth: http://www.businessinsider.com/trump...-attack-2017-8

    Muslims? Lightning quick condemnation, followed by a false anecdote to hammer in how they're basically sub-human and should be treated as such. Neo-Nazis? Whoa whoa whoa, let's not be so quick to judge here. Not everyone marching with those Nazis are themselves Nazis. Both sides! Both sides!
    The President of Hate needs 48 hours of notice to change his tune 3 times when it involves his base supporters.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  80. #680

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    First Trump is criticized for not saying something quickly enough. Now the anti-Trumpers are attacking him for responding too quickly.

    He'll never win them over.

  81. #681

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    How the alt left media pushes their propaganda to sway public opinion:



  82. #682

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    First Trump is criticized for not saying something quickly enough. Now the anti-Trumpers are attacking him for responding too quickly.

    He'll never win them over.
    Wrong again.

    Trump was criticized for not saying anything quickly enough, and then later criticized for supporting the nazis and white supremacists.

    He'll never win them over. His approval rating shows that even his most staunch supporters are starting to question their support of him. 34% and falling quick.

  83. #683

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    The Trump Dream Team of just a few months ago.

    They must be so tired of winning...



    Losers...

    This is the photograph, taken under seven months ago, that shows just how much Donald Trump's administration has rapidly changed.
    Taken on 28 January, it shows Trump's inner circle as he received a congratulatory phone call from Russian President Vladimir Putin following his inauguration.
    On Friday, Steve Bannon became the latest casualty, added to a growing list of departures. But where are Trump and his closest allies now?
    source BBC news

    Answer: The Russians of course!
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 18-08-2017 at 06:39 PM.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  84. #684

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    "Trump on the phone, talking to his boss."

  85. #685

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    Reaction from The American Conservative on Trump's Afghanistan speech. He also calls him out for his historical revisionism on Iraq.

    Trump’s Awful Afghanistan Speech

    Unless the U.S. intends to make Afghanistan its permanent ward and wishes to be at war there forever, there is no compelling reason for a continued American military presence. Nothing in Trump’s speech provided such a reason. He embraced the sunk cost fallacy (“our nation must seek an honorable and enduring outcome worthy of the tremendous sacrifices that have been made”), and ignored that throwing away more lives on a failed war is far worse than cutting our losses. He indulged the safe haven myth, according to which the U.S. must police countries on the other side of the earth without end for fear that they might give shelter to terrorists if we do not. These are all very familiar and cliched assumptions by now, and they are wrong. We can’t rationally weigh costs and benefits of a war that can’t end unless it somehow redeems the losses already suffered, and Afghanistan is never going to be made secure enough at an acceptable cost to eliminate the possibility that some part of its territory might play host to jihadists. Trump calls his approach “principled realism,” but as usual it is neither principled nor realist.


    Trump defined the mission as “killing terrorists,” which practically guarantees that more terrorists will be created in the process and ensures that the mission will never end. There have been higher numbers of civilian casualties in Iraq and Syria since Trump took office, and Trump’s statement that he “lifted restrictions the previous administration placed on our warfighters” promises that the same will happen in Afghanistan. He also made a rather alarming statement, saying “that no place is beyond the reach of American might and Americans arms.” That reflects a potentially very dangerous contempt for the sovereignty of other states that could easily blow up in our faces.

    http://www.theamericanconservative.c...nistan-speech/




  86. #686

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    I'm not sure, I'll have to wait for the facts to come out. Some of those beach goers looked pretty dark skinned to me. And it's Spain, afterall. Probably radical Communists. I'm not saying they all were. There were very fine people on both sides; they're not all bad by any means. But those radical Communists are some bad hombres, let me tell you. And wasn't it a weekday over there? What were they doing crowding a beach? Shouldn't they be working? Believe me, those Communists were not up to any good.
    So Marcel, with unfettered borders and a general feeling of 'everyone welcome' how many undocumented refugees have you welcomed into your home?. I wonder how many PTR has under his roof, noodle and others. After all you would be hero's if you did that.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    So Marcel, with unfettered borders and a general feeling of 'everyone welcome' how many undocumented refugees have you welcomed into your home?. I wonder how many PTR has under his roof, noodle and others. After all you would be hero's if you did that.
    Nice strawman. Where have I ever said that we should have open borders and just let anyone and everyone in?

