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Thread: Canada Arrests Senior Huawei Executive at Request of US

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    Default Canada Arrests Senior Huawei Executive at Request of US

    It's not often that an action by Canadian authorities is leading newscasts everywhere in the world. So thought this deserved its own thread.

    Obviously Canada's decision to arrest the daughter of Huawei's founder for possible extradition to the United States is causing waves around the world, most of all in China.

    It is hard to overstate the symbolism and significance of this event. Huawei is the crown jewel of Chinese tech and Ms Meng is effectively its princess.

    Even though it's still not clear what the charges against her are, this is not simply a case about the arrest of one woman, or just one company.

    This arrest could materially damage the relationship between the US and China at possibly one of the most sensitive times between the two countries in their long and torrid history.


    The gloves are off. Things have taken a dramatic turn for the worse.
    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-46465768

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    From the Chinese People's Daily Online:
    Under the official account of the Embassy of Canada to China, a large number of internet users questioned whether Canada has gone from being a sovereign state to “America’s hired thug.” They claim that Canada has violated the human rights of a Chinese citizen and demand that the Canadian side release Meng right away.
    http://en.people.cn/n3/2018/1206/c90000-9526144.html

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    A few countries have banned Huawei, because of the way China likes to make somehting, that they can have easy access to .

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    yeah, unlike google or apple..
    you missed when time and life shook hands and said goodbye.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bicycles View Post
    yeah, unlike google or apple..

    I think it's exactly like them, so do we need more? Canada was warned ages ago, but little JT knows best

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    I like to know how that can be done and on what grounds? I think Canada it treading on dangerous ground since the econmic shift seem to focus in Asia now. This could hurt us in the long run.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

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    I expect China to arrest a Canadian tourist or two in the next couple of days.

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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    A few countries have banned Huawei, because of the way China likes to make somehting, that they can have easy access to .
    Huawei's phones are still sold in many countries including Canada, and they recently passed Apple as the second largest mobile phone seller globally.

    A few countries have banned Huawei equipment from their telecom networks especially next gen 5G networks. That's a tad less provocative than arresting one of their top executives, especially one who is the daughter of the company founder.

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    I've always wondered whether the Chinese-made thumb drives everyone uses don't have some sort of special code that downloads one's hard drive when they get plugged in and then when one goes on the internet transmits it to China.

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    Quote Originally Posted by East McCauley View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    A few countries have banned Huawei, because of the way China likes to make somehting, that they can have easy access to .
    Huawei's phones are still sold in many countries including Canada, and they recently passed Apple as the second largest mobile phone seller globally.

    A few countries have banned Huawei equipment from their telecom networks especially next gen 5G networks. That's a tad less provocative than arresting one of their top executives, especially one who is the daughter of the company founder.
    Well you go ahead and trust,them I'm not going to. I have none of their products
    Cheers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    I like to know how that can be done and on what grounds? I think Canada it treading on dangerous ground since the econmic shift seem to focus in Asia now. This could hurt us in the long run.
    i don't know any more about the specifics than what's been in the media but i'd happily wager that this wasn't the result of a phone call from someone in the u.s. to someone in canada asking for a "please arrest this lady and deport her to the u.s. for us" favour. my guess is that there are real charges in the u.s. (justified or not) that resulted in an american arrest warrant (justified or not) that was registered/filed with interpol. at that point in time, it's not optional on canada's part but to detain and deport to the u.s. if that's the case there's no real "dangerous legal ground" that canada is treading on.

    https://www.interpol.int/INTERPOL-expertise/Notices
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    Maybe today's bail hearing will shed some more light on this arrest, or maybe it won't.

    Interesting that Ms. Meng has been in detention since last Saturday. Interesting that the grounds for the arrest reported thus far seem to based on violating US sanctions against Iran, and not the broader espionage concerns identified by some posters above. Also, interesting that noted Iran hard liner John Bolton had advance notice of the arrest but didn't tell Trump before his meeting with Xi at the G20.

    Chinese state media is taking an increasingly hard line on the arrest, with some commentators today calling it a "kidnapping."

    Without any solid evidence, the Canadian and US governments trampled on international law by basically "kidnapping" Chinese citizen Meng Wanzhou, the chief financial officer of Huawei.

    The US government is reportedly seeking the extradition of Meng from Canada, citing an warranted charge of "violating sanctions on Iran," which is based on US domestic law. This law has no jurisdiction over Chinese citizens and institutions. The news sent shockwaves through the international community and global markets.

    http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1130761.shtml

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    Russian regularly tries to abuse the Interpol system by having Bill Browder arrested.

    http://fortune.com/2018/05/30/bill-b...magnitsky-act/

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    I wonder how much different this is with Canada and this arrest?

