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Thread: Cycling Infrastructure | Discussion

  1. #1

    Lightbulb Cycling Infrastructure | Discussion

    Could we do the same thing here??

    Montreal Announces Bike Rental System



    Posted by: Nate Berg

    6 October 2007 - 11:00am
    Following the example set by Paris and Lyon, Montreal plans to be the first city in North America to set up a large-scale "self-serve" public bicycle rental service.

    Montreal announced yesterday it will follow Paris's bike path and offer hundreds of bicycles for self-serve rent.

    "The first city-issue self-serve bikes are to appear at specially designed outdoor stations in fall 2008. By autumn 2009, it's expected 2,400 bikes will be available for as little as $1 per half-hour, at 300 stations around central neighbourhoods."

    Earlier this year, Montreal announced a $3.7-million project to create a four-kilometre, all year long (read "open in Canadian Winter") bicycle path across its downtown core.

    The Parisian model for Montreal's experiment, known as Vélib, has been an extraordinary success. Within less than a fortnight, Vélib (an amalgam of vélo and libre) has registered more than 440,000 rentals.

    Source: The Montreal Gazette, Oct 05, 2007

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    How did I miss something on Planetizen? I read every single summary...must not have been paying attention.

    Unsurprisingly, I say yes. I'll wait for someone to say no before I say any more.

  3. #3

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    We saw these all over Paris this summer - more than the last time we went.

    Awesome for tourists an those in a rush, not bad prices, but I dont have stats on how they avoid thefts.

  4. #4

    Default Paris Bike Sharing System Works!

    Paris Bike Sharing System augments transit system for very low cost

    20,600 bicycles, 1,450 depots, built in 4 MONTHS!!!
    Costs less than 1 kilometer of LRT and has 120,000 users a day.

    There's an excellent video on the project here: http://www.streetfilms.org/

    Bicycles are free for the first 30 minutes and are availble 24 hoursa day. Perfect for getting home when transit shuts down at night. Even with Edmonton`s winters, IMHO a bicycle sharing system would work for 8 months of the year and even longer for heartier souls.

    "Vélib program are being entirely borne by a private company in exchange for advertising rights, a deal that is proving handsomely profitable for everyone involved - company, city and citizens."

    Mobility, walkability, community, saves money.

    Win, Win, Win, Win!


    Crunching Some Numbers on Paris Bike-Sharing Program
    WorldChanging Team July 16, 2008 11:33 AM
    By Adam Stein

    On the first anniversary of Vélib, the Times dishes up some stats on Paris’ popular bike-sharing program:
    * Riders took 27.5 million trips in the first year.
    * The current pace is about 120,000 trips per day.
    * The program includes 20,600 bikes.
    * The 1,450 self-service rental stations are available every 300 yards.
    * The bikes are heavy and expensive — $3,460 and 50 lbs — built to withstand theft, mistreatment, and heavy riding.
    * Nevertheless, 3,000 bikes have gone missing, about 15% of the total.

    Such programs, done right, do a fantastic job of boosting bicycle ridership. One thing they don’t necessarily do, however, is reduce a lot of carbon emissions. I built a simple model using the cited figures, and added in assumptions about average trip length, the number of displaced car miles, average fuel efficiency, etc. The results are necessarily rough, but I estimate the program is currently reducing maybe 40,000 metric tons of CO2 per year, about the amount saved by removing 5,700 cars from the road. (This suggests that it takes about 3.6 shared bicycles to replace a car.)

    The costs of the Vélib program are being entirely borne by a private company in exchange for advertising rights, a deal that is proving handsomely profitable for everyone involved - company, city and citizens. But it does suggest that bike-sharing shouldn’t be oversold as a solution to climate change, but instead should be seen as part of the movement toward green, livable cities that prioritize citizens over cars.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 18-07-2008 at 12:01 AM. Reason: added picture
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    Used it, loved it, wish Edmonton had it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin_Foster View Post
    Used it, loved it, wish Edmonton had it.
    Which would require less pot holes, no snow, warmer winter temperatures, more cycle paths and 75% of local drivers being shown how to give cycles room.

    This is a great idea, sooooooo not Edmonton.
    Edmonton, Capital of Alberta

  7. #7

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    I would guess a higher population density, combined with more useful transit system would be a big factor as well. If I recall correctly, you can get almost anywhere in Paris quickly and pretty easily on transit. Combining that with bikes for the begin and end of the your trip would make it very attractive.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin_Foster View Post
    Used it, loved it, wish Edmonton had it.
    Edmonton does have this service although not to the extent or scale as in Paris.

    http://www.peoplespedal.org

    I have seen one of their racks at Jasper Avenue and 110 Street. It usually has 4 bikes on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveB View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin_Foster View Post
    Used it, loved it, wish Edmonton had it.
    Which would require less pot holes, no snow, warmer winter temperatures, more cycle paths and 75% of local drivers being shown how to give cycles room.

    This is a great idea, sooooooo not Edmonton.
    I see your point, but Paris has bad roads too, including their cobblestone streets. Riding on them can jar a filling or two loose. And, I find the majority of Edmonton's drivers to be pretty good regarding bicycles (with exceptions - see below), though a public information/education program is in order for drivers, riders, and pedestrians considering the growing number of cyclists.

    40% of bike commuters continue to ride in the winter according to some study I can't find a link to. There are only a few days each winter that it's really a bad idea to ride. The keys are to dress for the weather, be highly visible (considering it's dark in the mornings and early evenings in Winter), ride slower, assume drivers aren't looking for you, and get studded tires.

    I do agree this works a lot better in Paris than in Edmonton. And, according to the news I saw on this subject, the City has to have trucks to pick up bikes to redistribute them from popular destinations that get overcrowded (because you need a locking slot to park it, if it's full, you need to wait until someone leaves). I don't believe it will ever be nearly as popular here. Better for Edmonton to build on and improve the bike path system if they want to encourage bike commuting.

    99st, for example, from Argyll (work) to Whitemud WHC (gym) has to be among the most dangerous routes I've ever taken here. The roads are narrow, there are no sidewalks or paths, the right hand sides of the right lanes are full of tire popping potholes, and there is a constant stream of trucks flying (!) by, many with no respect for cyclists. When I got to the gym, I was just happy to have survived. Still exploring alternate routes.

    And regarding the education aspect, some better signs might help along the bike lane on Gateway South from Whyte to ?? Ave. Cars turning onto Gateway from the South routinely pull into the middle of the lane and stop, looking to their right for a break in traffic. They don't even think to look left. Travelling North in the bike/cab/bus lane I had to grab the brakes, lock 'em up, and skid to a stop, coming within a foot of slamming into a guy's nice BMW a few days ago, and he gave ME a dirty look, like I shouldn't be there. He's lucky it wasn't a bus! This happens almost daily. I resent having to slow to a crawl at the end of each block in case somebody's not looking. I wear a BRIGHT YELLOW jacket, and still, they pull out right in front of my path, with me feet away, and stop to check for traffic coming from the North. I'm seriously considering getting an air horn.

    And don't get me started on the bad bicyclists out there. In many ways they are worse than the automobiles.

    Anything to promote bicycle commuting would be good for Edmonton I think.
    aka Jim Good; "The sooner you fall behind, the more time you have to catch up." - Steven Wright

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    how about just buying a bike?
    Onward and upward

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    That just has to be wrong $3,400 for one bike? We just bought a bike for my wife, a high end commuter bike and it only cost $800. I just can't see how that's possible.

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    They are indeed fools if they paid $3400 for those bikes! They're not meant for the Tour de France for gosh sakes! Some French bicycle maker is making a fortune. Who is the purchaser that ok'd that I wonder? Kick-back anyone? Oh well, it's a private company putting up the cash.

