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Thread: Trump Effect - Household Income Hits 15-Year High

  1. #101

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    But let's just let the crops rot in the fields. That'll show 'em!

    Alabama immigration: crops rot as workers vanish to avoid crackdown
    The day before harsh new laws came into effect, Brian Cash had 65 Hispanic men picking tomatoes. Now he has none
    Cash says that losing his pickers is much more than a commercial disaster. "Many of these people are friends and like family to us. They have been working for my family for years."


    The crew leader for Cash's fields has been working for his family for 17 years. "He's my age and we pretty much grew up together," he says.


    Cash has sponsored him in his application for American naturalisation – a process that the immigration authorities have said will take up to nine years and cost up to $17,000.


    The crew leader already has permanent residency status and his two children are US citizens, but because his wife is undocumented he was fearful of the new law and left abruptly along with the others the minute the provisions came in.


    Cash gets angry when people tell him that his Hispanic workforce was taking jobs away from Americans. Since the new law began two weeks ago only two American citizens have come by his farm asking for work.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...on-law-workers



  2. #102

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    So you prefer seeing slaves working the plantations?

    To each their own.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Those aren't high wages, but arguing that the solution is to hire illegals to do it instead is actually kind of racist.
    Ya it's stupid. I had an illegal Brit on a jobsite once and immigration and the RCMP hauled him off. He was deported directly. He had even bought a house here. Canada upholds the laws why can't DT
    FYI, two out of every three Haitians coming into Canada from the US are being deported.
    Exactly what I said. Canada upholds it's immigration laws, why can't Donald Trump

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    You obviously have never owned a business of any size. It can be very difficult to find help. Without help you don't have a business. Donald Trump was never against immigration or legal workers from abroad. He was against illegal aliens , people sneaking in across the borders by the millions and being in the country illegally, working illegally, not paying taxes and generally using the system. Get your facts straight.
    Well you are wrong. I have three companies. I have hired many people over the years and never had to resort to sourcing foreigners on work visas.

    It may be legal to do so but flies in the face of what Trump yells at the top of his lungs. He does not practice what he preachs. Rather than hiring local people, he brings in foreign workers. And he gets his line of Trump clothing made in Mexico, China and other foreign countries with low wages.

    Get YOUR facts straight!
    I've had a lot of people working for me over the years too, never had problems and paid higher wages or by contract but that's the trades not restaurant and golf course workers. There is not much of a margin, why do you think Tim's and the others have all the Filipinos and others. It's because selling coffee and doughnuts is not the same margin as construction contracts. Nothing will register with you. Just plain hard headed. Do you think he pays his electricians and mechanical contractors $10 to $20. No he sure does not. It's just not the same thing. If he paid restaurant workers and housekeepers $25 or $40 bucks an hour he would no longer have those particular businesses as they would be bankrupt. Same goes for Tim's and the others.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 08-08-2017 at 12:06 PM.

  5. #105

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    No, Trump hires contractors and then after paying them half of what the contract calls for just stops paying them. Time after time after time....

    Trump D.C. Hotel Contractors Say They're Owed Millions

    During a ribbon-cutting ceremony, Trump told the crowd that the two-year, roughly $200 million renovation project at the historic Old Post Office Building was done ahead of schedule and under budget, thanks to what he called an incredible team of people — "including hundreds of construction workers, electricians, maintenance workers and so many others who helped make this project a reality. They're really the important ones."


    Now some of those companies would like final payment for their work. Documents obtained by NPR show three Washington-area companies have filed liens against Trump International Hotel totaling more than $5 million.


    One company, Joseph J. Magnolia Inc., filed a $2.98 million mechanic's lien in December. According to the filing, the firm worked on the hotel from September 2014 to December 2016 and "completed all plumbing, mechanical and HVAC work, along with site sewer, water, storm and water services."

    http://www.npr.org/2017/01/11/509168...-owed-millions
    And

    'He's a crook!'; 'Little guy' contractors lost millions after Trump's Taj casino went bankrupt
    'If ethics or morality has nothing to do with business, he's a very good businessman'



    A quarter of a century had passed since Donald Trump refused to pay US$1.2 million for the paving stones her late husband installed at Atlantic City's Taj Mahal casino. But for Paone and others like her -- the dozens of contractors and their families who never got all they were owed -- it could have happened yesterday.


    The contractor who provided the onion domes atop the Taj had to eat $2 million in losses. The contractor who supplied the Carrara marble from Italy ended up filing for personal bankruptcy. The contractor who put in the bathroom partitions had to lay off his brother.

    ---

    After the Taj opened in April 1990, the self-anointed "King of Debt" owed $70 million to 253 contractors employing thousands who built the domes and minarets, put up the glass and drywall, laid the pipes and installed everything from chandeliers to bathroom fixtures. A year later, when the casino collapsed into bankruptcy, those owed the most got only 33 cents in cash for each dollar owed, with promises of another 50 cents later. It took years to get the rest, assuming the companies survived long enough to collect.

    http://www.torontosun.com/2016/06/29...-went-bankrupt


    And


    TRUMP ACCUSED OF ROUTINELY STIFFING HIS OWN EMPLOYEES
    Thousands of complaints allege the billionaire failed to pay workers what he owed.

    According to a USA Today investigation, Trump has received at least 3,500 official complaints for failing to pay employees, contractors, and other business affiliates money owed. The paper also found at least 60 lawsuits, 24 instances where Trump failed to pay overtime and minimum wage, and countless out-of-court settlements. Among those to whom Trump owed money, according to USA Today: dishwashers, bartenders, painters, real-estate brokers, and ironically, even his own lawyers. In 1990, a casino commission audit of the Trump Taj Mahal, then about to open, revealed that Trump owed an astounding $69.5 million to 253 subcontractors. Marty Rosenberg, the owner of a plate glass company who was owed $1.5 million, said that he was only able to recover 70 cents on the dollar for his work, and that he was one of the lucky ones. “Yes, there were a lot of other companies. . . Yes, some did not survive,” he told USA Today.

    https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016...it-contractors
    But, to those on the right, it just makes him a smart businessman.