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    What ever is going on, it will rise tension further. I can't help but feel war is imminent in the very short coming distance. It is rumored that both Russia and China have EMP capabilities that the US is not prepared for. With winter that we have- especially cold today- are any of us prepared for the outage of the electrical grid?
    I also find it ironic that their is tension with Russia and NATO at the same time.

    ^^^
    Regarding the sanction issue and to my understanding, Huawei is not even sold in the US, and if this is a matter of IRAN sanction, what business is it of the US to arrest a citizen from another country that was not even in its' territory to begin with? Shouldn't that be a world court tribunal? For me, Bolton is a war hungry man as everything about his demeanor says so. Rumors on YouTube states that this is regarding a race for 5G, and the Americans are just trying to slow down the Chinese advancement. I'm far from tech savy , so anyone can interject and correct me on that issue. One thing I do know for sure is that many Asian countries have leaped �� us in high tech to the point that we look like a second world. Very bizarre!
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    ^ yeah, this is about the US keeping 5G out until there tech catches up... the big thing no one is talking about is how much better mobile tech is in China and how much money apple and other western companies stand to lose if there was a level playing field.
    you missed when time and life shook hands and said goodbye.

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    Apparently Apple has fallen to third place behind Samsung and Huawei...
    I just hope our government's involvement does not jeopardize our economy with China. According to world economic specialists, America's economy is about to collapse and we can no longer depend on the US as a whole. If you look at the silk Road initiative, North America is left out completely. The future of trading is clearly and evidently heading towards Asia, Africa, and Europe. I can't help but think there will be payback to Canada from the Chinese. We just got screwed by the US with NAFTA and now this.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

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    Could have used 'creative incompetence'

    Manley said that in accordance with international obligations and Canada's extradition treaty with the U.S., Canada had to act, though he questioned whether it would have been a good time for some "creative incompetence."

    "This woman was not residing in Canada, she was simply transferring flights in Canada, and we might have just missed her," Manley said.

    https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/bein...y-pm-1.4209676
    Where the heck is the creative incompetence when you most need it?

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    I'm going to speculate that it got stuck in between somewhere in the American mid-belt... We arrested someone for America on an " America sanction" not ratified by the world.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

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    ^Ms. Meng's violation of Iran sanctions is alleged to have taken place between 2009 and 2014 which predates the Trump Administration's decision to unilaterally pull out of the Iran nuclear deal.

    Whatever the truth behind the allegations, the Chinese government continues to ratchet up the pressure on Canada:

    Ms Meng's arrest while she was changing planes in Vancouver last Saturday was a serious breach of her rights, Reuters quoted the foreign ministry as saying. It "ignored the law" and was "unreasonable", it said.

    "China strongly urges the Canadian side to immediately release the detained person... otherwise Canada must accept full responsibility for the serious consequences caused," the statement added.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46494935

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    So China is now concerned about human rights.

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    Canada had no choice but to arrest Huawei executive at Washington's request: expert | CBC News

    “The arrest of Huawei executive Meng Wanzhou may inflame diplomatic and trade tensions with China, but Canada's extradition treaty with the United States left it with no choice but to detain her, says a legal expert.

    "If the application from the requesting state is in order, then Canada is legally obliged to arrest her," said Rob Currie, a Dalhousie law professor who focuses extensively on extradition law.

    "Most extraditions are not terribly contentious. It so happens that this one is and has massive international political dimensions to it."

    ...”

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/men...tion-1.4937146

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    Quote Originally Posted by SP59 View Post
    So China is now concerned about human rights.
    Yes, if you are a senior executive of a prominent Chinese company favoured by the Communist Party. Today's editiorial in the Global Times is now alleging "rude and degrading treatment" of Ms. Meng since Canadian authorities took her into custody.

    Source: http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1130954.shtml

    No, if you are a Nobel Peace Prize winner with dissident views. In that case you will be locked up in inhumane conditions and denied necessary medical treatment until you die.

    Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jul/13/liu-xiaobo-nobel-laureate-chinese-political-prisoner-dies-61

    I'd be surprised if Ms. Meng was kept in custody and not released with strict bail conditions (e.g. surrendering passports, electronic monitoring). The optics are pretty awful of keeping Ms. Meng behind bars while she awaits extradition hearings (which with appeals can drag on for many months even years).

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    The two tier system applies everywhere.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

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    Is it all fake news? No actual proof/evidence being presented?


    Why isn’t Fox calling it out as fake news?