    There are durable commuter bikes for 1/10 of that price (though they are tanks). You can buy a real good quality Trek commuter for $500-$600. My new bike is really sweet (Specialized TriCross Comp), a lot nicer than the ones pictured, and cost around $2500 with pedals and fenders. Someone's getting ripped off there.

    (by the way, a real high-end commuter bike can run $5000 or more)

    Doesn't sound right to me. That's more than $71 Million for the bikes.

    As RichardS suggests - buy a bike yourself (and 2 or 3 good locks).
    Last edited by Jimbo; 18-07-2008 at 04:03 PM.
    aka Jim Good; "The sooner you fall behind, the more time you have to catch up." - Steven Wright

  13. #13

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    ^ but what if you want to tour a city that your not from?

    If I was a tourist here, it would be AWESOME to explore the river valley via bike. Rent one for $10 and bring it back at any of the bike stations. Imagine being able to go from downtown, explore the river valley, go to whyte, head over to the zoo, and back? If thats not a cool idea..

    sure it wouldnt work so well in Winter, but we can't shut down good ideas because we have winter :P Otherwise, we wouldnt have baseball, outdoor parks, etc. etc. etc.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    They are indeed fools if they paid $3400 for those bikes! They're not meant for the Tour de France for gosh sakes! Some French bicycle maker is making a fortune. Who is the purchaser that ok'd that I wonder? Kick-back anyone? Oh well, it's a private company putting up the cash.

    There are durable commuter bikes for 1/10 of that price (though they are tanks). You can buy a real good quality Trek commuter for $500-$600. My new bike is really sweet (Specialized TriCross Comp), a lot nicer than the ones pictured, and cost around $2500 with pedals and fenders. Someone's getting ripped off there.

    Doesn't sound right to me. That's more than $71 Million for the bikes.
    Yes, I agree that the bikes are pricey especially if you order 20,000 of them. These are not regular bikes as they have a card reader and secuity system built in. The parts were made in China, Hungary and several other countries and then assembled in France.


    I read several other reports that give different bike costs as $3,400 USD, another 1,300 Euros ($2000 USD/CDN) another that said $1,300 USD report that stated 400 Euros ($640 USD/CDN)

    So I really don`t know for sure what they really cost.

    The first city to try this was Lyon, France and then Paris. New York is investigating this system as well. I think that the most important aspect was that they went big right away, starting with 10,000 bikes and then adding 10,000 more. This created the critical mass that gave people confidence in the system. The video states that there should one bike for every 200 people AND 15 bikes/station so in Edmonton we have about 750K pop. which works out to 3,750 bikes and 250 stations. That many bikes even at the highest price quoted ($3,400) would only be $12.7M which is about 10 Gateway Icicles or about 1/20th the cost of the 23rd Avenue intersection.

    A 30-min use is free and people use them for shopping, commuting, as transit connections and to reduce auto use. Riders can select a one-day card for 1 Euro, a weekly card for 5 Euros or an annual card for 29 Euros. What a deal!

    French Mayors Gerard Collomb in Lyon and Bertrand Delanoe in Paris have strongly supported Vélib, even ripping up 200km of streets to add new bike paths in an effort to reduce car traffic by 40% by 2020.

    People with cars can park at one place, bike to several places and then head home again reducing congestion and searching for several parking places ( I immediately thought of South Edmonton Common).

    Instead of taking a car to work or two or three buses, one can take a short bike trip to a major bus route for free, park the bike and take the bus and then take another bike to your destination. On you way back you can take a bike to the grocery store and make other errands.
    If it snows you can take the bus home.

    For all weather use, sections of the bikepaths could include lightweight covered walkways like they use at airports that are anchored or mounted on top of precast concrete barriers. Great for joggers & pedestrians as well.



    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveB View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin_Foster View Post
    Used it, loved it, wish Edmonton had it.
    Which would require less pot holes, no snow, warmer winter temperatures, more cycle paths and 75% of local drivers being shown how to give cycles room.

    This is a great idea, sooooooo not Edmonton.
    I agree SteveB. Paris and other European cities it works very well, but our city's geography and weather is not really suitable.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post

    Yes, I agree that the bikes are pricey especially if you order 20,000 of them. These are not regular bikes as they have a card reader and secuity system built in. The parts were made in China, Hungary and several other countries and then assembled in France.

    I read several other reports that give different bike costs as $3,400 USD, another 1,300 Euros ($2000 USD/CDN) another that said $1,300 USD report that stated 400 Euros ($640 USD/CDN)

    So I really don`t know for sure what they really cost.

    The first city to try this was Lyon, France and then Paris. New York is investigating this system as well. I think that the most important aspect was that they went big right away, starting with 10,000 bikes and then adding 10,000 more. This created the critical mass that gave people confidence in the system. The video states that there should one bike for every 200 people AND 15 bikes/station so in Edmonton we have about 750K pop. which works out to 3,750 bikes and 250 stations. That many bikes even at the highest price quoted ($3,400) would only be $12.7M which is about 10 Gateway Icicles or about 1/20th the cost of the 23rd Avenue intersection.

    A 30-min use is free and people use them for shopping, commuting, as transit connections and to reduce auto use. Riders can select a one-day card for 1 Euro, a weekly card for 5 Euros or an annual card for 29 Euros. What a deal!

    French Mayors Gerard Collomb in Lyon and Bertrand Delanoe in Paris have strongly supported Vélib, even ripping up 200km of streets to add new bike paths in an effort to reduce car traffic by 40% by 2020.

    People with cars can park at one place, bike to several places and then head home again reducing congestion and searching for several parking places ( I immediately thought of South Edmonton Common).

    Instead of taking a car to work or two or three buses, one can take a short bike trip to a major bus route for free, park the bike and take the bus and then take another bike to your destination. On you way back you can take a bike to the grocery store and make other errands.
    If it snows you can take the bus home.

    ...
    I agree that you have to go big, and despite a high cost per bike a system like this could be a bargain.

    On the otherhand, there's not to many places in edmonton where the quoted rental station every 300m makes sense, especially with a dozen or more bikes per location. Perhaps a system limited to inner, denser areas would makes more sense?

    Or maybe providing (or requiring)more and better bike parking and letting individuals provide their own bikes would be a better solution?

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    I look at this from an economy of scale standpoint.

    Paris has hoe many visitors compared to Edmonton? Add to this the amount of more local visitors who could bring their own bikes to the city. Is there a value proposition here? I would assume that since there have been several attempts at this here, and all failed at one point or another, that there isn't the same desire for rented bikes.

    If anyone here disagrees with this assessment, then get some capital and prove me wrong.

    I'd love to be wrong here....
    Onward and upward

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    I agree that you have to go big, and despite a high cost per bike a system like this could be a bargain.

    On the otherhand, there's not to many places in edmonton where the quoted rental station every 300m makes sense, especially with a dozen or more bikes per location. Perhaps a system limited to inner, denser areas would makes more sense?

    Or maybe providing (or requiring)more and better bike parking and letting individuals provide their own bikes would be a better solution?
    I think that the critical mass and convenience is most important even beyond weather. This is mainly for commuters not tourists. If there are not enough bikes or stations the interest will collapse. Bringing your own bike is nice but what do you do if is raining on your way home, you can't leave your bike overnight downtown it will probably be stolen; this is one reason people use an old bike rather than get a new one. Cycling home in pouring rain is nobody's idea of a fun time and turns off many who try bicycle commuting.

    With a rented bike you can just take the bus home or get a ride from a co-worker. The next morning as you leave home there is another bike waiting for you. You get to work and take another rented bike to do a little shopping (remember that the first 30 minutes are free each time you take one out. You pick up groceries but find big packages of toilet paper on sale. Normally with a bike this would be a problem as the stuff your bought wouldn't fit on your bike but with a rental you can just walk home or take a bus.

