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Thread: Cold Lake mayor concerned by plans to move military aircraft testing to Ottawa

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    Default Cold Lake mayor concerned by plans to move military aircraft testing to Ottawa

    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    A small community losing a lot of high paying and skilled jobs.

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    Trudeau? Alberta? Let us eat cake ...
    ... gobsmacked

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    He really hates us, doesn't he. People still defend him, but he's a rubbish petulant , dictator!

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    no votes to be bought out here, Alberta will never elect a liberal candidate.

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    A little perspective. Not saying they couldn't put the brakes on this, but it's been talked about for literally a decade with both Liberal and Conservative governments laying the groundwork for this move. It's unfortunate and will obviously affect Cold Lake. The timing and optics on this are pretty rough, but painting it as a partisan attack is a bit misguided in this case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex.L View Post
    A little perspective. Not saying they couldn't put the brakes on this, but it's been talked about for literally a decade with both Liberal and Conservative governments laying the groundwork for this move. It's unfortunate and will obviously affect Cold Lake. The timing and optics on this are pretty rough, but painting it as a partisan attack is a bit misguided in this case.
    forgetting of course that timing and optics - and not caring about them - certainly is a partisan decision.

    regardless of how long its been talked about, making and implementing the decision at this point is what's - at a minimum - misguided and completely tone deaf.

    this is, after all, the same boy wonder who said "canada isn't doing well right now because it's albertans who control our community and socio-democratic agenda. it doesn't work" and when asked whether he thought canada was "better served when there are more quebecers in charge than albertans" replied "i'm a liberal, so of course i think so, yes. certainly when we look at the great prime ministers of the 20th century, those that really stood the test of time, they were mp's from quebec. there was trudeau, there was mulroney, there was chretien, there was paul martin. we have a role. this country, canada, it belongs to us."

    this isn't a partisan attack? okay. at least not any more than northern gateway or bill c-69 or any of a host of other decisions and actions including mentioning all of the provinces except alberta on canada day or any more partisan than the general attitude he seems to have picked up from his father.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    no votes to be bought out here, Alberta will never elect a liberal candidate.
    Errr. They did.
    “Canada is the only country in the world that knows how to live without an identity,”-Marshall McLuhan

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    Quote Originally Posted by Glenco View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    no votes to be bought out here, Alberta will never elect a liberal candidate.
    Errr. They did.
    LOL, they did. Randy who? Is he ever around, speaks up for AB?,
    I'm everywhere man Sohi..he sure has the party lines down pat

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex.L View Post
    A little perspective. Not saying they couldn't put the brakes on this, but it's been talked about for literally a decade with both Liberal and Conservative governments laying the groundwork for this move. It's unfortunate and will obviously affect Cold Lake. The timing and optics on this are pretty rough, but painting it as a partisan attack is a bit misguided in this case.
    It is unfortunate...and yes, it has been in the works for 10+ years. One of the main reasons is that the other assets (wind tunnel, etc) is in the Ottawa region.

    I, and many others, have been sounding the alarm on this for some time. I was hoping minds could be changed, as this is a blow to recruitment to the province as well, but alas...

    I'll leave my comments to this as there are other workings going on....
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    Oh no, they're spending money and making improvements. Those eastern bastards!


    Col. Paul Doyle, commander of 4 Wing at Cold Lake, told Postmedia Wednesday the new infrastructure will include a specialized facility to allow for larger classified planning sessions, briefings and debriefings about missions. In addition, work will be done on new communications systems, data links and upgrades to the threat emitter pods that are on the base’s weapons range.

    https://ottawacitizen.com/news/natio...base-and-range

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    What? Where is the eastern bastards comment coming from??????????
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    ^ Ignore kkozoriz. Most of us already do.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    Unfortunately I cannot ignore what appears to be some attempt to turn a post about Maple Flag being cancelled (as evidence to support that major changes are happening at 4 Wing) into a cheap shot. I have a professional acquaintence with Col. Doyle and his team and I would prefer to keep it cordial and professional, so juxtaposing his name along with the eastern bastards line concerns me...especially when it is directly after my post.

    Like other towns, I do worry about the loss of professional jobs in Rural Alberta, but this one (as Alex rightly stated) is not partisan, but more a longer term conversation about how the DND will deploy its assets, put centres of excellence near like industries, etc. For this topic in particular, the loss of a major engineering centre in aviation will have repercussions on our ability to recruit similar industries in this province. I was hoping that this could lead to enough of a buzz for people who have these skills to either open up a shop in Alberta, or be employed by the same. Recruitment and retention in aviation is the core of my Airshow model.
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    So, the closest air weapons range to Ottawa is .........?