    Stephen Harper urges Canada to ban Huawei from 5G network in Fox News appearance - National | Globalnews.ca
    https://globalnews.ca/news/4740979/s...ban-huawei-5g/
    Last edited by KC; 10-12-2018 at 09:51 AM.

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    I heard people talking about Huawei ages ago, that it's state owned, that this is why China does, spies. It cannot be a surprise.

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    Glad to hear Ms. Meng was released on bail pending an extradition hearing. Keeping her jailed would have been unnecessarily cruel.

    However, in the what else is new category, Trump's latest foolish remarks may just have sabotaged his own government's case:

    President Donald Trump said in an interview with Reuters on Tuesday that he would intervene in the Meng case if he thought it was "good for the country."

    "If I think it's good for what will be certainly the largest trade deal ever made -— which is a very important thing — what's good for national security — I would certainly intervene if I thought it was necessary," Trump told Reuters.
    https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/11/tech/...ion/index.html

    How can the US credibly claim that Meng's arrest was not politically motivated when Trump is signalling he's willing to intervene in her case if the Chinese give him a favourable trade deal?

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    Trump is an utter buffoon, so yeah what else is new
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    If I was the Canadian judge, I'd toss the case eight now. Trump basically declares that she's a bargaining chip.

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    I think they should have just ‘accidentally’ missed her at the airport in the first place. That’s all we need right now is trouble with China. Have they cancelled the big shipping project for YEG yet? How about the plans for the big new upgrader north of town? Should have just told the FBI to get their own man, like the Mounties.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 11-12-2018 at 11:50 PM.

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    From the Canadian Press:
    "I think we're lonelier than we've been in a long, long time," said David Mulroney, who served former Conservative prime minister Stephen Harper as his first foreign-policy adviser and later as ambassador to China. "(Trump) gave credibility to an outrageous Chinese accusation — that the RCMP basically works as an extension of the U.S. government to capture a hostage who can be used in their trade negotiations."

    Roland Paris, who was Trudeau's first foreign-policy adviser, said Canada has for decades enjoyed the luxury of operating in "a very comfortable international context," but not any more.
    "Now, a lot of the assumptions that have guided our foreign policy are in question, including whether the United States has our back," said Paris, a University of Ottawa international-affairs professor.

    Both pointed to the fact that just hours before Trump sounded off, his ambassador to Canada was extolling the same separation of the law and politics as the Trudeau government.
    Secretary of State Mike Pompeo appeared to double down on Trump's line on Wednesday in a televised interview with Fox and Friends.

    "We always have to balance American interests. Any time there's a law enforcement engagement, we need to make sure we take foreign-policy ... considerations into effect," said Pompeo. "It's totally appropriate to do so. The president's mission is very clear. It's America First, right?"

    https://www.burnabynow.com/trump-com...and-1.23532663
    While Trump's foolish remarks about using Meng as a political bargaining chip in trade talks could be excused (though not by the Chinese) as coming from a buffoon, Pompeo's doubling down on Trump's remarks makes things even worse.

    Sure wish there was a way to release Meng and put her on the first plane back to China.

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    She’s in her home in Vancouver so no need to send her anywhere. Just go visit her, take off her ankle bracelet and just say forget what happened. Sorry. Have a nice day.

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    In light of what certainly looks like the unapologetic politicizing of the extradition case by the Trump Administration, was kind of wondering if her lawyers might have grounds to go back to court to change the bail conditions. Maybe to something like $5 and four boxes of Domino pizzas to share with the media.

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    Quote Originally Posted by East McCauley View Post
    In light of what certainly looks like the unapologetic politicizing of the extradition case by the Trump Administration, was kind of wondering if her lawyers might have grounds to go back to court to change the bail conditions. Maybe to something like $5 and four boxes of Domino pizzas to share with the media.
    I'm guessing that in our legal system there can be no intervention once charges are laid. Too bad, it would great if Trudeau could just let her go on the grounds that if the USA is not going to follow the law then Canada won't either, and p.s. I don't like Trump and I don't care what he thinks about that because he is near the end of his presidency.

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    It’s getting interesting. Apparently unrelated businesses, but Chinese businesses, may changing their behaviour towards Canada. And Canada is changing its behaviour towards China.

    Some good might come out of all this. It might be very useful in shining a light on false and flawed perceptions and beliefs towards our trade and relationships with other countries. Like a little tremblor, small plague, drought, flood, forest fire, debt scare, etc. They highlight our dependencies and weaknesses. So, Canada gives up industries to other countries and focuses on our strengths. Fine and dandy until something goes wrong and we get a bit of a wake up call.

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