    Another important aspect is community. You can link up with friends or fellow commutes far easier on a bike. The stations become meeting points and commuting with friends makes the trip more enjoyable and encourages a commitment to ride each day together for exercise and greener living. Great way to meet people of the opposite sex (or same sex whichever your interest) at the local station than commuting alone in a car with the windows rolled up.
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  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I think that the critical mass and convenience is most important even beyond weather. This is mainly for commuters not tourists. If there are not enough bikes or stations the interest will collapse. Bringing your own bike is nice but what do you do if is raining on your way home, you can't leave your bike overnight downtown it will probably be stolen; this is one reason people use an old bike rather than get a new one. Cycling home in pouring rain is nobody's idea of a fun time and turns off many who try bicycle commuting.
    I think people who want to bike, on the whole, bike. I know I prefer to use my own bike, just like I prefer to use my own car (can even take a bike on LRT if it rains, or just wait for the rainstorm to end, look at the weather forecast, or buy a raincoat). I just don't see enough of a bike commuter market here, and lets face it, the season is so short, our roads so poorly designed for cyclists, and our population in general so lazy, that this will never be anything more than a small niche thing. Trying to overturn that tide, is I think, a bit futile when we could instead be investing in year round commuter transit. Addditionally, should we be spending money on a commuting system (which is what you describe this as), that cannot be used by a growing portion of the population (disabled, seniors, babies, etc.)?

    In saying that, if there is a market, what is to stop you, or someone else, setting up a business running such a program, just like people sell bikes today?
    Last edited by moahunter; 21-07-2008 at 01:57 PM.

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    Myself as a bike commuter I ride between the southside and downtown and climbing out of the river valley twice a day makes me appreciate the value of a light and fast bike. If the city were to offer bike sharing I'm sure I wouldn't be use their bikes, a bike that you use everyday in all types of conditions you have to trust and customize to get how you want it. The only people that would use this program would be tourists and people who don't normally ride, no one who commutes would be, and I don't think there are enough potential tourist and day riders here to justify this program.

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    I think if the river valley was promoted a bit more or if there were more events and activities in it, there'd be more of a demand for a bike-sharing program. For instance, I always see a lot of bikes parked at Heritage Days.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by MagicMonkey View Post
    Myself as a bike commuter I ride between the southside and downtown and climbing out of the river valley twice a day makes me appreciate the value of a light and fast bike.
    I agree that the river valley is a problem for all cyclists but there is a simple solution that they use in Norway. It is a bicycle lift that takes bikes, riders and pedestrians up a steep hill. Let me guess, someone is going to post that it would never work here because Norway doesn't have winter....







    Editing note, I don't know why the original pictures disappeared
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 24-07-2008 at 07:39 PM.
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    Climbing up from the river valley is part of the fun! OK, not always. I take the High Level, and even that hill on the south end is enough for me most days.

    In my opinion, the Paris style system wouldn't work here, but what I love about it, is that it shows focus and commitment to bicycle commuting. I see quite a few people every morning and evening. I think anyone who really commits to bike commuting will buy their own bike.

    We do need to do some public education, for drivers, riders, and pedestrians. Mostly the former two. Many drivers do not know or understand that I, as a cyclist, have a right to be on the road, just as they do, and a bike is considered a vehicle, just as a car is. That means I have the lane - the whole lane. I keep right if it's safe or reasonable, but sometimes it's neither.

    Every day I get cars (or trucks!) screaming past me, inches away, coming from behind me. Drivers need to understand that it's neither safe nor practical to move to the extreme right of a lane. There is gravel, potholes, and these weird "lines" filled in with some soft substance - perfect for sinking your wheel into, and forcing your bike off in their direction. Then there are sewer grates that stick out a couple of feet. If I need to swerve to miss them, I run the risk of riding into the path of someone I can't see coming up behind me. Bike vs Car - guess who loses?

    The safest way to bike on the streets is to ride where the right wheel of a car would be. This, obviously, forces the cars coming from behind to change lanes or slow down. I realize this angers some drivers, but it is my lane. What often happens instead is that cars scream past, barely missing me, and sometimes yelling at me to move right. I can't!

    All told, Edmonton drivers are great, but many aren't aware of the laws and rules. Don't get me started on the cyclists who behave badly (like the jerk who uses an airhorn [115 db] on pedestrian/bike paths, and thinks it's funny when people nearly jump out of their skins. Stick through the spokes anyone?).

    We need to educate people.
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    ^ 100%.

    Well, 99%...I have actually considered attaching an airhorn to my bike for telling cab drivers how I feel about their attitudes toward cyclists when they blow past me in my lane and then cut me off to turn right.

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    ^^ Bike lanes. They would make things so much simpler and safer (although you might have to spend a bit more time waiting at lights).

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    Bike lanes are indeed the best solution I could think of. If we commit to creating those, we will encourage many more people to ride. Lots of people I speak to don't commute or even ride now because they are afraid to.

    And as for airhorns, I think they are a very good idea. Just not for pedestrians! It's for cars with their windows rolled up, or stereos blaring, that aren't looking where they should be. The only problem, is that during an emergency, when they are most needed, your hands are often too busy on the brakes.
    aka Jim Good; "The sooner you fall behind, the more time you have to catch up." - Steven Wright

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    I am probably a horrible cycle commuter since I tend to switch between sidewalk and road alot. Mostly just in the core, and usually if it looks like I will have to pass a bus that is at a stop. Had one start moving out from the curb as I was coming even with the driver, scared the hell out of me and I am really twitchy passing them now. Otherwise I don't have to many issues. I do prefer to be on the sidewalk on 104 ave or 105/109 st, but otherwise I stick mostly to side streets and my commute is only 20 minutes with really bad lights and a leisurely pace.
    Last edited by Tiran; 25-07-2008 at 03:44 PM.

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    bike lanes on major routes to start. also one thing i notice while driving on 34 ave is that a lot of the cyclists dont realize that they are allowed to ride on the sidewalks cause they are wider, and there are signs that say its ok along that road. it would be nice if the signs were a bit more noticeable.

  29. #29

    Lightbulb Cycling Infrastructure | Discussion

    $100M city bike network unveiled
    --Ten-year plan would create 500-kilometre system

    Gordon Kent, The Edmonton Journal
    Published: 7:55 am July 26, 2008


    City planners want to lure more cyclists on to Edmonton streets with a $100-million proposal to build a network of marked lanes and trails, improve signs and require bicycle parking in new developments.

    The scheme, unveiled this week, would create a 489-kilometre system of high-volume routes along major roads by 2018 that would link to local connectors, as well as putting bike racks on all 906 transit buses instead of the current 100 and increasing rider-safety education campaigns.

    Link:
    http://www.canada.com/edmontonjourna...8-4186b712db98

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    That sounds really great... once again though, it's something that should've been done years ago, at a fraction of the cost. OH well, better late than never I suppose.

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    $100 million over 10 years is a lotta chedda though. And who knows how much that price will get inflated over time. I approve of the plan in principle, but I can see the usual suspects (SUN, Hennig, CHED, etc) having conniptions over the cost.

  32. #32

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    Agree this should have been done years ago and the cost will only be inflated over time. I honestly don't think it will happen for something that likely can't be used the whole year round.

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    Is there a way to do it $10 million at a time, over 10 years? I think the bike network is money well spent and having dedicated bike paths would really help.

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    Without seeing all of the details, I'm very happy to see the city taking cycling and bicycle commuting seriously. It is the most efficient form of transportation I'm aware of, and there are so many benefits - health, environmental, fiscal (as in no gas, parking, insurance, etc), reduction of traffic congestion, and less wear and tear on our roads to name a few.

    I really hope we can significantly increase the percentage of people who commute by bicycle. I think it should be the way of the future, and we need to be ready. I'm hoping this plan is a sign the City and citizens are starting to consider bike commuting as a viable option on an equal footing with automobiles and public transportation.
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  35. #35

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    As someone currently disgusted with the trolley debacle (as I see it, I will write it) I will only tentatively have my pessimism in council and the string pulling, inbred transportation department tempered.