  6. #106

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    Tell me again how good Trump is for the stock market? Even splitting the blame, they're both on the hook for $500,000,000,000

    Nuclear Fears Wipe $1 Trillion Off Global Stock Markets
    Threats of global cataclysm tend not to inspire market confidence.


    LONDON, Aug 11 (Reuters) - The damage inflicted on world stocks this week by the escalating war of words over North Korea topped US$1 trillion (C$1.27 trillion) on Friday, as investors again took cover in the yen, the Swiss franc, gold and government bonds.


    With the tense mood pushing European shares down for a third day and Wall Street set to fall again, global stocks were on course for their worst week since Donald Trump won November's U.S. presidential election.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/08...ef=ca-homepage

  7. #107

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    Think of how bad the stock market would be after NK's threats without having all those gains already!

  8. #108

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    From that well known lefty business mag, Forbes.

    Donald Trump Is Beginning To Lose To Obama In His Favorite Metric: Stock Market Performance

    President Donald Trump is beginning to fall behind his predecessor President Barack Obama on one key gauge of his agenda: The stock market.


    From Trump's Inauguration Day to present, the S&P 500 Index has gained around 7%. That's less than a third of the 25% gain the S&P posted over the same horizon after Obama took office in 2009. Going forward Trump, who ran on an agenda of business-friendly policies such as tax cuts and deregulation, may find Obama a tough foe when it comes to stock market gains.


    During Obama's eight years in office, the S&P 500 returned 235% or 16.4% annually, one of the best performances of any recent president, as markets recovered from the carnage of the financial crisis and the U.S. economy emerged from the "Great Recession." By the time he left office, Obama's stock market performance was in-line with gains posted under President Ronald Reagan amid a curbing of inflation, a revival of growth and the market's quick recovery from the 1987 crash. President Bill Clinton holds the mantle for the biggest gains of any recent president, having held office during the technology boom of the 1990s.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/antoine.../#53c500e46a51



    And this:

    Donald Trump wipes $5.7bn off the value of Amazon with single tweet

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/bu...-a7896266.html

  9. #109

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    Unemployment dropping significantly in states that Trump flipped - Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Iowa, Ohio, and Florida.

    https://archive.fo/kow8m


    If this keeps up, 2020 is a lock for him.

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    That was definitely all due to Obama

  11. #111

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    US revised second-quarter GDP up 3.0%

    https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/30/us-r...arter-gdp.html


    The GDP never reached 3% during Obama's presidency.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    US revised second-quarter GDP up 3.0%

    https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/30/us-r...arter-gdp.html


    The GDP never reached 3% during Obama's presidency.
    Do you lie out of sheer ignorance, or mendacity?

    https://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/nat...gdp_glance.htm

    Quarterly GDP was above 3% in Q3 and Q4 2013, Q2 and Q3 2014, and Q1 2015. And that's only going back to halfway through 2013, which is barely a third of his presidency.

  13. #113

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    Some here lie because of the money. Some because they're maniacally partisan. Some simply enjoy the perfidious trolling opportunity that anonymity bestows. Though, after a certain level of inanity/impotence/incompetence, the ROI has got to be worth walking away from.

    Don't you agree, Hypocrisy League?

  14. #114
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    No response, MrOilers? Have you no sense of shame or embarrassment in how you repeatedly post falsehoods? Also, it's worth reminding you that Canadian GDP in the second quarter was up by 4.5%, annualized. Once again, I find it odd that you're not trumpeting that. Pun intended.

  15. #115

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    Why fill this thread, or any other, with this nonsense? Just to see who can whiz farther? Quit taking the bait! You're not going to convince anyone, or "correct" or "teach" them, even yourselves. MrOilers has clearly won because he's got y'all giving him attention, arguing about a lifelong attention wh0re.
    I am in no way entitled to your opinion...

  16. #116

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Canadian GDP in the second quarter was up by 4.5%, annualized. Once again, I find it odd that you're not trumpeting that.
    Why is that odd? This is the US politics thread, not Canada's.


    But on that note, thank goodness Paul Martin's Liberal and Stephen Harper's Conservative governments were more responsible so that Canada didn't have to suffer the nightmare of the US economy under Dubya and Obama.

  17. #117

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    U.S. ends fiscal 2017 with $666 billion budget deficit - MarketWatch

    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-...cit-2017-10-20

  18. #118

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    That was definitely all due to Trump.

    With a deficit, best thing to do is to cut revenue by reducing taxes.
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  19. #119
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    666, the mark of the devil. Someone must be scripting this stuff.

  20. #120

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    666, the mark of the devil. Someone must be scripting this stuff.
    “The devil you say”


  21. #121

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    Credit Trump for boosting business and fueling our economic growth

    http://thehill.com/opinion/white-hou...conomic-growth


    Unable to credibly ignore this economic surge, the current tactic for progressive Democrats is to deny its cause. Congresswoman Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) recently stated that Trump deserves “absolutely” no credit for the growing economy because he has yet to pass “any legislation,” has not been “involved in public policy” and “doesn’t know really what’s going on on Wall Street.” While few people look to Representative Waters for economic guidance, CNN’s global economic analyst Rana Foroohar claimed, “We’ve fact checked the fact that Donald Trump does not deserve credit for anything good that has happened in the American economy in the last six months.”

