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Thread: Equalization conversation - post 2019 Election

  1. #1

    Default Equalization conversation - post 2019 Election

    ^Alberta would do fine - without those equalization transfers from taxpayers in Alberta to payouts to Quebec, a fund much larger than Norways would have been built up. Easily enough money for a few hundred F35's to protect the borders. Or could join the US (a merger with Montana would be easiest) and at least get two elected senators.
    Last edited by Admin; 04-05-2019 at 01:29 PM. Reason: MOVED FROM UCP CATCH ALL THREAD

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Moodib View Post
    ...
    It needs to be more targeted, because we spend a lot more on healthcare relative to other areas of public spending. We have a young population, so targeted fixes to healthcare are needed, especially in terms of compensation. While government froze other areas of salary increases, certain parts of healthcare still increased.
    emphasis added...

    i hear/see that a lot but alberta's demographics aren't statistically much different than the rest of the country.

    https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-r...chPR=01&B1=All
    Most of the spending in any area is wages and salaries and Alberta still has much higher than average wages than the rest of Canada. Some of this is the legacy of 2014 and before when high wages in the energy and construction sectors forced every other sector to offer higher wages to compete to attract people.
    People generally support equalization as they know it’s like insurance where it will be available to us when we need it.

    The real problem is that when things turn down no one comes to our aid because the system is a top-down design like free-trade.* It’s just one more downstream, reactionary, results based program that fails to support and enable its own perpetuation as a supportive program would.** The system doesn’t say, let’s help you make a high income so we can then take a cut to help others also earn a high income, it’s a system that says, oh I see that you earned a high income so let’s take a cut to help those that didn’t earn a high income.

    I’ve been harping in this in post after post. People here have paid higher taxes (due to our generally higher income and our greater depletion/extraction rates and/or margins) than in other provinces. We enable equalization for a pooling-insurance-system-of-social-programs but there are no social programs to keep you working or to keep your business afloat when the economy rapidly tanks.

    If we held back 10-15% of our federal taxes for a stabilization fund to insure our businesses and workers in the event of a collapse in their product pricing or markets then that would be an equalization system that keeps alive our our golden egg laying goose.

    As simply as I can put it now: When you’ve got a goose laying golden eggs you can’t take away every egg, ignoring the fact that the goose may fall ill and either need some emergency medicine or need one of those eggs to hatch to create another goose capable of laying more golden eggs.


    * free trade deal pick winners and then over time essentially abandon the losers.

    **In the 1980s a book was published called Getting to Yes. I recall basically the idea that contracts in Japan were not permanent and fixed but subject to renegotiation because of a recognition of the interdependence between say a supplier and a manufacturer. If something changed the businesses had to support each other rather than letting say a supplier potentially go bankrupt or degrade product due to mounting losses both of which would negatively impact the manufacturer.
    Last edited by KC; 04-05-2019 at 08:23 AM.

  3. #3

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    No one comes to our aid.... my god. You realized that if we had sensible taxation policy we wouldnít need aid. Despite the largest bust of this province in a generation we still are a have province.

    It certain people chose not to or only to finish josh school to work in a high volatile industry and then failed to plan accordingly thatís not on the feds.

    Itís time that conservative oil patch start taking a page from their own beliefs and prize that freedom to fail or succeed based on their own merit.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    No one comes to our aid.... my god. You realized that if we had sensible taxation policy we wouldn’t need aid. Despite the largest bust of this province in a generation we still are a have province.

    It certain people chose not to or only to finish josh school to work in a high volatile industry and then failed to plan accordingly that’s not on the feds.

    It’s time that conservative oil patch start taking a page from their own beliefs and prize that freedom to fail or succeed based on their own merit.
    You’re ignoring reality. It’s not going to happen.

    However a rethink of the system towards enabling rather than reacting might change a few things.

    Also, a focus on the oil patch is siloed thinking. It subsidizes and enables near every other activity and career in the province.
    Last edited by KC; 04-05-2019 at 09:12 AM.

  5. #5
    C2E Junkie *
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    Quote Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
    (…)You realized that if we had sensible taxation policy we wouldn’t need aid.(…)
    I think you're making a bad mistake here. I could insert any rhetoric behind sensible to tell someone that if they only had come of that...er...common sense...that they wouldn't need the dole?

    Equalization is meant to help out, but if I follow your logic, then if all provinces just lived within their means, didn't overspend on social issues or issues that didn't make money, kept their head up, were their own person, had a crystal ball to predict the market trends, danced better, didn't rely in fishing, learned to code...

    You just made the case to kill equalization.
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