    True story - EcDev Alberta once tried to sell easatern Alberta as a great place to test out new aircraft, "because hardly anyone lives there, so unlikely a crash would hurt anyone ...."
    ... gobsmacked

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    https://lakelandconnect.net/2018/12/...eeable-future/

    The release about maple flag being cancelled for future years. On this one, I can point a finger at the current government's delay at modernizing our aircraft feet. Australian used fighter jets won't cut it.
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic Death Monkey View Post
    ^ Ignore kkozoriz. Most of us already do.
    It's the best thing to do.

    It's an interesting thread, thanks Richard...

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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardS View Post
    What? Where is the eastern bastards comment coming from??????????
    sar·casm
    /ˈsärˌkazəm
    noun
    the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.

    i.e. - Anything done by the Liberals MUST be a shot at Alberta in some way, shape or form.

    Move aircraft testing to Ottawa after years of study and planning by governments of both sides - Damn Liberals!

    Spend money to improve the air weapons range but cancel Maple Flag for one year (which has happened before numerous times) - Damn Liberals!

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    Perhaps you missed the lead in the URL?

    There will be not be a Maple Flag military exercise in 2019 or in the “foreseeable future” in Cold Lake, the Royal Canadian Air Force has decided.
    ... gobsmacked

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    So they're spending all this money with no intention to actually use it for anything?

    "Foreseeable future" means that they haven't scheduled anything yet. And it's not just Canada that takes part. If the other countries don't want to do it, it won't happen. When they do, they will.

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    What's great about CFB Cold Lake - for other nations specially - is the huge air weapons range over which to play!
    ... gobsmacked

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RichardS View Post
    What? Where is the eastern bastards comment coming from??????????
    sar·casm
    /ˈsärˌkazəm
    noun
    the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.
    You would be better suited to actually sharpen your skills rather than try to pass on a definition in a puerile attempt to be sarcastic about being sarcastic.

    No...really...
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    So they're spending all this money with no intention to actually use it for anything?

    "Foreseeable future" means that they haven't scheduled anything yet. And it's not just Canada that takes part. If the other countries don't want to do it, it won't happen. When they do, they will.
    You're missing the point on this cancellation. ...and you're also missing the point of the spending.

    That's not me being sarcastic. That's me telling you to quit while you're kind of ahead.
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

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    Now that LGEN Meinzinger is speaking publicly...

    ...part of the reason why there is no blaming the eastern children with unmarried parents is this...

    The geographic location aspect has played into retention issues affecting other organizations supporting the RCAF.

    The federal government will create a new centre of excellence in Ottawa to support aircraft testing, a move that affects the Canadian military’s Aerospace Engineering Test Establishment, or AETE, which has been at Cold Lake, Alta. since 1971. Under the new plan AETE would be relocated to the international airport in Ottawa and partnered with the National Research Council Flight Research Laboratory and Transport Canada Aircraft Services Directorate to create a centre of excellence for flight testing and evaluation.

    Moving AETE will save $14 million a year and free up space for the arrival of more fighter jets at Cold Lake.
    LINK TO OTTAWA CITIZEN ARTICLE


    This one was Alberta's ball to drop. I, and many others, were warning of this for some time now, and wanted to create the CoE on flight testing and evaluation to be here in Edmonton. It was one of the compelling reasons I created the Edmonton Airshow - to attract the necessary attention and business to say that we really want this industry. This fell on deaf ears, no one believed the centre would move...and now...


    Maybe finally the region will see what many are saying over and over. We need to show our attractiveness and remove our own political blinders and barriers...


    Vegreville was a warning shot. You could still recruit there only being an hour away. Cold Lake AETE was rumored for years now, and is 3.5-4 hours from a major centre. I wanted to try my best to get the AETE here instead of it having to to leave the province. Oh well. When you're one voice that is yelling into an abyss...
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

  26. #26

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    Ottawa makes sense as it's more central for the majority of military assets. Cold Lake is many things but central it is not. There's also this bit from the posted article:

    Moving AETE will save $14 million a year and free up space for the arrival of more fighter jets at Cold Lake.

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    kkozoriz...if you'd take a breath and look at the words I posted vs trying to get a word in edgewise...you'd see I included that line for a reason.

    ...and the reason for the $14 million in savings is just collecting all things in one centre... It could be Abbotsford...or Mirabel...

    YOW is more for proximity to DNDHQ, which in of itself is a pretty major trump card....but not for the $14 million in savings.
    Tired of being taken advantage of .

  28. #28

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    I'm breathing just fine, thank you.

    It's just that I don't believe that everything must be in Edmonton or Alberta and that there might, just might, be good and valid reasons for the government making decisions that don't put the wishes of Alberta above the good of the rest of the country.

    Part of the cost savings will also come from the fact that people from HQ can simply drive out the the airport instead of being out of the office for three days to fly to Edmonton and back if needed.

    And Vegreville was a warning shot? Sheesh, entitled much? "No, no, no! It's ours!!!!", ignoring the fact that the only reason it was in Vegreville was to bolster Don Mazankowsk's political power.
    Last edited by kkozoriz; Yesterday at 10:26 PM.

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