    This “Trump gets no credit” approach says a lot about how poorly progressive Democrats understand what drives economic growth. It isn’t more government; its less. In his first nine months, President Trump has taken a machete to the Obama era’s rules and regulations that have been choking American businesses like parasitic vines. In fact, a recent analysis by the Competitive Enterprise Institute (CEI), a libertarian think tank, found that Trump is deregulating the economy at a pace no other president ever has.

  22. #122

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    Don Jr. obviously doesn't read.

    Donald Trump Jr screws up and makes Thanksgiving even worse for Donald Trump

    Donald Trump Jr – who has blocked Palmer Report on Twitter because we keep calling him out on these kinds of things – thought he was being clever by posting a link to a new article from the Economist. He braggingly tweeted “You know you’re winning when even the Economist acknowledges POTUS is making things work for the middle class as promised.” The trouble: he clearly didn’t read the Economist article in question before he posted a link to it.

    Here’s a sampling of what the Economist article actually says about the U.S. economy under Donald Trump: “Has Mr Trump kept his promise to revive American manufacturing, mining and the like? A more probable explanation is that he came to office just as America began to run out of willing workers to fill all of its job vacancies.” (link). In other words, the article is acknowledging that the U.S. economy was built up under President Obama, and now Trump just sort of happens to be there.

    http://www.palmerreport.com/politics/jr-screws-up/6186/

  23. #123

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Don Jr. obviously doesn't read.

    Donald Trump Jr screws up and makes Thanksgiving even worse for Donald Trump

    Donald Trump Jr – who has blocked Palmer Report on Twitter because we keep calling him out on these kinds of things – thought he was being clever by posting a link to a new article from the Economist. He braggingly tweeted “You know you’re winning when even the Economist acknowledges POTUS is making things work for the middle class as promised.” The trouble: he clearly didn’t read the Economist article in question before he posted a link to it.

    Here’s a sampling of what the Economist article actually says about the U.S. economy under Donald Trump: “Has Mr Trump kept his promise to revive American manufacturing, mining and the like? A more probable explanation is that he came to office just as America began to run out of willing workers to fill all of its job vacancies.” (link). In other words, the article is acknowledging that the U.S. economy was built up under President Obama, and now Trump just sort of happens to be there.

    http://www.palmerreport.com/politics/jr-screws-up/6186/
    Well not the Economist apparently, but I wouldn't say he's doesn't read at all. He seems more like a comic book guy.

  24. #124

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    Most often the doom and gloom forecasts don’t materialize - not as predicted anyway.

    The Brexit fearmongers had it being disastrous too.




    UK stock markets close at a record high - BBC News

    “US stock markets have also hit new peaks over the year, helped by Donald Trump's sweeping tax reforms.
    Stephen Eckett, author of the annual Harriman Stock Market Almanac, said: "All the dangers that were anticipated with a Trump administration haven't materialised." “

    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-42512023

  25. #125

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    Trump still trying to ride the Stock Market as his baby. If it slumps in 2018, how will he distance himself from the loses?
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  26. #126

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    The left for the majority will not credit trump. Even after 24000 pts on the Dow there were articles crediting Obama.

    it has been a HUGE spike 25%? In 1 year. With most spikes do come dips eventually, when ;it's hard to say. Even if America engages in full out war this will not stop this confidence train. 2018 will be another banner year even if the Dow " only" goes to 27000 pts and maintains.

    If the market comes down all the knives will be out and will be trumps fault. There is an information war going on right now. Multiple Academic papers being released one notably from Harvard showing Trump getting 90+ percent coverage that was negative through media outlets. Mainstream media untill the very last minute would not admit Trump even had a chance of winning the election and this was supported by hundreds of polling numbers through research firms supposedly independent. This same media is claiming constantly Trump does not have the support of the American people but there are so many aspects that say otherwise one being the stock market and business confidence levels and employee confidence levels .

  27. #127

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    Putin's got great numbers too! The best!

  28. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    The left for the majority will not credit trump. Even after 24000 pts on the Dow there were articles crediting Obama.

    it has been a HUGE spike 25%? In 1 year. With most spikes do come dips eventually, when ;it's hard to say. Even if America engages in full out war this will not stop this confidence train. 2018 will be another banner year even if the Dow " only" goes to 27000 pts and maintains.

    If the market comes down all the knives will be out and will be trumps fault. There is an information war going on right now. Multiple Academic papers being released one notably from Harvard showing Trump getting 90+ percent coverage that was negative through media outlets. Mainstream media untill the very last minute would not admit Trump even had a chance of winning the election and this was supported by hundreds of polling numbers through research firms supposedly independent. This same media is claiming constantly Trump does not have the support of the American people but there are so many aspects that say otherwise one being the stock market and business confidence levels and employee confidence levels .
    Reality Check


    I still chuckle when Trump states that he "inherited a mess". If a mess is a rising stock market, low unemployment and a growing economy, as of Jan 20th 2017, what would he have done if he became President in Jan 20th, 2009 when another guy took over and inherited G.W. Bush's mess?


    Have a look at this chart that compares past Presidents to Trump. It shows that Trump lags Obama in increasing the Stock Market performance in the first 11 months in office.
    Obama, 30.3%
    Trump 25.0%
    Clinton 13.4%
    Reagan -7.6%
    G.W. Bush -8.0%

    http://www.macrotrends.net/2481/stoc...e-by-president

    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 29-12-2017 at 10:56 AM.
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  29. #129

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    Good point.

    can we compare apples to apples though? Obama inherited an economy in the deepest recession since the Great Depression, hence the moniker " the Great Recession". With the shear amount of public dollar spent in his entire 8 years as president he doubled the national debt which took 43 previous presidents to spend. The taps were already open from bush however Obama spent trillions, with round after round of quantitative easing, enabling the rich to get filthy rich.