    Face it, it's not just the trolley issue that's dividing even the non-NIMBY people, but the persistent doubt on the Department's WLRT and NLRT routings, and the 23rd ave interchange council price fiasco do not do much for the old confidence. Now that it really appears panhandling is on the decline, I think transportation planning is beginning to contend for public enemy number one. To their credit, they've been good on density, and much improved on social issues, design standards and cleanliness, but clearly transportation is their weakest, as well as most expensive point.

    [cue storm clouds on horizon of parade]

    "I'm glad we have the work to see what's needed to be done," Coun. Kim Krushell said Fri- day.
    "As sad as it is to say, I think this will take a back seat to other priorities. ... The price tag is not cheap."


    I'll gladly thank the rest of council for proving me wrong. Please don't cheap out on this, that's $100 million over ten years for a city wide, four hundred and eighty nine kilometre system. Take a millisecond to compare that to the system-wide charge for either LRT or the freeways for heaven's sake.

    It is cheap.
    Last edited by JayBee; 27-07-2008 at 06:21 AM. Reason: some text formatting.
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    Default

    The full details of the plan are here.

    This map shows the planned additions (without showing (much) of the existing trails.)
    Warning: huge vector graphic PDF, may take some time to render.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

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    How old is that map? It doesn't even show the SE portion of AHD.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    ... and the 23rd ave interchange council price fiasco ...
    "I'm glad we have the work to see what's needed to be done," Coun. Kim Krushell said Fri- day.
    "As sad as it is to say, I think this will take a back seat to other priorities. ... The price tag is not cheap."
    ...
    It is cheap.
    and for perspective, it wasn't the pricing of 23rd avenue or how it was handled that is the real issue. the issue is not having done it when it should have been. it is putting off things that will have to happen at some point no matter what else happens that is the issue.

    we are involved in the first phase of a project that will build out about 20-25% of the total project. that first phase will cost about one and half times the original budget for the complete project less than eight years ago. what on earth possesses councillors to think that municipal projects will be immune to this? does anyone really think they will be able to build a home or buy a car five years from now (or five years from anytime) for less than the current price?

    kim is right except it is not about price - it is about priorities. on far too many occasions in the past however, council's priorities have proven not to be the right ones, particularly when "price" got in the way of doing the right thing. i'm not sure we have gotten past that...
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    Well from my selfish perspective I'm just happy to see a plan from some E-W links in the downtown (100ave, 102ave and 105ave), and several ways to cross the yellowhead.

    I do find it strange that their map doesn't include 127st, which already has a dedicated bike lane. Oops, I guess?

    And things like this really annoy me:

    ...Edmonton already has 400 kilometres of wide curb lanes to accommodate cyclists, but most aren't marked.
    If they're not marked, then what's the point? Are cyclists expected to hunt around for all the streets that look like they might be wide enough? And are all the dually drivers supposed to recognize that that widened curb lane they're cruising through could be put to better use? Let's get some signs up and some lines painted, please.

  40. #40

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    I was working in Paris when this was introduced last year. It was fantastic. I used it to commute to work occasionally but it was difficult to rely on there always been a bike at every station going to the work areas of the city in the morning and a place to leave a bike at those areas. However, each station has a computer that tells you the nearest station, which are everywhere, with an available bike or parking spot. Although some, who were likely up before me, used it as a getting to work vehicle, I found it best used for going around the city in the evenings and on weekends when you were going to and from different locations, i.e. I still kept my monthly metro pass.

    To some who may think this was just for tourists, I would say the vast, vast majority of Velib riders were Parisians. If you're a tourist looking to ride around the city for the day, it was much cheaper to rent a regular bike for the day from the private providers. That's why Velib is free for only the first 30mins. It is intended for commuting around the city, most of which is within a 30min ride, not for a half day or full day tour of the city.

    I think it could work here if limited to the high density Oliver, downtown, whyte ave (between the U and Mill Creek), and university areas. Start in these areas with plenty of bikes and stations, add in some separated bike lanes on a few major streets and back it with a cool ad campaign and I think you would be surprised at how well this could work. If successful in these dense and well visited sections of the city, I think you could start adding stations in burbs that are well connected via bike paths to these areas

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    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    The full details of the plan are here.
    So the plan is fairly comprehensive... Good.

    I didn't see it in any of the plans, but is there anything planned to incorporate planned changes into some of the routine road and/or curb maintenance programs? What I mean is that if we already have plans to re-pave or fix roads/curbs, is there anything that we can do at the same time to the immediate vicinity to facilitate the development of the bike network?

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    Sweetcrude, bad suggestion if noticed by the city as it will now necessitate a years worth of study by an outside consultant to decide if it is possible.

    Common sense in my books though.

  43. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by etownboarder View Post
    How old is that map? It doesn't even show the SE portion of AHD.
    Probably a year or two. Current enough, as it shows the Henday ROW.

    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor
    and for perspective, it wasn't the pricing of 23rd avenue or how it was handled that is the real issue. the issue is not having done it when it should have been. it is putting off things that will have to happen at some point no matter what else happens that is the issue.
    Completely agreed. Had this bike system been done 8 years ago it too would have cost 33% less.

    But when you say it's a matter of priorities, are you saying that 1% of the commuters shouldn't get 1% of the dollars? We're only talking $10 million a year for ten years, and then the system will be complete.

    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled
    Well from my selfish perspective I'm just happy to see a plan from some E-W links in the downtown (100ave, 102ave and 105ave), and several ways to cross the yellowhead.
    Agreed. The plan looks excellent all round. It would truly enable citywide bicycle commuting and recreation alike.

    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled
    I do find it strange that their map doesn't include 127st, which already has a dedicated bike lane. Oops, I guess?
    If you're referring to the map I linked to, it only purports to show the proposed additions to the plan, as well as bits and pieces of the current plan ("MUTCS"). 127th street was done a couple decades before they even had a plan. It might be called a pilot project, except that there wasn't much pretence in ever following through.

    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled
    And things like this really annoy me:

    ...Edmonton already has 400 kilometres of wide curb lanes to accommodate cyclists, but most aren't marked.
    If they're not marked, then what's the point? Are cyclists expected to hunt around for all the streets that look like they might be wide enough? And are all the dually drivers supposed to recognize that that widened curb lane they're cruising through could be put to better use? Let's get some signs up and some lines painted, please.
    Actually if I'm not mistaken, that's exactly what they're proposing with this, for exactly the same reasons. It's as simple as painted lines on 400 of the 489 kilometers in question. That's the only way they could build 489 km of any kind of system for only $100 million, and likely $99 million of that is for the other 89 kilometres plus a few traffic signals which are needed to piece the system together. It's an extremely modest and doable proposal.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  44. #44

    Default Cyclists pumped about city's bike plan

    Cyclists pumped about city's bike plan

    Robin Collum, edmontonjournal.com
    Published: 11:58 am July 28, 2008

    Members of the local cycling community are excited by a recent proposal to make Edmonton a more bike-friendly city, and hope the city report's recommendations will be carried out.

    "We need just what they're talking about -- more bicycle trails, so you don't have to go into traffic with the cars," Don Chase, owner of Mill Woods Sports and Cycle, said Sunday.

    The Edmonton Bicycle Transportation Plan calls for the city to expand on existing infrastructure to create nearly 500 kilometres of marked bike lanes and trails.

    The plan would create a grid of bike-accessible routes throughout the city.

    Link:
    http://www.canada.com/edmontonjourna...8-fa2902ed1d24

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    I notice the map has missed my favorite widened curb lane (101 St). Perhaps because it unceremoniously ends just south of 106 Av? Or perhaps because it turns into parking after 6:00 (an hour too early IMHO).