    My extended family did sponsor a refugee family, however, with various relatives contributing clothes, furniture, and the like. I wasn't overly involved, but I did donate cash to help them get started in their new life here. From what I understand, they haven't suicide bombed anything. Shocking, I know.

  88. #688

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    ^All this and not even answered the direct question. Nice deflect, if it were an Olympic sport you would have got a 10.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  89. #689

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    Not answering stupid questions based on mischaracterizations is OK.

    Also, how long have you been a cannibal?
    There can only be one.

  90. #690

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    ^................and your point is?............
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  91. #691
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    Pointing out how ludicrous your original question is.

  92. #692

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    ^................and your point is?............
    To show how ignorant you are.

  93. #693

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    Last night Trump tried to re-energize his base and it seems that the message was heard loud and clear.

    White Supremacists Celebrate President Trump's Rally in Phoenix

    White supremacist James Allsup, who marched at the neo-Nazi rally in Charlottesville and recently resigned as the head of the College Republicans at Washington State University, tweeted the quotes from Trump that were clearly heard as dog whistles.



    Later, James Allsup tweeted another rough quote from Trump, “Recapture our destiny. Rebuild our future. Our values will endure.” A follower tweeted back, “Was this the first official ‘alt-Right’ presidential rally?? Feels good man!”

    http://gizmodo.com/white-supremacist...-in-1798336898

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    Trump still hasn't accepted Mexicos offer for aid.
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7917716.html

    What a child. Gotta show Mexico you're mad at them for not building your wall, at the expense of your own citizens.

  95. #695

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Last night Trump tried to re-energize his base and it seems that the message was heard loud and clear.

    White Supremacists Celebrate President Trump's Rally in Phoenix

    White supremacist James Allsup, who marched at the neo-Nazi rally in Charlottesville and recently resigned as the head of the College Republicans at Washington State University, tweeted the quotes from Trump that were clearly heard as dog whistles.



    Later, James Allsup tweeted another rough quote from Trump, “Recapture our destiny. Rebuild our future. Our values will endure.” A follower tweeted back, “Was this the first official ‘alt-Right’ presidential rally?? Feels good man!”

    http://gizmodo.com/white-supremacist...-in-1798336898


    WOW! Are people seriously trying to pick out subliminal messages in Trump's speeches in an attempt to prove he's racist?


    If this is what concerns the left these days, a re-election in 2020 is going to be a cakewalk.

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    There is nothing subliminal about what Trump has been doing. It's all been quite liminal. The white supremacists can see it just fine. The center, left, and even most of the right and Republican party can see it just fine. Why then are you so blind to it?

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/opinion/donal...book-1.4265374

    Trump then said: "You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name."

    Now. Look at those last three words: "to another name." Donald Trump, president of the United States, not only thought there were fine people among the white supremacist marchers, he refused to say "Emancipation Park."

    Some might argue that this president is just too dim to know the park's new name, but remember, Trump emphasized that he waited a few days in order to collect all the facts. Presumably, this Ivy League-educated president, who has access to the most knowledgeable advisers and who by his own word took the time to gather all the facts, knew the park's new name and just couldn't bring himself to say it.

  97. #697

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    Trump treats Texas disaster like a campaign rally. It's always got to be about him and how everything is magically better because it happens during a Trump administration.

    Trump Won’t Stop Treating Harvey Like a Campaign Rally

    “What a crowd, what a turnout.”

    http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...ampaign-rally/

  98. #698

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    The center, left, and even most of the right and Republican party can see it just fine.
    No, the liberal media is pushing that angle, but nobody but the far left is actually buying it. Everybody distances themselves from the minority far-right racist groups.

  99. #699

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Trump treats Texas disaster like a campaign rally. It's always got to be about him and how everything is magically better because it happens during a Trump administration.

    Trump Won’t Stop Treating Harvey Like a Campaign Rally

    “What a crowd, what a turnout.”

    http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...ampaign-rally/

    Whether you like it or not, he is loved by a lot of people.

    This is what the streets looked like to welcome his motorcade:


  100. #700

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Trump treats Texas disaster like a campaign rally. It's always got to be about him and how everything is magically better because it happens during a Trump administration.

    Trump Won’t Stop Treating Harvey Like a Campaign Rally

    “What a crowd, what a turnout.”

    http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...ampaign-rally/
    Like this Mother Jones rag/blog is the epitome of political knowledge.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

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