    Now we could say the taps are still open from obama and trump era is seeing stimulus which we could not entirely overlook. He is definitely trying pretty hard to close taps, spend less in some aspects, tax cuts etc. Trump era economy was not in the bottom of a recession. It's plateaued maybe a small amount of growth or typical for the last decade 1.5 ( just throwing a number under2%)percent GDP growth . Trump era economy is climbing off of what America has accepted as steady "growth " from Obama era.

    Selective charts are as bad as the article in the financial post today claiming record growth in Canadian dollar. While it may be true to a point it hasn't appreciated our dollar in a wholly way only from the depths of the bottom

  30. #130

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    Trump is the only guy who could run a casino into bankruptcy...
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  31. #131

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    4 casinos - he's that good
    I am in no way entitled to your opinion...

  32. #132

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    One of a select few in USA history to become a president. No matter what y'all do in life, never will you accomplish half of what trump has done; good or bad. Mediocre is what describes majority of people

  33. #133

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    Fixed that for you

    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    One of a select few in German history to become a Führer. No matter what y'all do in life, never will you accomplish half of what Hitler has done; good or bad. Mediocre is what describes majority of people
    See, it still works.

  34. #134

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    You must have a mental condition, comparisons like this are unfounded and very ignorant to the Jewish people

  35. #135

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    One of a select few in USA history to become a president. No matter what y'all do in life, never will you accomplish half of what trump has done; good or bad. Mediocre is what describes majority of people
    you are right.



    Nobody fails better than Trump, HUGE!
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 29-12-2017 at 01:30 PM.
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  36. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    One of a select few in USA history to become a president. No matter what y'all do in life, never will you accomplish half of what trump has done; good or bad. Mediocre is what describes majority of people
    and even fewer are selected to be president of indonesia or the philipines or zaire but suharto and marcos and seco all managed the feat. and all were pretty despicable examples of humanity.

    if simply securing the office is the sole criteria and performance counts for naught, i'll take the mediocre majority thank you very much.

    as with others who have attained the title of president or prime minister or chancellor or fuhrer or general secretary of the central committee or chairman, the current president of the united states will be judged on his legacy after he has left office, not for securing it and i for one will be happy never to be compared to the donald either before or after his securing it.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  37. #137

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    You must have a mental condition, comparisons like this are unfounded and very ignorant to the Jewish people
    Merely pointing out that rising to the top of a country politically does not mean that you're a good leader. And I'll tell my great grand parents on my father's side that you think I'm being unfair to them.

  38. #138

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    One of a select few in USA history to become a president. No matter what y'all do in life, never will you accomplish half of what trump has done; good or bad. Mediocre is what describes majority of people
    and even fewer are selected to be president of indonesia or the philipines or zaire but suharto and marcos and seco all managed the feat. and all were pretty despicable examples of humanity.

    if simply securing the office is the sole criteria and performance counts for naught, i'll take the mediocre majority thank you very much.

    as with others who have attained the title of president or prime minister or chancellor or fuhrer or general secretary of the central committee or chairman, the current president of the united states will be judged on his legacy after he has left office, not for securing it and i for one will be happy never to be compared to the donald either before or after his securing it.
    Well said.

    Gotta get that "Like" button back...
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  39. #139

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    People who call others down, like here is amazing. Such judgement, from what I can tell arguments against trump are merely deflections, and always reactive. Love to see how pure arm chair posters lives are? Let me pick apart your lives? Seems like many against trump are boiling with hatred, life is to short for that,

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    People who call others down, like here is amazing. Such judgement, from what I can tell arguments against trump are merely deflections, and always reactive. Love to see how pure arm chair posters lives are? Let me pick apart your lives? Seems like many against trump are boiling with hatred, life is to short for that,
    well if that isn't textbook deflection, i don't know what is...

    as for your "challenge", let me know if you want a cv and personal and business references in addition to what's publicly available already on linkedin and elsewhere. i'll be happy to send them to any identifiable e-mail address you care to provide by private message or otherwise.

    PS. i was always a believer in the american doctrine that "the office made the president", not the other way around, and 14 months ago was prepared to give the donald the benefit of a doubt. it would appear, however, that the donald will be the first american president to truly put that myth to bed.
    Last edited by kcantor; 29-12-2017 at 02:28 PM.
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  41. #141

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    People who call others down, like here is amazing. Such judgement, from what I can tell arguments against trump are merely deflections, and always reactive. Love to see how pure arm chair posters lives are? Let me pick apart your lives? Seems like many against trump are boiling with hatred, life is to short for that,
    Keep drinking the Trump Kool-Aid
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  42. #142

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    Yeah, The Donald is full of the milk of human kindness.






    "Look at that face," the real estate mogul turned Republican frontrunner is quoted as saying of Mrs Fiorina. "Would anyone vote for that?"


    "Can you imagine that, the face of our next next president?" Mr Trump continued. "I mean, she's a woman, and I'm not s'posedta say bad things, but really, folks, come on. Are we serious?"

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-for-that.html


    Back when George HW Bush was US President, Trump spoke to Esquire magazine about the media: "You know, it doesn't really matter what [they] write as long as you've got a young and beautiful piece of ***."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/pol...-in-one-place/
    And, of course....
    “I’ve gotta use some tic tacs, just in case I start kissing her. You know I’m automatically attracted to beautiful - I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait.”


    “And when you’re a star they let you do it,” Trump says. “You can do anything.”


    “Whatever you want,” says another voice, apparently Bush’s.


    “Grab them by the p----,” Trump says. “You can do anything.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...e-a-star-they/
    But you're right. People are just jealous of him.