    It would also be nice if the construction crews would leave a little space for bicycles when they close off lanes rather than shoving the barricades right out to the white line.

  46. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetcrude View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    The full details of the plan are here.
    So the plan is fairly comprehensive... Good.

    I didn't see it in any of the plans, but is there anything planned to incorporate planned changes into some of the routine road and/or curb maintenance programs? What I mean is that if we already have plans to re-pave or fix roads/curbs, is there anything that we can do at the same time to the immediate vicinity to facilitate the development of the bike network?
    Agreed, but I also can't find it written...

    I do recall that when the Multi Use Trail Corridor System was out (and approved) it was mentioned that at least snow-clearing would recieve top tier status (along with major and minor "primarily motor vehicle" arteries). I can't for the life of me recall if there was to be any kind of priority for road maintence.
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    So why is 100 avenue in the West End omitted - seems obvious with that wide grassy strip and the connection to the ravine?

    And what the heck is a sharrow?

    I don't like the "shared-use" lanes - all lanes are shared use - bicycles have every right to be in any lane. If the bike lane is not marked, it will be just as dangerous.

    The must be clearly marked

    Here's marked bike lane on Yates Street, downtown Victoria


    And another one - not sure where this one is


    and another
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    I visited Victoria earlier this month, and I thought that the bike lanes were a great idea.

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    ^absolutely. Safer for all cyclists, clearer to drivers, encouraging to new riders, and if well used, vastly cheaper to taxpayers than any other mode.

    Quote Originally Posted by lightrail View Post
    So why is 100 avenue in the West End omitted - seems obvious with that wide grassy strip and the connection to the ravine?
    I suspect the guiding concept was to produce a commuting grid on the flatter streets, avoiding the River Valley where practical.

    Also, the maps showing the concept tend not to show pre-existing trails, as they wouldn't have to be built as part of this plan. (There's a separate bike path there.) Note also that nothing in the River Valley shows up on their maps. I'm pretty certain they're not contemplating removing them.

    And what the heck is a sharrow?
    I had to look this up myself, but apparently it's what people in San Francisco call a diamond when painted on the street. Any other questions, don't ask me. It's San Francisco. That's all I can say.

    I don't like the "shared-use" lanes - all lanes are shared use - bicycles have every right to be in any lane. If the bike lane is not marked, it will be just as dangerous.

    The must be clearly marked
    The shared use lanes are supposed to only be for transit, taxis, and bicycles. I suspect it's a last resort where extra space isn't available and they still want bikes off the sidewalks, so they say "use the bus lanes and we'll paint a 'sharrow' on it for you." I believe the drivers are aware of these and are paid to tolerate it mercifully. At least I would hope so. I believe most of the ones in the proposed commuter system this would become are already in place, complete with "sharrows".
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  50. #50

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    I suspect the guiding concept was to produce a commuting grid on the flatter streets, avoiding the River Valley where practical.
    That's a good concept. I dislike it when I hear the city or others comment on the river valley trails as being part of the transportation system. For starters, few of the trails are efficient ways to get from A to B. Anyone who has ever travelled on the paths south of the river between Rundle Park and Cloverdale will know especially what I mean. The paths go up and down (some mean climbs here!) and meander back and forth. Great for recreation and exercise, but terrible for efficient travel.

    Plus, the river valley parks are closed from 11pm to 5am. It's hard to have a transportation system where the roads are closed at night!

    And what the heck is a sharrow?

    I had to look this up myself, but apparently it's what people in San Francisco call a diamond when painted on the street. Any other questions, don't ask me. It's San Francisco. That's all I can say.
    I could be wrong, but I think "sharrow" is a portmanteau of "shared lane" and "arrow". Ie; the sharrow is an arrow that shows cyclists which direction to travel?

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    Oh, now I get it, a Sharrow is a portmanteau. That clears that up.
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    Eschew vexatious obfuscation! Espouse elucidation!

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    Default Bike lane etiquette?

    With all this talk of sharrows, it reminded me that I don't understand why bike lanes are one-way.

    Two examples would be the one on 127st and the short one along Victoria Promenade, both of which are on one-way streets.

    But if I'm on a bike then I'm riding in the bikelane and I don't care which direction I'm going. Am I making a cyclist faux pas?

    And what's the passing etiquette? Do you stay close to the curb to let people pass you on the outside (traffic side)?

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    The example bike lanes you mention offer cyclists the ability to go in the opposite direction of an existing one-way street. Going the other way, you simply ride with the one-way vehicle traffic. You are only supposed to go one way in the bike lane, and in fact you would present a danger to other cyclists by going the wrong way.

    And yes, passing in a bike lane is tricky, but it's courteous to move as close as you can to the curb so that the passing cyclist doesn't have to veer into oncoming traffic to pass.
    Last edited by RTA; 30-07-2008 at 02:48 PM.

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    ^ I guess that I'm questioning the city's current use/implementation of bikelanes. Is the goal that I don't have to ride in traffic, or just that I don't have to ride into oncoming traffic?

    Because I don't want to ride in traffic, ever. So as far as I'm concerned a one-way bikelane is only half a bikelane.

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    I think those one-way lanes were a stop-gap (read: half-arsed) attempt at building a bike-friendly network. The city's priorities were clearly different when these we laid out, as opposed to this new plan.

    Though, I have to admit, when I lived in the Wellington area, 127 St. was pretty awesome for commuting downtown and back by bike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RTA View Post
    Though, I have to admit, when I lived in the Wellington area, 127 St. was pretty awesome for commuting downtown and back by bike.
    What route did you take after hitting 104 ave on your way downtown? I've seen bike path signs in the area of about 103 ave and 125 st, but they were confusing. Is there a good bike path all of the way downtown?
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    ^ Heading downtown I would usually turn left onto SPR, turn right on 123 St, then take a left onto 102 Ave. and take that all the way through. Or if I really wanted to get my heart racing, I would take 124 St. through the bend and all the way down Jasper Ave. (during rush hour of course).

    Heading back I would usually take 102 Ave. through to the path behind Original Joe's, then 104 Ave. to 127 St.

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    ^ 100ave/Victoria Promenade works too, as an alternative to all the stopsigns and parked cars that you get along 102ave (or 103ave, which I personally prefer over 102ave).

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    ^^ I hate that about 102 Av west of downtown as well. It's supposed to be a "bike route" but there's 4 4-way stops between downtown and MEC. A good bike route would have no stop signs, only yields where the other direction has right of way. Most cyclists treat stop signs like yield signs anyways, but occasionally cops with quotas to fill hand out tickets for that, and it's tricky at a 4-way.

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    Yeah, starting and stopping every block or two makes for a lousy bike path, especially if you clip into your pedals. I've often wondered whether the people responsible for designating bike paths actually ride at all, or if it's just an afterthought by a transportation department focused on cars.

    I'm excited about the new plan.
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  62. #62

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    Interesting idea, but the $3400 per bike cost is a bit rediculous, regardless if it has security systems, card readers, and makes espresso.

    It's cool to see Edmonton has a simular, if smaller program. My advice is to check the river valley, in the river, and cruise around the decrepit areas when looking for the bikes that have gone missing.

    Red Deer had a simular program when I was living there as a teenager 20 years ago. They spray painted the bikes bright flouescent yellow, and you could use one on the honor system. It was a mild success, until the bikes started dissapearing in large numbers.

    The first summer, a large number of the bikes (30+) were found thrown in the river from pedestrian bridges.

    The next year, a large number of the bikes were found in the garage and backyard of a downtown man. He was trying to remove the paint to resell the bikes.

    Also, later that summer while doing a volunteer city cleanup, a group I was with found a good number of the bikes in the bush on the north end of the city's river valley. Someone had a large fire and burnt them.

    You would think society is a bit more mature 20 years later for this kind of program to work, but the number of arsons in new residential developments tells me it isn't so.

    The lockbox system is a good idea. If they could introduce this program citywide with city rec centers and community leagues, it might be really something. Get the cost down, maybe simular to rec center fees of a few dollars.
    Last edited by blainehamilton; 31-07-2008 at 12:46 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blainehamilton View Post
    Interesting idea, but the $3400 per bike cost is a bit rediculous, regardless if it has security systems, card readers, and makes espresso.

    It's cool to see Edmonton has a simular, if smaller program. My advice is to check the river valley, in the river, and cruise around the decrepit areas when looking for the bikes that have gone missing.

    Red Deer had a simular program when I was living there as a teenager 20 years ago. They spray painted the bikes bright flouescent yellow, and you could use one on the honor system. It was a mild success, until the bikes started dissapearing in large numbers.

    The first summer, a large number of the bikes (30+) were found thrown in the river from pedestrian bridges.

    The next year, a large number of the bikes were found in the garage and backyard of a downtown man. He was trying to remove the paint to resell the bikes.

    Also, later that summer while doing a volunteer city cleanup, a group I was with found a good number of the bikes in the bush on the north end of the city's river valley. Someone had a large fire and burnt them.

    You would think society is a bit more mature 20 years later for this kind of program to work, but the number of arsons in new residential developments tells me it isn't so.

    The lockbox system is a good idea. If they could introduce this program citywide with city rec centers and community leagues, it might be really something. Get the cost down, maybe simular to rec center fees of a few dollars.
    and it would beat the bicycle sharing program in the news this morning from vancouver - you know, the one where you buy a bike and someone else steals it to sell to someone else to use it...
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    One difference between Edmonton and Paris bike laws is that here we are required to wear a helmet - not so in Paris.

    So, for this system to really work here, we'd either need to relax helmet laws, or people would need to walk around with their helmets.

    OOPS - I guess here the law applies to everyone under 17, and adults are encouraged to wear a helmet.
    Last edited by Jimbo; 31-07-2008 at 09:51 PM.
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  65. #65

    Default CBC Story "Vicious Cycle"

    The CBC had an excellent news program last night called "Vicious Cycle" which had three segments. http://www.cbc.ca/national/blog/spec...cle/index.html


    One on Bike theft where they actually confronted a bike thief in the act in Vancouver. The story delt with the issue of theft and how it hampers people's desire to use their bikes. This is one good reason that the Paris system works. The rented bikes are not as desirable and harder to sell than personal bikes and if your rental is stolen, just rent another one.


    The second story was about how many commuters use bikes in Saskatoon which contradicts the issue of other posters that Edmonton is too cold.


    The third is about a family in Toronto who are leaving the minivan at home and use their bikes for most of their activities.

    It is an important demonstration that peoples' travel patterns are not just for commuting. The majority of travel is for other needs beyond commuting. Commuting only accounts for about 25% of the travel. Shopping, school, errands, groceries, visiting and entertainment are more common travel needs.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

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    I am especially keen on the plan that puts bike lanes on 82 street all the way from the north edge of the city down to the LRT bike path! I must mention that I'll only like it if they make it a bike lane that allows you to go through intersections like cars. If they make it like Castle Downs Road's bike path, I probably won't use it for commuting. On the CDR bike path there are signs to dismount at every intersection because cars would hit any bicyclist using that bike path who doesn't get off!

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    Lightbulb Bike Lockers--would they work here?

    I just got back from Kelowna, and noticed the bike lockers they have in their downtown and transit areas. . .

    http://www.kelowna.ca/CM/Page1059.aspx

    Something to think about here?

    (N.B. Mods, please move this if it's in the wrong place, thanks.)

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    Hmmm, interesting... but it seems like a lot of space used up just to store one bike. Who is supposed to use these? Are they leased so only the person leasing the locker is able to use them? Or can anyone use them? I think a stand to lock bikes at works good enough... these things would be vandalized so quickly and people would likely try to sleep in them or something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by etownboarder View Post
    Hmmm, interesting... but it seems like a lot of space used up just to store one bike. Who is supposed to use these? Are they leased so only the person leasing the locker is able to use them? Or can anyone use them? I think a stand to lock bikes at works good enough... these things would be vandalized so quickly and people would likely try to sleep in them or something.
    Looks like you rent them by the month for $10.00, and FWIW the ones my wife and I saw were clean and in good condition. As for who uses them, I suppose it would depend where they are. As for space, consider that, from my estimates, enough lockers for eight bikes (each locker holds two separate bikes) takes up about one standard parking space. That's not a bad ratio, IMHO.

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    On a recent trip to Europe I visited Amsterdam. They have a huge percentage of their citizens on bikes. Here is a 4 level bicycle parkade. Most bikes I am told were not locked and the percentage of theft is very low. Different cities / different situations. Of course, sadly this would never work here... just another target for graffiti. Deep sigh

    I'm having people over later to stare at their phones,if you want to drop by

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    Mount Royal College in Calgary also has bike lockers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by etownboarder View Post
    ... I think a stand to lock bikes at works good enough... these things would be vandalized so quickly and people would likely try to sleep in them or something.
    It does seem a lot of space, but I'd like to see this. I'd rent one tomorrow if they had these in Edmonton. The stands aren't enough Downtown. Check out what's left of the bike on the SE corner of City Centre Mall. Pretty much all that's left is the frame. It's been there for a few days. Who wants to walk around with their seat, bell, lights, seat bags, wheels, pedals, and anything else they can strip from a bike? Bike theft by the bums is the reason I'm rarely downtown these days, though I like downtown.

    I'm in Vancouver right now. I was told there is a bike theft network that ships bikes stolen in Edmonton and Calgary to Vancouver, and vice versa.

    Bike theft is so bad now, I think the Police need to pay more attention to this growing problem. There should be a worldwide website where you can register your SN# - for free, or very low cost.
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    Quote Originally Posted by etownboarder View Post
    Hmmm, interesting... but it seems like a lot of space used up just to store one bike. Who is supposed to use these? Are they leased so only the person leasing the locker is able to use them? Or can anyone use them? I think a stand to lock bikes at works good enough... these things would be vandalized so quickly and people would likely try to sleep in them or something.
    These bike lockers are also at most Skytrain and West Coast Express and Park and Ride stations around Metro Vancouver, we also have them in Greater Victoria at bus exchanges and park and ride lots. They're secure lockers. They are actually triangular in shape, with access from both sides, so each "cube" actually is two lockers. They're rented monthly for those who want secure place to lock up their bikes. Bike racks are also available, obviously for no charge.

    We also have bike racks on all the buses, trolley buses and community buses in Vancouver and in Victoria, so you can also take the bike on the bus with you - each bus can handle two bikes and they're well used. Bikes are also allowed on Skytrain, Seabus and West Coast Express.

    Here's bike lockers at Victoria International Airport. There's also an assembly station next door to the lockers so when you arrive with a bike, you can assemble and ride away on the bike paths from the Airport to Victoria
    Last edited by lightrail; 06-09-2008 at 01:00 AM.
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    Anyone know much they cost?
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    I don't know how much they cost, either to rent, or to supply.

    I checked out a couple at the Stadium SkyTrain station in Van. The transit guy said they had them for a couple of months. No reports of any vandalism or theft, but he said bikes were stolen from the adjacent bike racks "all of the time".

    He did report one guy tried to live in one, and was "evicted" when he tried to light a fire. Duh.

    I'd really like to see these in downtown Edmonton, but I can't see it being $10/mo as I believe was mentioned earlier. I can't even rent a locker at the gym for that. Hope it would be affordable though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    I don't know how much they cost, either to rent, or to supply.

    I checked out a couple at the Stadium SkyTrain station in Van. The transit guy said they had them for a couple of months. No reports of any vandalism or theft, but he said bikes were stolen from the adjacent bike racks "all of the time".