  43. #143

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    im willing to have a conversation, kcantor you seem like a person I could sit,drink a pint and have a conversation. My opinion is broad, I'm not stuck in one train of thought, I'm open to sway if reasonable arguments are made. I will finish with an opinion that there are alot of people who try to speak loader and stronger and therefore the other side becomes silent. I commented here to give an opinion,which I do not do much. I will fade away maybe because I'm not educated enough to defend myself,I don't like typing,or I feel hopeless even carrying on a conversation that is going to consist of me with my back against a wall.

    The human condition is interesting nonetheless. I judge myself on milestones also, my " resume" and a moral compass( interestingly I've done well given the cards in my life, I cannot and will not try to take anything away from others without a mile in their shoes kinda thing. I'm a firm believer that my opinion is not " right" and neither is the other guys. Life in its simplest way is basic, we are all just trying to get by.

  44. #144

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Most often the doom and gloom forecasts don’t materialize - not as predicted anyway.

    The Brexit fearmongers had it being disastrous too.

    UK stock markets close at a record high - BBC News

    “US stock markets have also hit new peaks over the year, helped by Donald Trump's sweeping tax reforms.
    Stephen Eckett, author of the annual Harriman Stock Market Almanac, said: "All the dangers that were anticipated with a Trump administration haven't materialised." “

    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-42512023
    I think Brexit is turning out to be the balloon slowly deflating, rather than popping which is what some predicted initially. Lower growth than the rest of Europe, rising inflation, stagnant wages it is not pretty in the UK, but not a sudden crash. It will take time for the large financial firms in London to move staff, find/open new locations in the EU, so right now it is just a trickle but that will increase as the deadline for Brexit nears. London's role as an international financial centre will probably be diminished considerably and that is likely to have economic effects as they are good paying jobs, but I don't know it will superseded by any one city as places like Dublin, Paris and Frankfurt are all attracting some interest and investment.

    There seems to be a disconnect between the political rhetoric in the US, which might lead many to conclude there is more international instability and the markets which seem to be focusing more on the current overall strength of the economy as opposed to what might go wrong. I wonder if this will last in 2018. Markets don't usually take international instability well.

  45. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Most often the doom and gloom forecasts don’t materialize - not as predicted anyway.

    The Brexit fearmongers had it being disastrous too.

    UK stock markets close at a record high - BBC News

    “US stock markets have also hit new peaks over the year, helped by Donald Trump's sweeping tax reforms.
    Stephen Eckett, author of the annual Harriman Stock Market Almanac, said: "All the dangers that were anticipated with a Trump administration haven't materialised." “

    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-42512023
    I think Brexit is turning out to be the balloon slowly deflating, rather than popping which is what some predicted initially. Lower growth than the rest of Europe, rising inflation, stagnant wages it is not pretty in the UK, but not a sudden crash. It will take time for the large financial firms in London to move staff, find/open new locations in the EU, so right now it is just a trickle but that will increase as the deadline for Brexit nears. London's role as an international financial centre will probably be diminished considerably and that is likely to have economic effects as they are good paying jobs, but I don't know it will superseded by any one city as places like Dublin, Paris and Frankfurt are all attracting some interest and investment.

    There seems to be a disconnect between the political rhetoric in the US, which might lead many to conclude there is more international instability and the markets which seem to be focusing more on the current overall strength of the economy as opposed to what might go wrong. I wonder if this will last in 2018. Markets don't usually take international instability well.
    while the american markets have had a [very] good year in isolation, they have been far from the best performing markets worldwide...

    furthermore, when that growth in world wide markets is converted to american dollars from local currencies, they overshadow the american market performance even more as the dollar continues to drop.

    https://www.yardeni.com/pub/peacockglstkytd.pdf
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  46. #146

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Swillv8 View Post
    People who call others down, like here is amazing. Such judgement, from what I can tell arguments against trump are merely deflections, and always reactive. Love to see how pure arm chair posters lives are? Let me pick apart your lives? Seems like many against trump are boiling with hatred, life is to short for that,
    Who pulled the first punch? Did we hate Trump from the start or did he hate others first? If he had come in as an outsider with business acumen, solid points of view, creative solutions and a vision of leadership, many of us would have supported him.

    Instead, he attacked his opponents including other Republican Presidential candidates, with vile mudslinging, propaganda, lies and seeding hatred against others. All the while he boasted his (questionable) accomplishments, changed his positions multiple times and blamed everyone else including Obama, Hillary and the press.

    Then he became President and stated that he would be soooo Presidential that we would be bored.

    Tell me when he has become Presidential?
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  47. #147

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    I love how Trump compares himself with Obama on popularity on this date with a singular Rasmussen poll. Not mentioning that on Dec 28th, 2009 it was the bottom of the Great Recession and Obama was just gaining traction on his policies to overcome the Bush mess. You know, the tendency of the economy to take a year to react to a new administration. Then Trump takes full credit for the past 11 months, even taking credit for all the gains of the past 8 years. Not once but every time he speaks.

    I thought that the "real unemployment rate" was 40% accoring to his statements as a fake candidate.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  48. #148

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    Charlie Munger:


    An Interview with Charlie Munger, Vice Chairman of Berkshire Hathaway – December 20, 2017 | Dr. David Kass


    In this 55 minute University of Michigan Business School interview with Charlie Munger, Charlie imparts 93 years of wisdom including current advice: “Bitcoin is insanity…avoid it like the plague”. (Note: Charlie Munger will be 94 on January 1, 2018.)

    http://blogs.rhsmith.umd.edu/davidka...hatahway-2017/



    ...


    Scott DeRue: Charlie, what I hear you saying is you're not going to be investing in Bitcoin is that that's fair?

    Charlie Munger: It’s fair.

    Scott DeRue: So let me move to a similarly maybe controversial topic but there's a lot of tax policy conversation going on both here in California and nationally as well what's your thoughts on where this ends up in terms of the policy?

    Charlie Munger: I think that we will get a tax bill. I think they will squeak it through and they’ll make whatever adjustments they have to do to get the last few votes. I don't think it's a bit crazy to give this extra $2000 a year to all those people that make $70,000 a year and have a lot of children. That strikes me as good politics and probably good policy. I also do not think it is crazy to reduce the corporate income tax on the C corporation. If you look at the world a lot of the places that work best including Singapore and so forth, have that policy and may even have good macroeconomic consequences. A lot of the people are screaming about it. And are so sure it won't work.

    They may not be right it may actually work pretty well. It causes the capital values of the companies to come up and there's a wealth effect from the increased market value of all the companies. Everybody recognizes there's an effect but some people say it's small and some people say it's going to be large and I'll tell you what they all have in common. None of them knows. It is not totally inconceivable that it would work pretty well and with so much of the world doing well with similar tax policy. And of course, the Democrats go berserk on the subject. I think they're wrong. It may actually help them. I'm not sure it'll work. It may not but it's not totally crazy.

    ...

    https://www.google.ca/amp/www.valuew...r-bitcoin/amp/

    http://www.valuewalk.com/2017/12/cha...unger-bitcoin/


    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=S9HgIGzOENA
    Last edited by KC; 29-12-2017 at 08:13 PM.

  49. #149

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    US Manufacturing Optimism Reaches an All-Time High: https://archive.fo/ZejXq

  50. #150

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    So much winning


    Internet mocks Fox News after it’s forced to admit job growth was stronger under Obama than Trump


    The official monthly jobs report for December 2017 was a disappointment, as the Labor Department estimated that the economy added just 148,000 jobs over the last month.


    And despite the fact that President Donald Trump has bragged about his first year in office being an unqualified economic success, it turns out that average monthly job growth in 2017 was 171,000 jobs per month — which was down significantly from the 187,000 jobs per month that were added in 2016.


    What’s more, the monthly average of 171,000 jobs created in 2017 was actually the lowest average monthly job growth since 2010, when just 88,000 jobs were added per month.


    https://www.rawstory.com/2018/01/int...ma-than-trump/

  51. #151

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    But the tax cuts will boost the economy soooooo much.

    Walmart is reportedly cutting thousands of store co-managers after raising wages

    Walmart is cutting thousands of store manager positions and adding new lower-paid positions, Bloomberg reports.


    The retailer is removing 3,500 salaried co-managers and adding 1,700 assistant store managers.

    http://www.businessinsider.com/walma...-report-2018-1

  52. #152

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    Incomes rising, salaries rising, stock markets (and people's investments, pensions and retirement savings) at all-time highs, unemployment rates falling everywhere, almost everybody keeping their money saved on taxes, millions of new jobs, billions of dollars being repatriated, and the headline you choose to post is about a handful of Wal-Mart jobs lost due to restructuring their management.

  53. #153

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    Wall Street Journal estimates that more than 90% of workers will have bigger take-home pay starting next month under new tax plan.


    https://archive.fo/eHnuk#selection-2105.0-2105.110

  54. #154

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    Fake news!!!!!!!

    Canada is the best; until they tax the crap out of the people like Trudeau and notley they should shut the fucc up

  55. #155

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Wall Street Journal estimates that more than 90% of workers will have bigger take-home pay starting next month under new tax plan.


    https://archive.fo/eHnuk#selection-2105.0-2105.110
    Isn't wall street journal owned and run by murdoch who meets weekly with Trump to discuss propaganda strategies? (The same owner of foxnews?)

  56. #156

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    If they have more take home pay they're still going to end up with less due to the loss of deductions, the expiry of the tax cuts for individuals (corporate cuts are permanent) and rising health care costs due to the undermining of the ACA such as the removal of the Individual Mandate which will allow currently healthy people to give up their insurance, leaving the poor and sick to cover the greater costs.

    But hey, tax cuts! The right's solution for everything. Economy good? Taking too much money, cut taxes. Economy bad? Can't afford taxes, cut them. War (as in Iraq)? Cut the taxes and the war will pay for itself.

  57. #157

  58. #158

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    If they have more take home pay they're still going to end up with less
    So you think that having more money means you have less?

    Does that mean that losing money to higher taxes means you have more?

  59. #159

    Default

    If you get a $1,000 tax break but you lose your health insurance, are you really ahead?

    BTW, those tax breaks are temporary for the voters but permanent for the corporations.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  60. #160

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    Laws can (and do) change.

  61. #161

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    Yeah, that's basically Trump's entire legislative effort: rolling back laws passed by his predecessor who's guilty of the two biggest crimes against the Real America (Presidenting while being a Democrat & the most egregious crime of all, Presidenting while black) regardless of their substance, simply out of spite.

    But that knife cuts both ways.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  62. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    Yeah, that's basically Trump's entire legislative effort: rolling back laws passed by his predecessor who's guilty of the two biggest crimes against the Real America (Presidenting while being a Democrat & the most egregious crime of all, Presidenting while black) regardless of their substance, simply out of spite.

    But that knife cuts both ways.
    i'm starting to think even this might be giving trump too much credit and that his entire presidential legislative agenda is nothing more than pure payback for obama's comedy routine at the white house press dinner in 2011 (an event that used to be private and closed to the public).

    would that be nothing short of petty and vindictive? absolutely. but the donald is well documented as maintaining and elevating high levels of pettiness and vindictiveness for long periods of time.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  63. #163

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    His racist axe to grind predates the press dinner, what with him being a keystone of the whole Birther movement.