    He did report one guy tried to live in one, and was "evicted" when he tried to light a fire. Duh.

    I'd really like to see these in downtown Edmonton, but I can't see it being $10/mo as I believe was mentioned earlier. I can't even rent a locker at the gym for that. Hope it would be affordable though.
    In vancouver, bike lockers are rented on three month contracts for $30 (so, $10 per month).

    Here's a link to the website

    http://www.translink.bc.ca/Transport...ransit-Map.asp
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    One reason why I ask about the cost is because I'm wondering if my condo building should buy these bike lockers and rent them out. I keep my bike inside my suite so a bike locker will save me some space.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    That's a really good idea actually... buildings should buy these thins and rent them out so you don't need to use up space in your suite, and allows you to safely keep your bike where you wouldn't normally feel safe to leave it locked up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lightrail View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    I don't know how much they cost, either to rent, or to supply.

    I checked out a couple at the Stadium SkyTrain station in Van. The transit guy said they had them for a couple of months. No reports of any vandalism or theft, but he said bikes were stolen from the adjacent bike racks "all of the time".

    He did report one guy tried to live in one, and was "evicted" when he tried to light a fire. Duh.

    I'd really like to see these in downtown Edmonton, but I can't see it being $10/mo as I believe was mentioned earlier. I can't even rent a locker at the gym for that. Hope it would be affordable though.
    In vancouver, bike lockers are rented on three month contracts for $30 (so, $10 per month).

    Here's a link to the website

    http://www.translink.bc.ca/Transport...ransit-Map.asp
    Yeah, I checked it out. I guess they subsidize the cost of the lockers by selling advertising on the sides of the locker.

    This is a great idea!!! I hope we do it here ASAP. Security of my bike is by far the #1 reason I rarely shop downtown or patronize the restaurants these days. In fact today I want to go to the new WHC gym, but I'm nervous about my bike, so I'll probably go to the west and.

    I wonder how they police it regarding people using it for other purposes?

    Or maybe they should also do some for other purposes? If I was homeless, this would be a great place to store my stuff.

    Here's the answer to my own question, from the contract:

    "I agree to use the locker only for the purpose of storing a bicycle and cycling-related clothing and equipment that can be reasonably contained in the locker. I agree any other use may result in automatic termination of this agreement or other legal action."
    &
    "I am aware that TransLink may from time to time require access to the locker for maintenance and repair and I agree to provide such access upon 24 hours notice. In an emergency, TransLink may gain access to the locker without notice. I agree that TransLink may periodically inspect the locker to ensure that it is being used by me in accordance with the terms of this agreement"
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    In Vancouver Washington and Portland it seems they have these too, paid for with a debit card.

    http://bikeportland.org/2006/06/21/v...-bike-lockers/

    One little wrinkle: "They were paid for through state and federal grants totalling over $16,000"

    I sure hope we do this ASAP!

    Here's a link to a company that builds them.
    http://www.bikelink.org/
    aka Jim Good; "The sooner you fall behind, the more time you have to catch up." - Steven Wright

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    I fully support these, as long as they're put somewhere appropriate (i.e. we don't have a dozen of them lined up along Jasper Ave), they're a different color than beige, and the rental cost isn't boosted to $80/month.

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    Thumbs up

    Here's a link to a very informative pdf that details the lockers with pictures, statistics, options, etc:
    http://elocktech.com/docs/BikeLink%2...2002.12.08.pdf
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    Here's another pdf from a different company that's had them for 20 years. This is the company that does the ones in Vancouver. And Amsterdam.
    http://www.cyclesafe.com/UserFiles/F...CSBrochure.pdf

    BTW, they come in other colours besides beige.

    Checking the net (google "bike locker"), it seems many cities have these. $10/mo is the high end for renting them. Some places it's half of that. Some cities they've proven so popular there are waiting lists.

    You can fit 9 in a standard parking spot (enough for 18 bikes). I think this may be misleading, as I'd guess you'd need empty space on each side for access. There are also ones that fit the bikes vertically, and double-decker ones.

    Seems like we're way behind on this.

    Big Bear, I mean Molson Park would be ideal for some of these.
    Last edited by Jimbo; 08-09-2008 at 12:05 PM.
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    While I still maintain it would be a good idea to have some of the bike lockers found in cities like Vancouver in a place like Molson Park (behind the library), the Bell Tower currently provide bike lockers (the vertical ones) on their main floor storage area. Rental cost is $20/mo. I'm signing up, and anyone else who's interested can contact Oxford Properties.

    Now I can go to the gym, go shopping, go to a restaurant, whatever ..., without being afraid my bike will be vandalized or stolen.

    I'll be downtown every day now, most likely, because I love it there! This makes a big difference for me.

    By the way, there is also free bike parking in the parkade by the north entrance to City Centre Mall (Eaton Centre). There is an attendant 10 feet away, but when I asked, she said she thought it wasn't a good idea to park there. as there were many thefts. Looking around at the druggies/alkies in the vicinity, I saw what she meant. After all, it's 1/2 block from the Grand and the Bus Depot.

    Oh well. I'm going to be covered.
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    Locking it down – special event bike parking goes valet
    By Cecilia Greyson

    Finding secure parking for your bike can be a big hassle, especially if you’re attending an event that attracts many other cyclists. With crowds of other two-wheelers locked to every available rack, many have to hitch their precious bicycles to flimsy signposts and chain-link fences, crossing their fingers that their bikes will still be standing, and not stolen, when they return.
    But local event organizers and cycling advocates are behind an innovative solution to the problem: valet bike parking. Operating like a coat check, bikes are parked in an enclosed, secure corral, with volunteers or staff standing guard. When the cyclist returns and hands in a numbered ticket, their bike is returned, safe and sound.

    “People are worried about having their bikes stolen, and where they can park,” says Sarah Albertson, Special Project Co-ordinator for Better Environmentally Sound Transportation. Inspired by initiatives in San Francisco and New York, BEST started valet bike parking as part of their “Going Active” initiative, bringing custom bike racks to events and festivals around Vancouver since June.

    But it’s not just cyclists who are benefiting from valet bike parking. Event organizers are learning that encouraging festival patrons to use alternative transportation can ease their own limited parking. The Vancouver Canadians’ organizers at Nat Bailey Stadium, for example, offered a two-for-one ticket price if you used BEST’s valet bike service located near the entrance. “They’ve been great,” says Albertson. “They’ve been doing a lot to encourage people to take the bus, walk, or ride their bikes.”

    Other local event organizers also understand that providing secure bike parking is an inexpensive way to boost attendance where there is limited car access. The Vancouver Folk Music Festival, for example, has offered bike parking for approximately 15 years. “We lock up about 3,000 bikes over the weekend,” says Heather Knox, the Folk Festival’s Community Development Co-ordinator. “When my daughter was young, that’s how I got to the festival every year – I knew my bike and trailer would be safe.”

    But while it’s a great solution that’s been a long time coming, valet bike parking is challenging to set up, especially in downtown Vancouver. “It’s been a nightmare,” admits Tannis Braithwaite when she describes co-ordinating bike parking for Vancouver’s annual “Bike Shorts: International Cycling Cinema” night. After complaints from venue owners when bicycles were “locked to everything in sight” during the first year of the event, Braithwaite tried to find an alternative.
    Instead of renting racks, Braithwaite initially asked city engineers to designate two parking meters as bike parking, but that solution couldn’t accommodate the number of cyclists attending the event. “Bikes were piled up like a giant Christmas tree,” laughs Braithwaite.
    Needing more space and unable to use the venue’s courtyard without liability insurance, Braithwaite tested other options. “I had been told that there were two problems with event parking,” she states. “Number one, the city won’t let you do it, and number two, no one will rent you racks ... I was told you need permission from the city to put racks on city property, and you’ll never get permission from the city.”

    Undaunted, Braithwaite laboriously measured the sidewalk outside the venue and then called the city’s Streets Administration office. “The person there told me there’s no room because of the bus shelter on the sidewalk,” recalls Braithwaite. “Since temporary parking has to be directly in front of the venue, we couldn’t even move it a few feet over.”

    Frustrated, Braithwaite applied for street closure, which would enable her to place racks on the sidewalk. Finally, she wrote to the city and complained about the situation. “From a legal perspective, it’s problematic that city staff are making those decisions without guidance from council,” says Braithwaite, a lawyer herself.

    “I found out that there’s a policy for permanent parking, but not for temporary parking.”
    Finally, after approaching the Bicycle Advisory Committee and working with other cycling advocates, Braithwaite’s cause was supported by the City of Vancouver’s Engineering and Special Events departments. On July 18, 2006, city council approved a resolution to spend $6,000 on bike racks that will be used for temporary bike parking at special events.
    It’s a measure that cycling advocates like Albertson and Braithwaite approve of. “The city has been really supportive of what we’ve been doing,” says Albertson.

    ------------------
    A bit dated, but still topical

    If you want to get secure bike parking/storage in Edmonton, get a group together and lobby City Council. Hopefully, they'll be as forward thinking as Vancouver Council. Vancouver also amended its bylaws and now requires secure bike parking in all new developments, including charging stations for electric bikes. And Translink supports cyclist through the bike locker programs at transit stations, allowing bikes on all buses (including the trolley buses and smaller community buses), Skytrain, West Coast Express and SeaBus at no charge.
    Last edited by lightrail; 17-09-2008 at 01:27 AM.
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    I'm starting to get in touch with members of city council and admin in this regard. They have proven to be quite progressive where bikes are concerned in the recent past. They may not be aware of the extent of the theft problem, and the negative effect it's having on bike commuting.

    I'll be emailing city councillors a link to this thread.

    Thanks for the article.
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    Montreal is going to be the first one in Canada to have a large scale bike rental program. Kind of neat how the program is paid for by street parking revenue.

    http://www.cbc.ca/canada/montreal/st...ixi-bikes.html.
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  88. #88

    Default Top 50 new inventions of 2008

    Montreal's bike system is rated at #19 of the top 50 new inventions of 2008 in Time Magazine


    http://www.time.com/time/specials/pa...854146,00.html
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  89. #89

    Thumbs up Council asked for $100M for bike paths

    Council asked for $100M for bike paths

    12:30pm
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    2/26/2009

    A new report that outlines what is needed to expand and enhance Edmonton's bicycle network brings a 10-year price tag that is over $100 million.

    Stantec put together the bicycle transportation plan that links many bike paths that now are disjointed. Getting from one point to another isn't always possible.

    "I don't think this is a luxury," says Coun. Ben Henderson. "There's a substantial increase in the number of people who are riding their bikes year round. It's not that big of a deal."

    Councillor Bryan Anderson, however, says once you get other spending priorities stacked up against this, it's a different story.

    "Active transportation and bicycle path/road expenses will be hard fought," he says. "There'll be a lot of discussion as each budget comes up."

    Anderson says the best way to go about this is to do small parts of the plan, when other spending happens at the same time, like with neighborhood rehab.

    The report goes to council's Transportation Committee next Tuesday.
    Link:
    http://www.630ched.com/Channels/Reg/...spx?ID=1066750

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    This is the sort of clean energy spending that I think is good for the city.
    We are all the same, just different...

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    This is something I'd support, for purely selfish reasons
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  92. #92

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    I'd still rather see $100M spent turning any one of the intersections on Yellowhead into an overpass, and can guarantee it would benefit a far greater portion of our population.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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    Well if there's 500,000 taxpayers in this city, the bill comes to $20 a year for 10 years per taxpayer. I think that having good bike paths is worth this price tag!!!!

  94. #94

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    Is putting an overpass on Yellowhead the new "what about the potholes" mantra?

    As a cyclist, of course I'm happy to hear this news!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chmilz View Post
    I'd still rather see $100M spent turning any one of the intersections on Yellowhead into an overpass, and can guarantee it would benefit a far greater portion of our population.
    Cleaner air benefits everybody.
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    Removing the traffic jams due to traffic signals WILL greatly reduce emissions, moreso than having a few more people peddle to work a few times a year when it's nice out. I can't use a bicycle for work and live close enough to current bike paths so I may be biased.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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    I wonder how extensive this bike path construction would be? I agree there are some areas that dearly need a bike path to connect other path's together. In particular there needs to be a path built from 23rd ave to 34th ave along 91 st. From 34th north there is a path all the way to millcreek ravine.
    LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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    Some of the needed connections and improvements are very short and shouldn't be too expensive. For example, the path through Railtown terminates at 110 St just south of 104 Av. Continuing north on 110 St is an excellent way to cross 104 Av, but once across and past the MacEwan parkade entrance one runs into a fence! It's only 50 more metres across an open field to 105 Av, where cyclists could then use the low volume residential streets.
    Another example on the same path is the section just south of Jasper Av. The old rail bridge would have made a perfect path if it was left in place, but it wasn't so the path again heads to 110 St. Here there is a counter-flow bike lane (on the wrong side of the road) for southbound cyclists that is completely useless half of the year because the snow isn't cleared and can't be packed by cars. The smart solution would have been (and still is) to widen the existing 20 m sidewalk as a multi-use trail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chmilz View Post
    Removing the traffic jams due to traffic signals WILL greatly reduce emissions, moreso than having a few more people peddle to work a few times a year when it's nice out. I can't use a bicycle for work and live close enough to current bike paths so I may be biased.
    Just wondering - why can't you use a bike to get to work? I'm aware there are a number of good reasons. But for many, it's perceived as unsafe, inconvenient, too difficult (as in cycling over difficult terrain or ice/snow never cleared in winter), or there's too many barriers/too much traffic.

    25,000 is how many trips the City estimates are made by bike each day (I think it's a 2005 estimate). There was an increase of 150% between 1994 and 2005. Just going from my own experience and feeling regarding the numbers, I'm guessing the number of people cycling has increased significantly since, perhaps due to increased focus on environmental issues. There is an increasing demand for alternative means of transportation for sure.

    We will never be able to reduce our reliance on the automobile (and all of the costs that go along with it) if we don't offer attractive alternatives.

    Many of us continue to commute through the winter, even when it's cold out, like today. It would be a heck of a lot more popular if it was easier and safer.

    To quote Councillor Don Iveson (from VUE weekly): "we need to diversify our transportation patterns in the city to reduce our emissions and potentially even achieve some good public health outcomes with more people cycling and walking and so on."

    Which raises another interesting point - many of the paths referred to as bike paths in this proposal are actually multi-use, and are likely to be used by at least as many pedestrians as cyclists.

    Of course this isn't an either/or situation. It's not bike paths vs Yellowhead overpass. I'd like to see us really focus on encouraging cycling as a means of alternative transportation, and I'm very pleased to see this proposal considered by our council.

    Maybe someday it won't be viewed so much as an alternative means of transportation, but as mainstream.
    Last edited by Jimbo; 26-02-2009 at 05:56 PM. Reason: clarity
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    And if more people cycled, traffic congestion would ease on the Yellowhead and other busy roads! Also I think we might save healthcare costs from cyclists injured, not to mention reducing hardships on family and friends of injured or deceased cyclists... all benefits of having better paths... there were several cyclist deaths last year.

    I'm even considering moving to a different area that has better bike path access for safety reasons - for me and my family. I don't like taking my two infants in a bike trailer on a major road, but many times a major road is the only way to get somewhere.

    ^Seeing pictures of bike parkades in Holland makes it seem like bike travel is mainstream in some places!
    Last edited by Escondido; 26-02-2009 at 05:52 PM.

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