    That being said I'm sure it's quite a melange of racism, ignorance, jealousy, petty revenge, & vindictiveness powering his core beliefs & we're both likely in the right. All that's left is semantics & hair-splitting.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  64. #164

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    The ultimate Ugly American.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  65. #165

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    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    Yeah, that's basically Trump's entire legislative effort: rolling back laws passed by his predecessor
    It's one big part of it. The state of the USA deteriorated under Obama's presidency.

  66. #166

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    Yeah, that Obama ruined EVERYTHING. I mean, look at his economic policy's outcome:

    The U.S. economy is in much better shape now than it was in the aftermath of the Great Recession, which cost millions of Americans their homes and jobs and led Obama to push through a roughly $800 billion stimulus package as one of his first orders of business. Unemployment has plummeted from 10% in late 2009 to below 5% today; the Dow Jones Industrial Average has more than doubled.
    http://www.pewresearch.org/2017/01/1...as-presidency/

    The fact you'd outright lie about the economic consequences of the Obama Administration's tenure & falsely ascribe it to Donald Trump is a perfect example of why most of the posters in the politics threads know you're vomiting poop when you purport to be "telling it like it is" just like your role model Trump.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  67. #167

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    Build Obama up all you like (and I know you will), but there was no huge difference between his and Dubya's presidencies. Too much money spent and too much involvement in pointless wars in Middle Eastern countries (and, in the process, turning several of them into shitholes).

  68. #168

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    And Trumps done what with those wars since coming into power just under a year ago?

    (don't forget all the new tension he's brought to the middle east with Israel and the twitter nuclear war he's having with Kim Jong Un... and several other things)

  69. #169

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Build Obama up all you like (and I know you will), but there was no huge difference between his and Dubya's presidencies.
    Yeah, now you're clearly completely divorced from reality.

    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  70. #170

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    And Trumps done what with those wars since coming into power just under a year ago?

    (don't forget all the new tension he's brought to the middle east with Israel and the twitter nuclear war he's having with Kim Jong Un... and several other things)

    Most ISIS-held territory (including major centers like Raqqa and Mosul) has been liberated. Millions of Syrian people are able to home because it is safe again. Trump help accomplish that while avoiding a hot proxy war against Russia in Syria. Saudi Arabia has taken major steps to jail and freeze assets of billionaires who are major funders of terrorist organizations and Islamic militias. Opium fields in Afghanistan are being bombed so much that the Taliban cannot rely on generating income from selling heroin anymore (which goes directly into buying arms for violent Islamists).

    North and South Korea have just had some peaceful talks, and moving the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem is something that Congress and the US Senate have been voting (and encouraging for the better part of the last 20 years).

    That is just some of the progress achieved during the Trump presidency off the top of my head.
    Last edited by MrOilers; 15-01-2018 at 02:56 PM.

  71. #171

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    You realize this is the economic Trump thread, right?
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  72. #172

    Default

    Bush started the wars and Obama wound them down. Buchanan started the great recession and Obama turned it around and rebuilt the economy, saving GM, Chrysler and many banks that were too big to fail. Guess you forgot that.

    Trump did not inherit a mess, it was handed to him like everything else, on a silver platter.

    Trump has not done anything of substance except give out corporate handouts.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  73. #173

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Bush started the wars and Obama wound them down.
    Which war did Obama "wind down"? His terrible decisions completely destabilized Syria and Iraq, and his poor foreign policy decisions (with Hillary as Secreatry of State) destabilized Libya, leading to growth of Africa's slave market and the massive refugee catastrophe flooding out of Africa that is now afflicting Europe.

    A lot of the things I dislike about Obama are debatable/disputable, but his awful foreign policy decisions is not one I'll budge on.

  74. #174

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    The Iraq war was already winding down under Bush and continued under Obama. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/With...oops_from_Iraq


    So what is the solution you would propose ? . A massive influx of troops in Iraq and invading Syria with 100,000 troops?

    Come on, let's get real.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 15-01-2018 at 03:38 PM.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  75. #175

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    MrOilers - Syria was liberated with the efforts Obama made. Trump sure likes claiming success for things he had nothing to do with, but happens to be the president after Obama.

    If Trump actually did something, please list what efforts he took to achieve that.

  76. #176

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    Republicans (bush Iraqx2, Afghanistan, Syria as a result of Iraq#2) start wars. Democrats come in clean up the mess, get things sorted out and nearly resolved, and then the next republican president comes in and claims it was all his doing while never doing anything. Classic Trump/Republicans


    and the clueless alt-right gobbles up misinformation and MrOilers regurgitates it here.

  77. #177

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    Democrats come in clean up the mess


  78. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Build Obama up all you like (and I know you will), but there was no huge difference between his and Dubya's presidencies. Too much money spent and too much involvement in pointless wars in Middle Eastern countries (and, in the process, turning several of them into shitholes).
    I don't know if they were turned in any way. I lived in south-eastern Turkey for about a year, and it's a bit of an eye-opener. I have zero desire to ever go back there.
    Nisi Dominus Frustra

  79. #179

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by howie View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Build Obama up all you like (and I know you will), but there was no huge difference between his and Dubya's presidencies. Too much money spent and too much involvement in pointless wars in Middle Eastern countries (and, in the process, turning several of them into shitholes).
    I don't know if they were turned in any way. I lived in south-eastern Turkey for about a year, and it's a bit of an eye-opener. I have zero desire to ever go back there.
    Yes, those countries had many problems before the US got involved. Maybe US involvement failed to solve all their problems, but it is also not responsible for all the problems of these countries.

    I think Obama was trying to best manage the huge mess he was left with by the previous Republican administration. He inherited a war in Iraq and a recession among other things. At least the recession ended and he left his successor an economy that was recovering quite well.

    I feel sorry for the US President that has to take over after Trump. He has p*ssed of most of the US allies and irritated those countries that do not like the US. I think his motto must be - if its not broken, break it.

  80. #180

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    MrOilers - Syria was liberated with the efforts Obama made. Trump sure likes claiming success for things he had nothing to do with, but happens to be the president after Obama.

    If Trump actually did something, please list what efforts he took to achieve that.
    From the richest country in Africa to now a slave trade hub liberated ? Wow this site is weird .http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/...063748575.html

  81. #181

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    And don't think for a moment that this is an unintended consequence.

    GOP tax law a one-two punch to charities — and American giving

    For the first time in their lives, millions of middle-class donors will be effectively shut out from claiming any charitable deduction under the GOP’s new tax law. At the same time, the wealthy will get a still larger share of the tax benefit, even when sacrificing a smaller share of their income.


    Indeed, the few concessions by tax writers to promote charitable giving are aimed at the very high end of the income scale. The end result is a law that does more to promote gifts to pay for a grandchild’s private schooling than it does to encourage the same grandparents to go outside their family and give to the local Boys & Girls Club.


    The unprecedented partisanship of the tax debate in Congress was remarkable in itself. But the negative impact on charitable giving touches something deeper in the American character.

    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...-giving-339039

  82. #182

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    Democrats come in clean up the mess

    I knew you'd agree. If you didn't agree, you would write more.

  83. #183

    Default

    Dow closes above 26,000

    Amazing!

  84. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Dow closes above 26,000

    Amazing!
    and the sun also rose for the 365th time in the last year.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  85. #185

    Default

    Changing the subject are we, with the typical "Oh LOOK over here at this shiny destraction" ploy?
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  86. #186

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Dow closes above 26,000

    Amazing!
    and the sun also rose for the 365th time in the last year.
    But does the Dow close above 26,000 every day, 365 days per year?

  87. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Dow closes above 26,000

    Amazing!
    and the sun also rose for the 365th time in the last year.
    But does the Dow close above 26,000 every day, 365 days per year?
    Stock markets inevitably rise over time, yes.

  88. #188

    Default

    It has taken off like a rocket in the last year.

  89. #189

    Default

    And it doesn't start a zero with each new president.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    It has taken off like a rocket in the last year.
    just like virtually every major exchange in the world? and, while canada has lagged somewhat in comparison (although still been quite strong), most other major exchanges have outperformed the dow. which I presume will have you counter that the donald’s policies are good for the world. except that’s counter to “make america great again/america first” isn’t it? after all, he can’t take credit for two opposites at the same time. or maybe he - and you - can but that won’t make either one true.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  91. #191

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    most other major exchanges have outperformed the dow.
    Those didn't have 8 years of Obama to correct for.

  92. #192

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    most other major exchanges have outperformed the dow.
    Those didn't have 8 years of Obama to correct for.
    Maybe you should take a look at the stock market since Obama took office... and compare that to what has continued to happen once Trump took office. Need me to post a graph (again) for you?

  93. #193

    Default

    I know its not fox news, but have a read: http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...-stock-market/

    Knowing that you wont read it because it's not one of your fake news sites... I'll select a piece you should focus on:

    Starting with Trump’s inauguration, the Dow has risen from 19,827.3 to 25,075.1 -- an increase of 26 percent. That’s impressive.
    But it’s not as impressive as its performance during the equivalent period under Obama. Under Obama, the Dow increased from 7,949.1 to 10,572 — a rise of 33 percent.

  94. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    most other major exchanges have outperformed the dow.
    Those didn't have 8 years of Obama to correct for.
    that was a pretty quick - and somewhat predictable - response. but it’s 180 degrees off course in terms of being a credible rebuttal isn’t it? if obama’s policies were so bad for the u.s and so good for the rest of the world that trump needs to turn them upside down, wouldn’t those exchanged have outperformed the dow in those 8 years and lagged since the donald took the reins?
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  95. #195

    Default

    and why was the DOW so far down in the first place before Obama? Need me to explain the answer?
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  96. #196

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    most other major exchanges have outperformed the dow.
    Those didn't have 8 years of Obama to correct for.
    Maybe you should take a look at the stock market since Obama took office... and compare that to what has continued to happen once Trump took office. Need me to post a graph (again) for you?
    No point, you just can't fix stupid.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  97. #197

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    and why was the DOW so far down in the first place before Obama?
    Bush was just like Obama.

    Both terrible Presidents.

  98. #198

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    most other major exchanges have outperformed the dow.
    Those didn't have 8 years of Obama to correct for.
    that was a pretty quick - and somewhat predictable - response. but it’s 180 degrees off course in terms of being a credible rebuttal isn’t it? if obama’s policies were so bad for the u.s and so good for the rest of the world that trump needs to turn them upside down, wouldn’t those exchanged have outperformed the dow in those 8 years and lagged since the donald took the reins?

    We all realize that the USA is such a massive player in the world economy that US wealth creates global wealth (just as a US recession literally triggers wide-scale global recession).

  99. #199

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    and why was the DOW so far down in the first place before Obama?
    Bush was just like Obama.

    Both terrible Presidents.
    Bush trashed the economy
    Obama saved the economy
    ******** is not fit to clean toilets

    Trump "is not fit to clean the toilets in the Barack Obama Presidential Library or to shine the shoes of George W. Bush."
    https://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...ush/947785001/

    amazing, the POTUS can say ******** but the term gets struck out when you post ******** comments from a ******** President.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  100. #200

    Default

    Please. I did not hear a single person anywhere predict that "Obama's economy" would skyrocket in 2017. Not one. Nobody here did, either.

    Instead, everyone on the news (and many on this forum) was predicting how the sky would fall and how the economy would tank if Trump got elected.

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